Pape
Pro Bowl Player
- Joined
- Jun 8, 2012
- Messages
- 10,536
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he plays on the left side of the lineUh, Thuney is not the only R guard in the league.
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CLICK HERE to Register for a free account and login for a smoother ad-free experience. It's easy, and only takes a few moments.he plays on the left side of the lineUh, Thuney is not the only R guard in the league.
nope i ignore that sihtshow... nothing good will ever come out of that thread...Have you seen the Tampa thread? There are people saying that if Brady doesn't make it to the super bowl this season is a failure. Have you seen that buffoon Tommybrady12's posts? You would think we had JP Losman for 20 years. There are plenty of people bashing Bill but there are also plenty of people bashing Brady. Bill deserves credit but by the end of the run Brady was overcoming Bill's shortcomings as a GM.
People are calling it a failure if Brady doesn't play in a super bowl while at the same time letting Bill off the hook for putting together a terrible team and going 7-9.nope i ignore that sihtshow... nothing good will ever come out of that thread...
but saying a player needs to make it to the super bowl, that kinda infers a high level of success, doesn't it? Compare that to the criticism BB has taken here ... not even remotely in the same class
1. The Pats had about fifty bucks of cap space.
2. The Pats did try to get Brady weapons. They signed Antonio Brown. They drafted a WR in the first round. They traded for Sanu ( Brady's choice).
3. They went to four of the last six Super Bowls and won three.
4. Because of cap space management, free agent signings, coaching and etc etc... the Pats have had a unprecedented twenty year run resulting in 13 AFCCG appearances, 9 Super Bowl appearances and Six wins.
5. Belichick and Brady were together Six years longer than the next successful tandem. Six years. They got tired of each other?
6. For whatever reason, and I don't care what the reason was, their relationship soured. They got divorced.
7. The cap space was a factor. Did BB have some poor drafts? Yes. But did he try to surround Brady with weapons? Yes he did.
Not aiming this at the OP but WTF.
What a bunch of whiny sniveling twits.
If you're *****ing and are.....
Over 40 - phuck off. You've never had a better twenty year ride in your life. And half of you probably got married and divorced during the ride.
30 - 40 - phuck off. You're too young to realize that you had the best ride of your life. And half of you are probably filing for divorce after ten years of marriage.
20-30. -. Phuck off. You were born into a dynasty and was fed great moment after great moment with the proverbial golden spoon. What a bunch of spoiled pink hats.
10-20. - There's still hope for you. Slap your pink hat dad a couple of times for me. Will you?
BB built a playoff team in Cleveland. He built the Patriots into a Dynasty and he'll build them up again. No doubt in my mind.
I truly don't understand this "who was more valuable" bull shyt because the answer is they both supplied us an incredible twenty year run.
I love both Brady and BB. I'm enjoying watching Brady do his thing down in Tampa and I'm enjoying watching BB rebuilding the Pats.
Will he rebuild the Pats to what they were over the last twenty years? No. It's impossible. The BB/TB dynamic has only happened once in NFL history. It was special. Will BB rebuild the Pats into playoff contenders? Absolutely.
I think both Brady and Gronk just didn’t want to play for Belichick any more. He’s the greatest coach in football history but he’s also an unrelenting hard ass, and after playing so long for him Brady wanted some love, and he wanted more enjoyment out of playing football, and that simply was not going to happen in New England. I also think Belichick has wanted to move to a more athletic QB, and wants to rebuild to Championship level with his new QB before hanging them up, so he was fine with moving on.
Blind-faith is the word. For you. IBWT doesn't actually mean anything, it's not an argument, it's an empty acronym. His best player grew not to trust him and for very good reasons. No one's "blaming" Bill for 6 rings, we're applying more credit to Brady, and blaming Bill for prematurely ending the run. And costing the team the another ring in SB 51. So yes, I expected more, because I should. Brady, who also expected more, is proving that beyond any doubt right now.When you’re wrong you’re wrong, it has nothing to do with “owing Bill.” You and the rest of the negative nancy’s are blaming Bill for providing 6 rings, 3 in the last dynastic run... because you expect more. Entitlement is the word...
