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When did Brady, become Brady, and Bill become IBWT? Just an open discussion to see where people stand.


Noexcusesfornumber5

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When did you personally realize that they were both the greatest that had done it? When did you know, they are both the heads of the Mt. Rushmore of the NFL? What exited you most about the end of that particular Superbowl win that made you feel like they won it for me?

Does each championship reflect differently?

Mt favorite is the 85 and 96. Because it made the hug with my Dad that much sweeter when we won.
 
Superbowl 49 secured both of their legacies to me.
 
The team was 5-13 before Brady became the starter. From there they went 14-3 and won the Super Bowl on Brady's game-winning drive. Brady became Brady in 2001. Belichick was 41-57 as a head coach before Brady became his starter. Brady gave Belichick 19 straight seasons of well above .500 records. Belichick became Belichick when Brady became Brady. He's reverted back to pre-Brady Belichick after Brady left. Brady remained Brady. IBWT was never a real thing (for me).
 
When did you personally realize that they were both the greatest that had done it? When did you know, they are both the heads of the Mt. Rushmore of the NFL? What exited you most about the end of that particular Superbowl win that made you feel like they won it for me?

Does each championship reflect differently?

Mt favorite is the 85 and 96. Because it made the hug with my Dad that much sweeter when we won.
Huh?
 
When did you personally realize that they were both the greatest that had done it? When did you know, they are both the heads of the Mt. Rushmore of the NFL? What exited you most about the end of that particular Superbowl win that made you feel like they won it for me?

Does each championship reflect differently?

Mt favorite is the 85 and 96. Because it made the hug with my Dad that much sweeter when we won.
I thought Belichick was a mastermind defensive coach in the 80s with the Giants, because the Bills' K-Gun offense was nearly impossible to stop. He shut them down.

When he came to new England and aided our turnaround to the Super Bowl in '96 and then helped resurrect the Jets with Parcells, I badly wanted him to be our coach.

Shutting the Rams Greatest show on Turf in 2001 cemented it for me.

For Brady, it was pretty early in his career as well. It was the 2003 AFCCG and the 2003 SB. Although Brady threw a costly pick against Carolina, he stood in against massive pressure, completed high degree of difficulty passes while the team was behind, locked on with Deion Branch, and put on one of the greatest passing performances of the ages (it was top 2 Super Bowl passing yards all-time at the time).

So, 2001 for Belichick (given his already incredible track record) and 2003 for Brady (just because we haven't really seen a performance like that from a QB outside of Foles in 2017 [sad face]). Although you can say Foles' performance shows how fluky it can be, I think Brady's performance speaks for itself on that day since no other winning QB than Foles has surpassed Brady's passing yards since 2003.

When people denigrate young Brady as a sidenote to Vinatieri's clutch kicking (Adam actually missed 2 FGs that day), they maybe forget that only one QB in the last 20 years has surpassed Brady's 2003 performance.
 
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I thought Belichick was a mastermind defensive coach in the 80s with the Giants, because the Bills' K-Gun offense was nearly impossible to stop. He shut them down.
Let's put this overrated narrative to rest.

Buffalo lost 4 Super Bowls in a row from 1990 to 1993.

SB 25 (loss to NYG)
371 yards of total offense
166 rushing yards
1 sack
0 turnovers
19 points
Lost by 1 point on a missed 47-yards FGA

SB 26 (loss to Washington)
283 yards of total offense
43 rushing yards
5 sacks
5 turnovers
24 points
Lost by 13 points

SB 27 (loss to Cowboys)
362 yards of total offense
108 rushing yards
4 sacks
9 turnovers
17 points
Lost by 35 points

SB 28 (loss to Cowboys)
314 yards of total offense
87 rushing yards
3 sacks
3 turnovers
13 points
Lost by 17 points

The Bills k-gun offense sucked in the Super Bowls. Jim Kelly was a complete disaster... 4 games, 2 TDs, 7 INTs, 3 FL, and 56.9 passer rating. Kelly and the k-gun offense had their best Super Bowl against Belichick's defense... most total yards, most rushing yards, fewest sacks (1), fewest turnovers (0), and merely lost by a missed FG. Buffalo had 17 turnovers in their other 3 SB losses where they were completely humiliated by the opposing defenses. So "mastermind" Bill actually shut down the Bills offense the least in those 4 games. The far more dominant defensive performances came from Washington and then Dallas twice.
 
Let's put this overrated narrative to rest.

Buffalo lost 4 Super Bowls in a row from 1990 to 1993.

