Stanzi

[ctpatsfan77]

I was thinking the same thing!!

The more I ponder it, the more likely I am to draft Ricky Stanzi and Greg McElroy...at which point trading Hoyer would crystalize, indeed.

I wonder how much we could get for'm??

In that scenario his trade value would drop.

Remember that high value requires two things: scarcity and demand. If the Patriots had four QBs, scarcity goes poof as pretty much everyone and their dog would know that they'd have to get rid of one of them.

 

[Off The Grid]

I was thinking the same thing!!

The more I ponder it, the more likely I am to draft Ricky Stanzi and Greg McElroy...at which point trading Hoyer would crystalize, indeed.

I wonder how much we could get for'm??

Here's the mention you mentioned: New England Patriots: QB Brian Hoyer gaining steam as potential starter? | Sports Haze | Where Sports News & World Culture Come Together

So, you're just willing to kiss off the 2011 season if Brady gets hurt instead of being competitive with Hoyer?

You've got a poor memory, my friend.

It was just 20 months ago that a guy named Bill Belichick "kissed off" the 2009 season by going with only 1 UNDRAFTED ROOKIE QuarterBack behind a guy ~ General Tom Brady ~ who was returning from an awful injury.

If Coach Bill and crew can get a UFA like Brian Hoyer sufficiently ready to step in and take care of business, I'm pretty sure that they could get BOTH Ricky Stanzi and Greg McElroy ready to their satisfaction, short Camp or not.

And in any case, the trade of Hoyer would quite obviously be contingent upon their development, something I notice you didn't bother to ask about, before flying to your conclusion, and then attacking it.

So much for your notion of "kissing off the 2011 season." :snob:

 

[Off The Grid]

I was thinking the same thing!!

The more I ponder it, the more likely I am to draft Ricky Stanzi and Greg McElroy...at which point trading Hoyer would crystalize, indeed.

I wonder how much we could get for'm??

Here's the mention you mentioned: New England Patriots: QB Brian Hoyer gaining steam as potential starter? | Sports Haze | Where Sports News & World Culture Come Together

In that scenario his trade value would drop.

Remember that high value requires two things: scarcity and demand. If the Patriots had four QBs, scarcity goes poof as pretty much everyone and their dog would know that they'd have to get rid of one of them.

Already previously considered and rejected.

Any ONE other team's ~ Training Camp Injury?? ~ desperate sudden need TRUMPS our surfeit.

And mysterious ailments and the IR ~ or the threat of it ~ are beautifull things.

 

[Box_O_Rocks]

Adam Froman

 

[BritPat]

Something that may be of interest to people in this thread (and it's hardly committal I know):

Twitter

 

[mgteich]

OK, so the idea is to draft a quarterback, develop him so quickly in camp (or non-camp) that we are able to trade Hoyer to a team that will have time to integrate him into their system in what's left of camp and the preseason?

OK, if there is a camp, and if we are confident in a quarterback early in camp, then it is indeed reasonable to trade Hoyer. Of course, I haven't a clue as to how we would have that confidence.

This is NOT 2009. We may not even have camp. We have Hoyer under contract. We have no reason to take the risk even if we do draft a quarterback, as I think we should.

You've got a poor memory, my friend.

It was just 20 months ago that a guy named Bill Belichick "kissed off" the 2009 season by going with only 1 UNDRAFTED ROOKIE QuarterBack behind a guy ~ General Tom Brady ~ who was returning from an awful injury.

If Coach Bill and crew can get a UFA like Brian Hoyer sufficiently ready to step in and take care of business, I'm pretty sure that they could get BOTH Ricky Stanzi and Greg McElroy ready to their satisfaction, short Camp or not.

And in any case, the trade of Hoyer would quite obviously be contingent upon their development, something I notice you didn't bother to ask about, before flying to your conclusion, and then attacking it.

So much for your notion of "kissing off the 2011 season." :snob:

 

[convertedpatsfan]

In that scenario his trade value would drop.