But make no mistake the pro-Belichick side is PMing the Mods about alleged trolling and begging for this thread to be shutdown asap. Because they're losing the argument in an extremely lopsided fashion
So far the "pro-Belichick" crowd is owning this conversation, at least until someone can refute the math... they can't. Just FYI I'm pro Patriots, I like both Bill and Tom.So here we go... the whole Brady vs Belichick debate is again the culmination of every topic. Because really, what's more important? But make no mistake the pro-Belichick side is PMing the Mods about alleged trolling and begging for this thread to be shutdown asap. Because they're losing the argument in an extremely lopsided fashion. We all know, had Brady lost to New Orleans this weekend, the In Bill We Trust crowd would be going on about how Brady was 1-6 against teams with a winning record, the WFT win meant nothing, and you see Brady couldn't win a meaningful game without Belichick as his head coach.
But the facts are the facts. Brady in his very first season without Belichick has accomplished what Belichick couldn't do in 8 opportunities... win more than 1 playoff game. Think about this, in 8 full seasons, Belichick managed one playoff birth as a wild card team and won 1 game. Brady in one season has 2 playoff wins and possibly still counting. Brady doesn't need Belichick to be successful. Belichick has only been successful with Brady. These are facts.
It's also a fact that Brady is currently playing for another team because 1) Belichick created animosity between the two (see SB 51, see incentive laden contract, see mistreatment of personal trainer, see FA departures), 2) Belichick crippled the roster with exceptionally poor drafts and FA decisions and 3) most importantly, Belichick completely miscalculated Brady's elite window (by at least 3 years!).
So now the Patriots are not good, have no quarterback, and find themselves in a division with at least one other team that is going to be very good for many seasons (mainly because they now have the elite quarterback). Compounding matters, our elite quarterback is fully invested elsewhere, he's transformed the entire culture of his new franchise, and he's leading them on a deep playoff run that seemed improbable as recently as November. But Brady did what he usually does... rise to the heights required of the situation to make it successful.
Blind-faith is the word. For you. IBWT doesn't actually mean anything, it's not an argument, it's an empty acronym. His best player grew not to trust him and for very good reasons. No one's "blaming" Bill for 6 rings, we're applying more credit to Brady, and blaming Bill for prematurely ending the run. And costing the team the another ring in SB 51. So yes, I expected more, because I should. Brady, who also expected more, is proving that beyond any doubt right now.
The truth requires proof. So far the doom & gloom crowd have only provided emotions and "because I say so" logic.So just like everything else in this country it's "my way or the highway"? The truth often is somewhere inbetween.
Except SB 51...
It’s a Pats forum. Are we only supposed to discuss everything good that happened in the past? I think it’s worthwhile to discuss where we are and how we got here.
no one has let BB off the hook for going 7-9... quite the opposite. to say otherwise is not being honestPeople are calling it a failure if Brady doesn't play in a super bowl while at the same time letting Bill off the hook for putting together a terrible team and going 7-9.
Fair point, but I think the draft success is something we just disagree on. I agree no one knocks it out of the park every year, that’s just not realistic, but we have a had a pretty long lull in finding above average players via the draft, especially in the higher rounds. We had 1 or 2 year lulls before but then Bill would come back and smoke a few out of the park.That is not the point though. You are implying that the front office somehow screwed up drafting when my POV is that it was mostly a regression to the mean which historically is a very normal thing. All teams -- including the Ravens, Seahawks or Saints -- have periods of time where picks work out and times where they don't. No matter where they are picked, there is nobody out there who is a draft genius who consistently beats the uncertainty over longer periods of time.
Point being I don't think you can have a actual balanced discussion about anything if you don't compare our outcome to the average of the league over a longer period of time. And for one reason or the other that vital context -- and others like expected value of picks given draft position -- is usually missing in threads like this.
Fair point, but I think the draft success is something we just disagree on. I agree no one knocks it out of the park every year, that’s just not realistic, but we have a had a pretty long lull in finding above average players via the draft, especially in the higher rounds. We had 1 or 2 year lulls before but then Bill would come back and smoke a few out of the park.
Here’s our drafts, aside from a few lineman who are the upper tier players in the last 5 years? This draft list is the reason we are now a middle of the pack football team.
New England Patriots All-Time Draft History | Pro-Football-Reference.com
Checkout the complete draft history of New England Patriots starting from 1936 to present including year by year draft picks on Pro-Football-Reference.comwww.pro-football-reference.com
Whew! Before this post I thought you were being serious! Thank you for showing us all you’re just trolling.No, 7 - 9 is a primo spot for trading down on draft day.