Shane Vereen.....

[patsfanincleveland]

Re: Shane Vareen.....

Is Austin a slot receiver or an outside receiver? He seems very similar to Santana Moss. Either way, I see nothing very revolutionary about Austin or him playing in a 2 TE offense.

McCluster was supposed to be the guy that you could play at WR or RB...a revolutionary dude....not so much in the end. Size does matter.

Considering McCluster plays for the Chiefs and Austin plays for the Rams.......I'm not sure of the point.

Take the time to understand the difference between "scheme versatility/matchup nightmare" vs "two TE" and you'll move forward.

Maybe you would have preferred BB stop drafting TE's after Graham and Watson "failed".

 

[SVN]

I hope he is good but a lot of is just media speculation. Every one from peter king to reiss think he could be the breakout player. I am yet to see him in consistent pass protection before making a judgement.
I for one think that we will miss woodhead more than welker. That guy had knack of getting tough yards and giving the offense a spark and was great in pass protection.

 

[BradyFTW!]

Re: Shane Vareen.....

I've been pimping this guy since before he was drafted but he hasn't produced. He looks good on paper but it hasn't translated to the field for some reason. He may step it up this year but I'm not expecting huge production. Certainly won't be the most dangerous weapon.

To nitpick the OP, he really doesn't have great speed. I think he's something like a 4.5 guy. Can someone confirm?

*Shane Vereen | California, RB : 2011 NFL Draft Scout External News

You're right on the money re: his 40 time, but from what I've seen he plays faster than that. Personally, give me a guy who accelerates like he does and tops out in the high 4.4s over someone who tops out faster but takes longer to get there.

I think being injured for so much of his rookie year really set Vereen back quite a bit. Most guys who miss virtually their entire rookie year don't end up becoming contributors, so he's already beaten the odds there, and I anticipate that he'll build on last year's momentum and become one of the 3-4 most important weapons on this offense (Along with Gronk, Amendola and Ridley).

My primary concern is his health, since we've yet to see him go a full season without a nagging injury, but that's something that we'll just have to wait and see on.

 

[VrabelJr]

Re: Shane Vareen.....

Guys like Percy Harvin, Darren Sproles, Reggie Bush, Shane Vereen and (the Rams hope) Tavon Austin are game changers. Their ability to line up all over the place and do a wide variety of things give game planners fits. Dexter McCluster is on the fringe of this list. With solid QB play he could be special.

Aaron Hernandez was a member of that special group as well and really an anomaly when you consider how big he was compared to the rest of the players I mentioned.

 

[Nunchucks]

Re: Shane Vareen.....

Considering McCluster plays for the Chiefs and Austin plays for the Rams.......I'm not sure of the point.

Take the time to understand the difference between "scheme versatility/matchup nightmare" vs "two TE" and you'll move forward.

Maybe you would have preferred BB stop drafting TE's after Graham and Watson "failed".

Oh, you are saying the Rams are above the Chiefs on the offensive production scale? Perhaps you think that the Chiefs did not try to scheme McCluster the ball or you think that when McCluster was drafted that they did not supposedly have an offensive genius coaching the team.

Anyhow, there have been plenty of examples of diminutive super-fast and quick guys drafted into the NFL. It is exceedingly rare that a guy who is 175 lbs does much in the NFL, if they manage to last past a few bone jarring hits.

As for the second part of your retort...WTF are you talking about two TEs and the failure of Graham and Watson. Are you smoking the good stuff or the brown headache shiznit? Cause I am thinking it is the latter.

 

[shmessy]

Re: Shane Vareen.....

I love Vereen, he is on my fantasy team. But, we really have not heard much about him at camp. Compared to the WRs and Sudfield, Vereen or any of the running backs for that matter have been conspicuously not written about.

That doesn't mean I do not expect to see a lot of the RBs and Vereen in particular, but still. Weird how we have not heard much about the RB group.

You DID see Brady's only TD pass last Friday night, right?

Vereen is very much going to get touches this year.

 

[VrabelJr]

Re: Shane Vareen.....

The reason we haven't heard much about Vereen is because RBs aren't the sexy story line of our training camp, WRs are.

 

[Kid~Brady]

Re: Shane Vareen.....

Guys like Percy Harvin, Darren Sproles, Reggie Bush, Shane Vereen and (the Rams hope) Tavon Austin are game changers. Their ability to line up all over the place and do a wide variety of things give game planners fits. Dexter McCluster is on the fringe of this list. With solid QB play he could be special.