Remember that high value requires two things: scarcity and demand. If the Patriots had four QBs, scarcity goes poof as pretty much everyone and their dog would know that they'd have to get rid of one of them.

I think what he meant was that we'd draft one of either Stanzi/McElroy, not both. Though if he meant both, my apologies!

Then again, BB has carried 4 QBs before when he kept that JAG Brady. And he's also went with the rookie UDFA as primary (and only) back-up in Hoyer. Can't put anything past that man

And I don't think scarcity would affect the need. Some teams would probably be willing to wait it out, but if they really needed a QB and felt Hoyer could be that guy, they should be willing to deal.

Seattle gave up a bunch for Whitehurst even though he was the 3rd-string QB. Washington gave up a 2nd and more for McNabb despite everyone knowing Philly was going to trade one of their 3 QBs last season.

 

[Off The Grid]

YES, Teich.

IF this happened...

And IF that happened...

And IF the other thing happened...

Then, why YES: It would be a bad idea.

***

In case you don't get my gist: You're trying to discredit my theoretical thesis based on an alternative theoretical thesis: That is a FAIL.

***

My thesis was bases on a theoretical set of events: We sign a CBA in the near future.

Should that change, then ~ were we to draft both guys ~ we'd be looking at other common options: 4 QB's, as we've done, or a mysterious IR ~ inducing "ailment."

Not exactly earth-shattering stuff, there.

I was thinking the same thing!!

The more I ponder it, the more likely I am to draft Ricky Stanzi and Greg McElroy...at which point trading Hoyer would crystalize, indeed.

I wonder how much we could get for'm??

Here's the mention you mentioned: New England Patriots: QB Brian Hoyer gaining steam as potential starter? | Sports Haze | Where Sports News & World Culture Come Together

So, you're just willing to kiss off the 2011 season if Brady gets hurt instead of being competitive with Hoyer? Surely you don't think that Stanzi or McElroy would be ready to step in, especially with an abbreviated camp.

And all this to gain a 2012 draft pick? I'm not buying. However, there will be quarterback needs in 2012 also. Drafting one of the quarterbacks mentioned and grooming him as a replacment for Hoyer does indeed make sense. We can tender him as a first rounder and trade him NEXT year.

You've got a poor memory, my friend.

It was just 20 months ago that a guy named Bill Belichick "kissed off" the 2009 season by going with only 1 UNDRAFTED ROOKIE QuarterBack behind a guy ~ General Tom Brady ~ who was returning from an awful injury.

If Coach Bill and crew can get a UFA like Brian Hoyer sufficiently ready to step in and take care of business, I'm pretty sure that they could get BOTH Ricky Stanzi and Greg McElroy ready to their satisfaction, short Camp or not.

And in any case, the trade of Hoyer would quite obviously be contingent upon their development, something I notice you didn't bother to ask about, before flying to your conclusion, and then attacking it.

So much for your notion of "kissing off the 2011 season." :snob:

OK, so the idea is to draft a quarterback, develop him so quickly in camp (or non-camp) that we are able to trade Hoyer to a team that will have time to integrate him into their system in what's left of camp and the preseason?

OK, if there is a camp, and if we are confident in a quarterback early in camp, then it is indeed reasonable to trade Hoyer. Of course, I haven't a clue as to how we would have that confidence.

This is NOT 2009. We may not even have camp. We have Hoyer under contract. We have no reason to take the risk even if we do draft a quarterback, as I think we should.

 

[Off The Grid]

Then again, BB has carried 4 QBs before when he kept that JAG Brady. And he's also went with the rookie UDFA as primary (and only) back-up in Hoyer. Can't put anything past that man

And I don't think scarcity would affect the need. Some teams would probably be willing to wait it out, but if they really needed a QB and felt Hoyer could be that guy, they should be willing to deal.

Seattle gave up a bunch for Whitehurst even though he was the 3rd-string QB. Washington gave up a 2nd and more for McNabb despite everyone knowing Philly was going to trade one of their 3 QBs last season.

Bravo!! Well argued, sir.

