Replacement Refs - It has to be said.(Merged X7)

[ThatllMoveTheChains!!!]

Did the patriots use these same tactics to get Brady more time? If not, wouldn't this be an issue with the coaching staff (not playing to the level of effectiveness that the refs will let you get away with).

I always find myself asking this question after such games. Holding by the line is one of those things that most people only notice when the other guys are doing it. If the Pats weren't being as flagrant as the Ravens I wouldn't just automatically assume they would've gotten away with it. As exhibit A I'd like to present the very clear double standard applied to the secondary/receivers all game long.

 

[PatsWickedPissah]

Nope; the game was rigged; pure ans simple. It started with the bogus Gronk holding call; the Patriots were about to walk away with the game and the refs changed the momentum.

Many game were rigged with original refs but this was so blatant that it was disgusting. I turned off the game after I realized the that dice were loaded

Were I to believe games are deliberately rigged by the refs, I would enrich my life by eliminating time wasted watching the NFL and even worse, being on Patsfans.

Why would anyone stay involved in a rigged game?

It boggles the mind.

 

[Nunchucks]

You guys can scroll threw my history. I am not one who really complains at officials (maybe a handful of small gripes in my years), but THIS is different. THIS was the most poorly officiated game I have EVER seen in all my time watching football.

I am not even going to go as far as to say that's why we lost the game, because I think there were horrible penalties and non-penalties made in both directions (though more were against the Pats). This was rediculous. The fact that Bill was sooooooo irate at the officials after the game led me to believe that I was not the only one thinking this.

Usually after the game you can sum up the refs bad night by reviewing one or two calls. If we were to look at last night's debacle, where do we begin?

Ticky tack pass interference on the Julian Edelman catch?
The same contact that's not called on the Torrey Smith 2nd TD?
How about all those non-holding penalties by the Baltimore offensive lineman that let Joe Flacco camp in the pocket?
The incorrect enforcement of offsides on a punt?
Spotting the Manahoona-(whaveter his name) catch at the two yard line? He almost scored, didn't he?
Taking an official measurement timeout when the ball was a good yard (at least) short of the first down.
Phantom pass interference call to sustain a Baltimore drive early in the second quarter on 3rd and 6.
Phatom holding call on McCourty that gave them a first down instead of them having a 3r and 15.



ok, there were some that went in the Pats favor too

15 yard unsportsmanlike conduct for typical 'after the play' skirmishes.
Illegal contact call at the end of the game that erased a big interception.

I am one that believes you cannot blame losing a game based on one or two bad calls. Complaining about the refs is usually a sign of loser mentality. If you cannot win the game because of 1-2 bad calls, then you really didn't deserve to win.

But, this was very different. The inconsistency of the calls was just atrocious. The players are out there and do not know what will draw a penalty and what won't. Nevermind the hits of defenseless receivers and blows to the head. So many non-calls mixed in with so many phantom calls that it just is way too much.

 

[zeroakuma]

You guys can scroll threw my history. I am not one who really complains at officials (maybe a handful of small gripes in my years), but THIS is different. THIS was the most poorly officiated game I have EVER seen in all my time watching football.

I am not even going to go as far as to say that's why we lost the game, because I think there were horrible penalties and non-penalties made in both directions (though more were against the Pats). This was rediculous. The fact that Bill was sooooooo irate at the officials after the game led me to believe that I was not the only one thinking this.

Usually after the game you can sum up the refs bad night by reviewing one or two calls. If we were to look at last night's debacle, where do we begin?

Ticky tack pass interference on the Julian Edelman catch?
The same contact that's not called on the Torrey Smith 2nd TD?
How about all those non-holding penalties by the Baltimore offensive lineman that let Joe Flacco camp in the pocket?
The incorrect enforcement of offsides on a punt?
Spotting the Manahoona-(whaveter his name) catch at the two yard line? He almost scored, didn't he?
Taking an official measurement timeout when the ball was a good yard (at least) short of the first down.
Phantom pass interference call to sustain a Baltimore drive early in the second quarter on 3rd and 6.
Phatom holding call on McCourty that gave them a first down instead of them having a 3r and 15.



ok, there were some that went in the Pats favor too

15 yard unsportsmanlike conduct for typical 'after the play' skirmishes.
Illegal contact call at the end of the game that erased a big interception.

First of all, spell check.

Second, you sound like a Raven's fan. There was pass interference on that Brady pass that was intercepted.

Do you not remember, or are you a Ravens' fan in disguise?