Aaron Hernandez was a member of that special group as well and really an anomaly when you consider how big he was compared to the rest of the players I mentioned.

Is Vereen good enough to take Ridley's starting position> Say Ridley has fumbling issues like last year?

 

[patsfanincleveland]

Re: Shane Vareen.....

Oh, you are saying the Rams are above the Chiefs on the offensive production scale? Perhaps you think that the Chiefs did not try to scheme McCluster the ball or you think that when McCluster was drafted that they did not supposedly have an offensive genius coaching the team.

Anyhow, there have been plenty of examples of diminutive super-fast and quick guys drafted into the NFL. It is exceedingly rare that a guy who is 175 lbs does much in the NFL, if they manage to last past a few bone jarring hits.

As for the second part of your retort...WTF are you talking about two TEs and the failure of Graham and Watson. Are you smoking the good stuff or the brown headache shiznit? Cause I am thinking it is the latter.

Why is this simple concept flying so far over your head?
First you get caught up on two TE's....now it's McCluster's size.......

WTF?

It's very simple.

Understand the macro trends in the NFL.

Teams are looking for skill position players.................that allow for scheme versatility.........that are matchup nightmares.

Vereen has those qualities. Did you ever bother to notice who caught caught the second TD last Friday? Some guy split out wide?

Hernandez had those qualities.

Vereen doesn't need 25 carries per game if he is scheme diverse and the offense functions efficiently.

KC didn't know how to use McCluster...so what?

Ask Woodhead about teams who don't know how to use players.

 

[Kontradiction]

Re: Shane Vareen.....

Is Vereen good enough to take Ridley's starting position> Say Ridley has fumbling issues like last year?

Short answer to that is no. And Ridley didn't have fumbling issues last year.

Not to change the subject, but for the life of me I cannot understand why Vereen wasn't featured more in the game plan for the AFCCG after going off against Houston in the divisional round.

 

[BradyFTW!]

Re: Shane Vareen.....

Is Vereen good enough to take Ridley's starting position> Say Ridley has fumbling issues like last year?

What fumbling problem? 4 fumbles in 296 touches is well within the acceptable range. Obviously you'd like for it to be 0, but it's in no way indicative of a fumbling problem.

As for Vereen supplanting Ridley, I don't see that happening. I do think that they'll both see whole lot of snaps, but Ridley being used more on early downs, and Vereen more on later downs, but Ridley is basically a three-down back. Instead, I see them both being on the field together very frequently. There are a ton of interesting things that you can do when they're both out there, especially if Ridley becomes a better receiver out of the backfield.

 

[BradyFTW!]

Re: Shane Vareen.....

Guys like Percy Harvin, Darren Sproles, Reggie Bush, Shane Vereen and (the Rams hope) Tavon Austin are game changers. Their ability to line up all over the place and do a wide variety of things give game planners fits. Dexter McCluster is on the fringe of this list. With solid QB play he could be special.

Aaron Hernandez was a member of that special group as well and really an anomaly when you consider how big he was compared to the rest of the players I mentioned.

I wouldn't put McCluster on that list. At 170 pounds, it's just really hard to take him seriously as a running back. To put that into perspective, he's 20-30 pounds lighter than Danny Woodhead.

At his current size, McCluster is more of a WR who can occasionally run the ball. His usage has been transitioning in that direction, and it's to both his and the Chiefs' benefit: prior to last year, he was more of a factor in the ground game than in the air, but last season he was averaging 6.5 targets per carry, which IMO is about where he should be.

 

[Nunchucks]

Re: Shane Vareen.....

Why is this simple concept flying so far over your head?
First you get caught up on two TE's....now it's McCluster's size.......

WTF?

It's very simple.

Understand the macro trends in the NFL.

Teams are looking for skill position players.................that allow for scheme versatility.........that are matchup nightmares.

Vereen has those qualities. Did you ever bother to notice who caught caught the second TD last Friday? Some guy split out wide?

Hernandez had those qualities.

Vereen doesn't need 25 carries per game if he is scheme diverse and the offense functions efficiently.

KC didn't know how to use McCluster...so what?

Ask Woodhead about teams who don't know how to use players.

It's not like you are trying to cover Austin with a LB, like you might with a TE (hence the mismatch).

Vereen may end up with a LB covering him because Vereen is a RB. Austin will NEVER be treated as a RB.