 

[BPF]

http://www.nationalfootballpost.com/Breaking-down-Ricky-Stanzi.html

.........


Looking at Stanzi as a player, he has very good size at 6-4 and 223 pounds. He doesn’t have great speed, running in the 4.90 range, but he has quick feet and very good body control and good overall quickness. He can set up very quickly from under center and he sets his feet and stays in balance. He has a smooth overhand delivery with a quick release. When he finds his target the ball is out of his hand quickly. He throws a tight ball that is very catchable and has more than enough arm strength. While he doesn’t have a cannon like a Jay Cutler, he can still put some zip on the ball and can easily throw the ball 55 yards in the air.

He’s poised and patient and shows good ability to see the field and go through a progression. He has good instincts and doesn’t make many poor decisions. When you watch the end zone tape you can see him go through his progression sometimes going from 1 to 2 to 3 and then making the throw to the open man. You seldom see him stare down receivers and force a throw. His accuracy has improved every year as well as his ball placement. At the Senior Bowl practices he threw the best deep ball of the six quarterbacks there.

When facing a strong pass rush he doesn’t panic. He has a good feel for pass rushers and has the quick feet and athleticism to keep a play alive and find an open man. He takes what is given and if that means going to a check down that’s what he does.

...............

Sounds a lot like a young Brady.

 

[Hercules Rockefeller]

Breaking down Ricky Stanzi | National Football Post



Sounds a lot like a young Brady.

Please, everyone, stop comparing Ricky Stanzi (or any other college QBs, for that matter) to Tom Brady. Brady played well in bowl games, and in the fourth quarter, in his college career. Not a single quarterback I have seen since has the amount of pitbull in him that #12 does.

I know that Stanzi won his 3 bowl games, including one over Blaine Gabbert (who I think is insanely overrated). He did not play well at all against Missouri in that game, and the entire season was a letdown for Iowa fans, who saw themselves as a dark horse national title contender only to lose their last 3 Big Ten games, including to an appallingly bad Minnesota team. His Orange Bowl victory in 2010 was solid but not overly impressive.

Stanzi may turn out to be a solid starter (I have my doubts and see him as a solid backup), but he will never remind anyone of Brady other than size and college conference. I do not see the upside. I think he has a high floor, but a pretty low ceiling. Make no mistake, I do like the idea of taking a pro-style, veteran QB who can make accurate decisions with the football, but Stanzi seems to be rising to a point where it would be a stupid move to take him anyway for the Pats. Why not just wait a few rounds and take Greg McElroy? Or go after Scott Tolzien or Ben Chappell in the 7th/UDFA portion?

A lot of people are getting worked up over taking a guy that, if the "experts" are all right, is rising up to the point where it would be a huge mistake to take him. Missing just a few key pieces to a 14-2 team, do we really want Bill to take a potential QB of the future in round 2 or 3? I ABSOLUTELY do not, and I do not understand why anyone would. Kevin O'Connell he may not be, but Belichick has shown a very good ability to get QBs really late that turn into solid players. I see no need to use a top 100 asset on a player who, ideally, would NEVER see the field for at least 5 years. I want the Pats to win multiple championships over the next few years, and that means I want players who will see the field.

 

[ctpatsfan77]

Missing just a few key pieces to a 14-2 team, do we really want Bill to take a potential QB of the future in round 2 or 3?

Not to be facetious, but the Pats have enough draft ammo to fill their top three draft needs, trade up, pick up a high draft pick in 2012, AND take a QB to groom all in the first three rounds.

If they can meet their needs and they feel like drafting a QB high, I say "Why not?"

 

[Box_O_Rocks]

Not to be facetious, but the Pats have enough draft ammo to fill their top three draft needs, trade up, pick up a high draft pick in 2012, AND take a QB to groom all in the first three rounds.

If they can meet their needs and they feel like drafting a QB high, I say "Why not?"

Well, in the case of Stanzi, I'd say the value isn't there. Dalton, Kaepernick ... maybe. If Stanzi is going in the third round, NE might just as well go in another direction, fifth round, I can see him.