 

[reflexblue]

Nope; the game was rigged; pure ans simple. It started with the bogus Gronk holding call; the Patriots were about to walk away with the game and the refs changed the momentum.

Many game were rigged with original refs but this was so blatant that it was disgusting. I turned off the game after I realized the that dice were loaded

The only game i think was rigged or might have been rigged was the 1976 playoff game against the raiders.

 

[Avenger]

You guys can scroll threw my history. I am not one who really complains at officials (maybe a handful of small gripes in my years), but THIS is different. THIS was the most poorly officiated game I have EVER seen in all my time watching football.

I am not even going to go as far as to say that's why we lost the game, because I think there were horrible penalties and non-penalties made in both directions (though more were against the Pats). This was rediculous. The fact that Bill was sooooooo irate at the officials after the game led me to believe that I was not the only one thinking this.

Usually after the game you can sum up the refs bad night by reviewing one or two calls. If we were to look at last night's debacle, where do we begin?

Ticky tack pass interference on the Julian Edelman catch?
The same contact that's not called on the Torrey Smith 2nd TD?
How about all those non-holding penalties by the Baltimore offensive lineman that let Joe Flacco camp in the pocket?
The incorrect enforcement of offsides on a punt?
Spotting the Manahoona-(whaveter his name) catch at the two yard line? He almost scored, didn't he?
Taking an official measurement timeout when the ball was a good yard (at least) short of the first down.
Phantom pass interference call to sustain a Baltimore drive early in the second quarter on 3rd and 6.
Phatom holding call on McCourty that gave them a first down instead of them having a 3r and 15.



ok, there were some that went in the Pats favor too

15 yard unsportsmanlike conduct for typical 'after the play' skirmishes.
Illegal contact call at the end of the game that erased a big interception.

The illegal contact call on the int should have been holding, not ic.

 

[brdmaverick]

Taking a step back from my anger and bias as a Pats fan......I think the NFL should be concerned as a whole. You have a nationally televised rematch of the AFC Championship Game, and of all things THE REFS are the story at the end of the game.

 

[FredFromDartmouth]

Were I to believe games are deliberately rigged by the refs, I would enrich my life by eliminating time wasted watching the NFL and even worse, being on Patsfans.

Why would anyone stay involved in a rigged game?

It boggles the mind.

How much is bet on each game every Sunday? How much are the refs paid? You do the math. Do you really think that the refs were calling it straight last night? Ha. Even the announcers were appalled. The game was rigged ...whether it was to please the home town crowd or the gamblers I cannot say but it was rigged.

I am sure you think if could never happen but look at basketball.

 

[zeroakuma]

How much is bet on each game every Sunday? How much are the refs paid? You do the math. Do you really think that the refs were calling it straight last night? Ha. Even the announcers were appalled. The game was rigged ...whether it was to please the home town crowd or the gamblers I cannot say but it was rigged.

I am sure you think if could never happen but look at basketball.

The announcers were appalled because the replacement refs suck. There is major betting in all sports.

You sound like a delusional fan who has too much of the drink in him/her. :bricks:

 

[brdmaverick]

First of all, spell check.

Second, you sound like a Raven's fan. There was pass interference on that Brady pass that was intercepted.

Do you not remember, or are you a Ravens' fan in disguise?

Seriously? After reciting all of the terrible calls and non calls that DID NOT go in our favor, that is your response (that I must be a Ravens fan in disguise)? Oh, as for the spell check. I have no problems admitting that it's not perfect, but I didn't know it needed to be for an online sport forum (or are you my third grade teacher in disguise?).


By the way, that was ILLEGAL CONTACT that was called on the play that nullified Brady's interception, or don't you remember? In case my memory failed me, here it is straight from the play by play.


3-9-NE 32 (2:28) (Shotgun) 12-T.Brady pass short right intended for 83-W.Welker INTERCEPTED by 21-L.Webb at NE 40. 21-L.Webb to NE 40 for no gain (87-R.Gronkowski). PENALTY on BAL-21-L.Webb, Illegal Contact, 5 yards, enforced at NE 32 - No Play.

 

[PatsSox363804]

They called the personal foul on Ngata for diving on Brady and Harbaugh was screaming at the side judge. Right after that was the Gronk hold, Edelman OPI, and Mayo DPI which turned the entire game.

 

[zeroakuma]

The call made was illegal contact but what should have been called was pass interference.

 

[PatsSox363804]

The call made was illegal contact but what should have been called was pass interference.

