Are you "writing off the season" at 3-2?

[JoeSixPat]

Joe, take your heart medication, because I'm about to agree with you on something.....

One thing this team has had during this historic run as been a pit bull mentality. Whether or not the team was having a good game, the one thing the fans could nearly always count on was that the Patriots would be the more physical team. It wasn't a 100% certainty, but it was pretty close to that.

This team looks as if it's lost that tenacity. The two most physical teams they've faced have both been able to impose their will upon the Patriots' lines, and that's something I think the big uglies need to address.

I agree - and was wondering if there's any way to restore some of that... along those lines I was thinking about Seau's quotes about wanting to return to the team. And while I don't know how much he has left in the tank, and think that depth at DB is a higher priority than at LB, I'm wondering if adding Seau to the locker room might have that desired effect.

I can just see Seau coming into the locker room, having been gone since last year - looking around and saying "WTF" to his teammates and giving a pep talk or two (if indeed that's called for)

Someone like Seau might add one of those intangible elements to the locker room that makes a world of difference. But I'll trust in BB on that one as well.

 

[Scouse Patriot]

It's lunacy to totaly write the season off this early but we have a sh!t load to work on if we are to achieve anything respectable. Getting a bit of our composure and mentality back would be a start. This team at the moment is playing like it's just going through the motions at times.

 

[Bobs My Uncle]

I have written the team off a serious SB combatant.

I have not written the team off as a possible playoff entry.

 

[JoeSixPat]

It's surprising to me that there's as many as 20% of fans who are writing off the season - but judging from the comments I understand why

It's not that they are "bad fans" - just the simple belief that what we see is what we got when it comes to the team - mediocrity, with many posters expressing concern with what appears to be less passion than they've seen from this team in the past.

I think the team can wake up from that funk at any time they choose - and can pull together and recapture some of that underdog energy from 2001 and at other times.

But if they don't do that, and continue to play mediocre football, as 20% of the respondants to this poll seem to believe, I can't say I'll be surprised either.

 

[PATSYLICIOUS]

How many people in 2001 (2-3) or 2003 (3-2) truly thought we could be a super bowl contending team at this point in those seasons? ALOT can change from now until January, heck alot can change from now till next Monday. This league is wide open. Did I just watch a bunch of scrubs get blown out last night against a horrible Cleveland team? Oh wait, those were the world champion and #1 ranked on most power polls New York Giants. We can beat any team on any Sunday, if we can string some wins together and get into a rhythm our chances are as good as any team in the league, given the experience we have and the HC we have.

 

[PATRIOT64]

How many people in 2001 (2-3) or 2003 (3-2) truly thought we could be a super bowl contending team at this point in those seasons? ALOT can change from now until January, heck alot can change from now till next Monday. This league is wide open. Did I just watch a bunch of scrubs get blown out last night against a horrible Cleveland team? Oh wait, those were the world champion and #1 ranked on most power polls New York Giants. We can beat any team on any Sunday, if we can string some wins together and get into a rhythm our chances are as good as any team in the league, given the experience we have and the HC we have.

Unfortunately where the 'experience' lacks big time is with the most important influential position on the team....Quarterback

ANY other position in football you can fill in most holes - with the RARE exception of Tennessee and other rare QB backup success like Brady in 2001,you can't replace the starting QB and maintain solid performance consistently.

 

[PATSYLICIOUS]

Unfortunately where the 'experience' lacks big time is with the most important influential position on the team....Quarterback

ANY other position in football you can fill in most holes - with the RARE exception of Tennessee and other rare QB backup success like Brady in 2001,you can't replace the starting QB and maintain solid performance consistently.

Here's the playoff experience of some QB's that have recently gone into the playoffs and performed admirably, if not won a SB:
Brady - none
Warner - none
Johnson (My memory escapes me of how many playoff appearances he had with Minnesota, but none were as significant as an NFC championship or Super bowl)
Dilfer - none
Delhomme - none
Eli and Ben - 1 postseason appearance each before going all the way.