Austin is a guy that you know how to cover. He isn't going to be hard to block in the running game or force you into a nickel defense in a 2 TE/2 WR set, unless he is lining up at RB, but then you just treat that as a 3 WR set and put a CB/S on the field.

Your condescending attitude is silly, considering you have not offered much insight on strategy beyond buzzwords and passive aggressive insults.

 

[Oswlek]

Could he be our most dangerous weapon this year?

No. But the team is clearly relying on him to be an asset, and I'll think he'll produce.

 

[Kid~Brady]

Re: Shane Vareen.....

What fumbling problem? 4 fumbles in 296 touches is well within the acceptable range. Obviously you'd like for it to be 0, but it's in no way indicative of a fumbling problem.

As for Vereen supplanting Ridley, I don't see that happening. I do think that they'll both see whole lot of snaps, but Ridley being used more on early downs, and Vereen more on later downs, but Ridley is basically a three-down back. Instead, I see them both being on the field together very frequently. There are a ton of interesting things that you can do when they're both out there, especially if Ridley becomes a better receiver out of the backfield.

The Blitz with Jeff Howe & Karen Guregian | Boston Herald

We don't remember this? Didn't BB sit him for a portion of a game or so? I'm just saying, he was good to me but people, including BB, thought he fumbled too much.

 

[JMC00]

Re: Shane Vareen.....

What fumbling problem? 4 fumbles in 296 touches is well within the acceptable range. Obviously you'd like for it to be 0, but it's in no way indicative of a fumbling problem.

Yep.


There were 7 guys in the top 10 last year that had 3 or more fumbles.

Peterson- 3
Morris- 4
Lynch- 4
Charles- 5
Foster- 3
Ridley- 4
Johnson- 3

Doug Martin was the only guy in the top 10 to not have more than 1 fumble.

 

[Kid~Brady]

Re: Shane Vareen.....

Yep.


There were 7 guys in the top 10 last year that had 3 or more fumbles.

Peterson- 3
Morris- 4
Lynch- 4
Charles- 5
Foster- 3
Ridley- 4
Johnson- 3

Doug Martin was the only guy in the top 10 to not have more than 1 fumble.

Trust me, I agree. But the coach thought he had one. I know you remember it. He got benched for a quarter or so for it. I was surprised too.

 

[patsfanincleveland]

Re: Shane Vareen.....

It's not like you are trying to cover Austin with a LB, like you might with a TE (hence the mismatch).

Vereen may end up with a LB covering him because Vereen is a RB. Austin will NEVER be treated as a RB.

Austin is a guy that you know how to cover. He isn't going to be hard to block in the running game or force you into a nickel defense in a 2 TE/2 WR set, unless he is lining up at RB, but then you just treat that as a 3 WR set and put a CB/S on the field.

Your condescending attitude is silly, considering you have not offered much insight on strategy beyond buzzwords and passive aggressive insults.

Much doesn't seem to be offered to you because this is simply going over your head.

It's simple.....Vereen is the most scheme diverse skill player we have.

Watch that....it's the central fact you seem hell bent on not grasping.

Your fixation on technical nonsense seems to be holding you from understanding the macro concepts.

 

[JMC00]

Re: Shane Vareen.....

The Blitz with Jeff Howe & Karen Guregian | Boston Herald

We don't remember this? Didn't BB sit him for a portion of a game or so? I'm just saying, he was good to me but people, including BB, thought he fumbled too much.

Why the hell did O'Brien have Ridley split out as a WR when it was 42-7?

Belichick was blinded by BGJE and Woodhead not fumbling that he punished a player that more than likely would have helped in that SB.
BGJE and Woodhead combined for 17 rush 62 yards against the 19th ranked rush defense.

Because at that point Ridley had started to emerge rushing 43 times for 231 yards over the last 3 games of the season and the divisional game.

 

[Nunchucks]

Re: Shane Vareen.....

Much doesn't seem to be offered to you because this is simply going over your head.

It's simple.....Vereen is the most scheme diverse skill player we have.

Watch that....it's the central fact you seem hell bent on not grasping.

Your fixation on technical nonsense seems to be holding you from understanding the macro concepts.

No, Gronkowski is the most scheme diverse player the Patriots can field. You cannot cover him with a LB (speed), will have trouble covering him with a safety (height), and he can block very well in the running game. He poses a serious conundrum to defenses in what they should do.

Vereen is a running back that can run routes and has WR hands, but a smart defense will just go nickel when Vereen is in the game.