SB 25 (loss to NYG)
371 yards of total offense
166 rushing yards
1 sack
0 turnovers
19 points
Lost by 1 point on a missed 47-yards FGA

SB 26 (loss to Washington)
283 yards of total offense
43 rushing yards
5 sacks
5 turnovers
24 points
Lost by 13 points

SB 27 (loss to Cowboys)
362 yards of total offense
108 rushing yards
4 sacks
9 turnovers
17 points
Lost by 35 points

SB 28 (loss to Cowboys)
314 yards of total offense
87 rushing yards
3 sacks
3 turnovers
13 points
Lost by 17 points

The Bills k-gun offense sucked in the Super Bowls. Jim Kelly was a complete disaster... 4 games, 2 TDs, 7 INTs, 3 FL, and 56.9 passer rating. Kelly and the k-gun offense had their best Super Bowl against Belichick's defense... most total yards, most rushing yards, fewest sacks (1), fewest turnovers (0), and merely lost by a missed FG. Buffalo had 17 turnovers in their other 3 SB losses where they were completely humiliated by the opposing defenses. So "mastermind" Bill actually shut down the Bills offense the least in those 4 games. The far more dominant defensive performances came from Washington and then Dallas twice.

This is also when the NFC literally won every single year for a decade and a half.
 
man, you guys are tough

The moment Adam Vinatieris kick went through the uprights in Super Bowl 36 both their legacies were set in stone...

we won the effing Super Bowl!!!! that did it for me.
Yeah, Brady became Brady as soon as they ruled the Tuck Rule was enforced. Go back and watch it. Lights out.
 
SB39 vs Eagles was the point they became very significant in NFL history.
 
Brady became “Brady” to most after the 2nd Super Bowl win as he, Bill and the Pats needed to show they weren’t a fluke-Cinderella-feel good story which they were in 2001. By 2005 after their 3rd Super Bowl win, they went from the feel good team to the most hated team in the NFL.

Bill in his early days with Brady could do no wrong and that’s how the IBWT started with fans. Bill was on a hot streak with drafts, game plans and in game adjustments. Both he and Tom were already being talked about as GOAT’s after they won 3 out 4 years together.
 
2014

Finally closing that 2005-2013 gap in titles
 
Think it was after the seattle sb win where I personally became confident they were.

Then sb51 pretty much removed any doubt anyone could have besides a select few haters.
 
I mean, among Pats fans winning Super Bowl XXXVI made both of them eternal Pats superheroes no matter what happened next. It's impossible to overstate how unbelievable that was both in terms of franchise history and fan impact.

In the big HISTORICAL picture? Super Bowl LI. Here's why.

There had been quarterbacks with 4 titles (Montana and Bradshawlol)
There had been head coaches with 4 titles (Noll)

There had never been a 5 ring head coach and a 5 ring QB. There had never been a Super Bowl comeback anywhere near that big, or an OT win. Brady locked down every Super Bowl record for career completions, attempts, yards, touchdowns and MVP awards.

They stopped being "only" "among the greats" and just broke the back of a million dumb arguments. It was the apocalypse for Pats haters.
 
I thought Belichick was a mastermind defensive coach in the 80s with the Giants, because the Bills' K-Gun offense was nearly impossible to stop. He shut them down.

When he came to new England and aided our turnaround to the Super Bowl in '96 and then helped resurrect the Jets with Parcells, I badly wanted him to be our coach.

Shutting the Rams Greatest show on Turf in 2001 cemented it for me.

For Brady, it was pretty early in his career as well. It was the 2003 AFCCG and the 2003 SB. Although Brady threw 2 picks against Carolina, he stood in against massive pressure, completed high degree of difficulty passes while the team was behind, locked on with Deion Branch, and put on one of the greatest passing performances of the ages (it was top 2 Super Bowl passing yards all-time at the time).

So, 2001 for Belichick (given his already incredible track record) and 2003 for Brady (just because we haven't really seen a performance like that from a QB since outside of Foles in 2017 [sad face]). Although you can say Foles' performance shows how fluky it can be, I think Brady's performance speaks for itself on that day in 2003 since no other winning QB than Foles has surpassed Brady's passing yards since 2003.

When people denigrate young Brady as a sidenote to Vinatieri's clutch kicking (Adam actually missed 2 FGs that day), they maybe forget that only one QB in the last 20 years has surpassed Brady's 2003 performance.
He didnt throw 2 picks vs carolina.
 


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