Not saying Cassel will do the same, but QB's dont have to be experienced to have success. The people around him have all been there though, IMO that can make a difference which was the point of my post.

 

[PATRIOT64]

Here's the playoff experience of some QB's that have recently gone into the playoffs and performed admirably, if not won a SB:
Brady - none
Warner - none
Johnson (My memory escapes me of how many playoff appearances he had with Minnesota, but none were as significant as an NFC championship or Super bowl)
Dilfer - none
Delhomme - none
Eli and Ben - 1 postseason appearance each before going all the way.

Not saying Cassel will do the same, but QB's dont have to be experienced to have success. The people around him have all been there though, IMO that can make a difference which was the point of my post.

I was not referring to PLAYOFF experience,I am referring to regular season experience

To be honest I don't think there is a realistic realm of possibility that this team with Cassel unable to throw the ball consistently can pull off a string of 3 or more wins together - I can see W-L-W-L-W-L all season long,thats why I think 8-8 is a likely finish - I hope you are right but after 2 blowouts in 3 weeks I cannot see a sudden surge of 3+ wins in a row like a sudden miracle cloud flew over the team and changed it overnight. -


This is NOT 2001 - Cassel is NOT Brady - O'Neal,Hobbs and Meriweather are NOT Ty Law,Lawyer Milloy and Otis Smith

 

[PATSYLICIOUS]

I was not referring to PLAYOFF experience,I am referring to regular season experience

To be honest I don't think there is a realistic realm of possibility that this team with Cassel unable to throw the ball consistently can pull off a string of 3 or more wins together - I can see W-L-W-L-W-L all season long,thats why I think 8-8 is a likely finish - I hope you are right but after 2 blowouts in 3 weeks I cannot see a sudden surge of 3+ wins in a row like a sudden miracle cloud flew over the team and changed it overnight.

I see what you're saying. It's definately hard to see a winning streak with this team right now. But you have to consider the state of the NFL right now. Every week is a winnable game, if you build a swagger things start going your way and winning becomes alot easier. This team has enough winners on it to get something going.

 

[muzz]

Here's the playoff experience of some QB's that have recently gone into the playoffs and performed admirably, if not won a SB:
Brady - none
Warner - none
Johnson (My memory escapes me of how many playoff appearances he had with Minnesota, but none were as significant as an NFC championship or Super bowl)
Dilfer - none
Delhomme - none
Eli and Ben - 1 postseason appearance each before going all the way.

Not saying Cassel will do the same, but QB's dont have to be experienced to have success. The people around him have all been there though, IMO that can make a difference which was the point of my post.

OK, I'll play along.

Brady just has "it", and he had less to deal with.
Warner- Awesome OC with all-star players all around him- also a VVG QB, even today
Johnson- VVG team around him, had done well before.
Dilfer- Game manager- AWESOME/Stifling defensive squad
Delhomme- Very Solid team around him
Eli and Ben- Both guys played on solid teams, Eli's Giants were the best Defense when it really mattered, Ben was dreadful, and they still won it.

We still have a shot, but things had better get alot better, and quick.

 

[NJPatsfan26]

I see what you're saying. It's definately hard to see a winning streak with this team right now. But you have to consider the state of the NFL right now. Every week is a winnable game, if you build a swagger things start going your way and winning becomes alot easier. This team has enough winners on it to get something going.

Agree completely. We have the talent on our team to get back into a grove and start winning some games.

I think the next 3 games will really prove that fact or destroy it.

 

[PATRIOT64]

I see what you're saying. It's definately hard to see a winning streak with this team right now. But you have to consider the state of the NFL right now. Every week is a winnable game, if you build a swagger things start going your way and winning becomes alot easier. This team has enough winners on it to get something going.

Patsy, thats pretty much the only reason why I think NE could sneak in as a #6 seed is because it IS a season of no real dominating teams in either conference and it is not impossible that a team that is 9-7 could be a WC team - In the past 9-7 would not come anywhere near a playoff berth,It could this year.