Or holding, they had to call something there because he was holding Welker until the second he caught the INT. Would have been worse to have a no call than the wrong call except for the fact that it just makes them look like the can't do their jobs correctly, yet again.

 

[ForThoseAboutToRock]

Future replacement ref:

 

[brdmaverick]

I am one that believes you cannot blame losing a game based on one or two bad calls. Complaining about the refs is usually a sign of loser mentality. If you cannot win the game because of 1-2 bad calls, then you really didn't deserve to win.

But, this was very different. The inconsistency of the calls was just atrocious. The players are out there and do not know what will draw a penalty and what won't. Nevermind the hits of defenseless receivers and blows to the head. So many non-calls mixed in with so many phantom calls that it just is way too much.

You make a great point, NUNCHUCK. The inconsistency with which the refs were calling and not calling penalties is the equivalent of a baseball umpire changing his perceived strike zone every inning.

 

[JohninLynn]

By the refs the Pats seemed to be burnt,
But perhaps a great a lesson was learnt:
You can made up for all
The fouls that weren’t called
Just by calling more fouls that weren’t

 

[Hazy]

If I hadn’t seen the game I would have said a 1 point loss to a good team away from home in a hostile environment would have been a decent effort but we were robbed of a fair game. I think its harsh to blame this defeat on anybody but the refs.

In a game that was going to be so close, it was the bad officiating that decided it. I have seen many comments (not here) saying its sour grapes from the Pats fans as both teams we're playing with the same refs ffs. I hate this bipartisan BS, like the sporadic officiating was exactly equally bad on both teams. I felt the Pats had way more bad calls called on them than the Ravens.

I dont remember any bad calls on the Ravens that were major turning points, while on the Pats I saw a good few. The major one was the phantom call on McCourty for defensive PI on a 2 and 16. It should have gone to 3 and 16 and a very hard conversion for the Ravens but it ended up 6 points for the Ravens.

The holding call on Gronk that brought back a 1st down and the offensive PI on Edelman which brought back another 1st down where clearly defensive PI should have been called, the Pats had to settle for a FG on that drive instead of a chance for 7. Exact opposite of the Ravens luck on the McCourty play.

The other, probably not so bad but considering what was called against the defense as PI was Torrey Smiths push off on McCourty for the TD. Again in a normal game it probably doesn’t get called but I felt hard done by the inconsistency. How can you not call that after all the other calls?

 

[NinjaZX6R]

I've never in my life ever heard of a 2 yard DPI flag on a defensive player ever.

Spikes Holding was BS. Pitta held Spikes more than Spikes held Pitta.

 

[Patriot_in_NY]

After 10 hours to sober up and sleep that ugly game off....... I've thought more about it.

Last night, there was a lot of visceral emotion when I posted this thread. A lot of it was disgust at the officiating, but there was a healthy dose of post-loss ranting. This morning though. I'm actually okay with the loss part. The Ravens are a great team, one of the best in the NFL. I had mentally chalked this game up as a potential L anyway, so from that perspective it's certainly not as devastating as the Cardinal loss (which I had penciled in a win on).

All that said, since the loss itself is not that big a deal to me. The WAY we lost is. All I'm left with is disgust at the NFL for letting the situation get to this point. About what? $$. So I guess all this talk about player safety and integrity actually don't amount to ***** because you are willing to put your game into the hands of people so blatantly not qualified to run it. I'm convinced that someone is going to get seriously hurt out there very soon, and when they do, it will be because of incompetence on the behalf these replacements, and ultimately on the greed of the NFL and the owners.

As for the outcome of the games. It's really not even the # of penalties, or even the total yards. The real stat to look at is that 13 first downs came specifically of penalties. Considering that teams average between 20-28 first downs in a whole game, NOONE can pretend that 13 penalty awarded first downs did not have an impact on the game. Not to even mention "penalty reversed 1st downs". Does anyone ever track that stat? Anyone can piss and moan about a call here, or a call there....... but the shear volume of bad calls brings this game outside of the norm.

That's something NONE of us should except.

 

[Rob0729]

Gresh brought up a good point last night about the refs

Andy Gresh did actually bring up a good point last night about the refs. Even though the refs made bad calls for both teams, the calls that went in the Pats' favor tended to be on first downs which just gave the Pats better position on the field, but most of the calls the Ravens got were on second and third downs when they needed to be bailed out.

Looking back at the game, the Ravens were bailed out by a lot of calls (some right, some questionable), but I can't remember a single stalled drive by the Pats' bailed out by a call.