 

[tricktak]

Taylor Potts from Texas Tech is another QB to Watch out for for the Patriots in the later rounds

 

[BPF]

BostonHerald.com - Blogs: Rap Sheet Blog Archive Need No. 7: Is QB Ricky Stanzi following in Tom Brady’s footsteps?

 

[BPF]

Please, everyone, stop comparing Ricky Stanzi (or any other college QBs, for that matter) to Tom Brady. Brady played well in bowl games, and in the fourth quarter, in his college career. Not a single quarterback I have seen since has the amount of pitbull in him that #12 does.

I know that Stanzi won his 3 bowl games, including one over Blaine Gabbert (who I think is insanely overrated). He did not play well at all against Missouri in that game, and the entire season was a letdown for Iowa fans, who saw themselves as a dark horse national title contender only to lose their last 3 Big Ten games, including to an appallingly bad Minnesota team. His Orange Bowl victory in 2010 was solid but not overly impressive.

Stanzi may turn out to be a solid starter (I have my doubts and see him as a solid backup), but he will never remind anyone of Brady other than size and college conference. I do not see the upside. I think he has a high floor, but a pretty low ceiling. Make no mistake, I do like the idea of taking a pro-style, veteran QB who can make accurate decisions with the football, but Stanzi seems to be rising to a point where it would be a stupid move to take him anyway for the Pats. Why not just wait a few rounds and take Greg McElroy? Or go after Scott Tolzien or Ben Chappell in the 7th/UDFA portion?

A lot of people are getting worked up over taking a guy that, if the "experts" are all right, is rising up to the point where it would be a huge mistake to take him. Missing just a few key pieces to a 14-2 team, do we really want Bill to take a potential QB of the future in round 2 or 3? I ABSOLUTELY do not, and I do not understand why anyone would. Kevin O'Connell he may not be, but Belichick has shown a very good ability to get QBs really late that turn into solid players. I see no need to use a top 100 asset on a player who, ideally, would NEVER see the field for at least 5 years. I want the Pats to win multiple championships over the next few years, and that means I want players who will see the field.

McElroy will never be a viable NFL QB. He's going to make a better PR guy for some team rather than QB.

 

[Hercules Rockefeller]

McElroy will never be a viable NFL QB. He's going to make a better PR guy for some team rather than QB.

Depends on what you mean by viable. Will he be a starter, a real difference maker on a playoff team? I highly doubt it. The reason I bring up McElroy is because he could be every bit as effective a backup QB as Stanzi would be, and do so at a much lower draft choice.

There have been far worse athletes that have played the position well than Greg McElroy.

 

[FredFromDartmouth]

Stanzi is the best of the QBs I have seen in this draft although I have not yet looked at Dalton. He seems way ahead of Newton and Gabbart. Someone is going to get a steal; hopefully it is Stanzi. He is drifting toward binky land for me (but Ras-I is still the #1 binky for me).

Colin K. is a mystery. He seems very gifted athletically but I am not sure he is as accurate as Stanzi.

 

[Hercules Rockefeller]

Stanzi is the best of the QBs I have seen in this draft although I have not yet looked at Dalton. He seems way ahead of Newton and Gabbart. Someone is going to get a steal; hopefully it is Stanzi. He is drifting toward binky land for me (but Ras-I is still the #1 binky for me).

Colin K. is a mystery. He seems very gifted athletically but I am not sure he is as accurate as Stanzi.

Fred, I am a big Dalton fan. Spread QB, but I like his accuracy. I believe that Newton and Gabbert have big bust potential, agreed there. I think Ponder can be a good QB, assuming he stays healthy.

 

[Box_O_Rocks]

Fred, I am a big Dalton fan. Spread QB, but I like his accuracy. I believe that Newton and Gabbert have big bust potential, agreed there. I think Ponder can be a good QB, assuming he stays healthy.

Herc, I've asked before but you may have missed it - what are your thoughts on Adam Weber as a 7th/UDFA project?