Even the Titans will lose 5 or 6 games this year when the dust settles

The best teams in each conference right now IMO would be New Orleans and Pittsburgh - The Steelers are better than the Titans despite more losses - Championship teams are made up of teams that refuse to lose and the Steelers have shown the biggest hearts in the NFL with those 2 fantastic wins that they refused to lose in the past 2 weeks and New Orleans is a team like the 2007 Patriots where the defense is O.K. but not really that good but does not have to be since the offense is a scoring machine.

 

[PATSYLICIOUS]

OK, I'll play along.

Brady just has "it", and he had less to deal with.
Warner- Awesome OC with all-star players all around him- also a VVG QB, even today
Johnson- VVG team around him, had done well before.
Dilfer- Game manager- AWESOME/Stifling defensive squad
Delhomme- Very Solid team around him
Eli and Ben- Both guys played on solid teams, Eli's Giants were the best Defense when it really mattered, Ben was dreadful, and they still won it.

We still have a shot, but things had better get alot better, and quick.

Alot of those guys had solid teams around them WHEN it mattered. Aside from Warner none of those teams were playing high level football the entire season. In fact I clearly remember Ben and Eli's on the brink of elimination with a few weeks left to go in the season. Dilfer's Raven's were 4-4 or something like that at one point.

You're right things have to get better. You never know, but I'm holding out hope they will.

 

[Sivy]

It's surprising to me that there's as many as 20% of fans who are writing off the season - but judging from the comments I understand why

It's not that they are "bad fans" - just the simple belief that what we see is what we got when it comes to the team - mediocrity, with many posters expressing concern with what appears to be less passion than they've seen from this team in the past.

I think the team can wake up from that funk at any time they choose - and can pull together and recapture some of that underdog energy from 2001 and at other times.

But if they don't do that, and continue to play mediocre football, as 20% of the respondants to this poll seem to believe, I can't say I'll be surprised either.

why dont people understand that there is a difference between 2001 and this season, and its name is Brady.

 

[MoLewisrocks]

why dont people understand that there is a difference between 2001 and this season, and its name is Brady.

Maybe because they grasp that in 2001 there were as few who remotely realized what Brady was at that time as there are today who believe Cassel might yet have enough of it to make a season of it yet. Hindsight is not only 20/20, it's often full of revisionist BS... I know from reading here that while I felt at the time I was one of the few who saw the potential in Brady in week 10 of 2001 when Bill named him the starter for the rest of the season, some here today would lead me to believe I was just one of the gazillions back then who recognized IT from day 1... And the legion of Bledsoe supporters who wanted him back even on the eve of a Superbowl not to mention thereafter were apparently just a figment of collective imaginations at the time...

 

[Sivy]

Maybe because they grasp that in 2001 there were as few who remotely realized what Brady was at that time as there are today who believe Cassel might yet have enough of it to make a season of it yet. Hindsight is not only 20/20, it's often full of revisionist BS... I know from reading here that while I felt at the time I was one of the few who saw the potential in Brady in week 10 of 2001 when Bill named him the starter for the rest of the season, some here today would lead me to believe I was just one of the gazillions back then who recognized IT from day 1... And the legion of Bledsoe supporters who wanted him back even on the eve of a Superbowl not to mention thereafter were apparently just a figment of collective imaginations at the time...

No one really could have known how great brady was gonna be, except for those who followed his college career when he "traded" time with some douche high school start. But there is basically NO WAY we could have known he'd become the greatest to ever play the game, you can say "I was one of the few" all you want but that doesnt make it true. Yea, you could have thought he was gonna be darn good, but as good as he is, I dont think so. As far as cassel goes, I look at it like this, Someone like Brady comes along once in a lifetime, the chances of cassel being that good are so slim its not worth even talking about. Go ahead though, keep hopin. Like I said, I hope I'm wrong.

 

[NYCPatsFan]

No one really could have known how great brady was gonna be, except for those who followed his college career when he "traded" time with some douche high school start. But there is basically NO WAY we could have known he'd become the greatest to ever play the game, you can say "I was one of the few" all you want but that doesnt make it true. Yea, you could have thought he was gonna be darn good, but as good as he is, I dont think so. As far as cassel goes, I look at it like this, Someone like Brady comes along once in a lifetime, the chances of cassel being that good are so slim its not worth even talking about. Go ahead though, keep hopin. Like I said, I hope I'm wrong.

No argument that none could have known TB was going to be this great but you got to give BB (and I guess Charlie) the credit.

Remember the anger and extreme reactions that BB evoked across NE when he disclosed in a live interview on CBS (back in '01) that he was going with Brady all the way and not Bledsoe??

I remember being shocked on hearing it and felt sorry for Bledsoe because we are all expecting Bledose to continue once he was ok. I think even Bledose came to know about this only after the telecast. I hoped at that time that BB had a good reason behind it but couldn't figure out how the friggin h*** he could give the reigns to a QB down in the depth chart. Boy, am I glad that BB didn't listen to me or the others.

That's why I will always trust BB because he knows the team better than anybody else. Can't he make a mistake? Of course yes, but overall his decisions have been among the best and I would rather have him taking the decision on the QB and the team rather than than any other coach.

So, if he is going to stick with MC as the QB for the entire season, I will believe that he knows better and hope for the best. And note that BB didn't have that much history of TB back in '01 and probably went with what he saw during the practice sessions and the 'intangibles' that are not visible to us ordinary fans.

 

[PatsWickedPissah]

No one really could have known how great brady was gonna be, except for those who followed his college career when he "traded" time with some douche high school start. But there is basically NO WAY we could have known he'd become the greatest to ever play the game, you can say "I was one of the few" all you want but that doesnt make it true. Yea, you could have thought he was gonna be darn good, but as good as he is, I dont think so. As far as cassel goes, I look at it like this, Someone like Brady comes along once in a lifetime, the chances of cassel being that good are so slim its not worth even talking about. Go ahead though, keep hopin. Like I said, I hope I'm wrong.

NOBODY is saying that Cassel will equal Brady. That's a strawman. Other than that Jets troll marysomething, no Pats fan is saying that Cassel is gonna be great. The question is...will the backup QB be good enough to help the team win a majority of games? Jury is out given the poor performance on offense and defense exhibited in this early season.

 

[Nunchucks]

I don't know about the season, just gonna focus on the next game

 

[Sivy]

No argument that none could have known TB was going to be this great but you got to give BB (and I guess Charlie) the credit.

Remember the anger and extreme reactions that BB evoked across NE when he disclosed in a live interview on CBS (back in '01) that he was going with Brady all the way and not Bledsoe??

I remember being shocked on hearing it and felt sorry for Bledsoe because we are all expecting Bledose to continue once he was ok. I think even Bledose came to know about this only after the telecast. I hoped at that time that BB had a good reason behind it but couldn't figure out how the friggin h*** he could give the reigns to a QB down in the depth chart. Boy, am I glad that BB didn't listen to me or the others.

That's why I will always trust BB because he knows the team better than anybody else. Can't he make a mistake? Of course yes, but overall his decisions have been among the best and I would rather have him taking the decision on the QB and the team rather than than any other coach.

So, if he is going to stick with MC as the QB for the entire season, I will believe that he knows better and hope for the best. And note that BB didn't have that much history of TB back in '01 and probably went with what he saw during the practice sessions and the 'intangibles' that are not visible to us ordinary fans.

You're right, BB does know alot more about this than any of us on this board, or probably anyone ever, I dont think, however that he sees something great in cassel, but is simply going with the best option, as bad as it is, to try and get through the season. I mean, no point in bringing anyone in now, seasons just about over. And as far as O'connel goes, with 9 left in the forth, and being down by 5000 million points, I just wanted to see him in action thats all.