Pre-Game Thread- Bills @ Pats (Thursday Night)

[Pats2000]

must win, Mac/offense is going to have to put up 28+ to win this game. the nick folk show isn't going to cut it. it amazes me how many people on this forum are perfectly happy with Folk kicking 5 field goals every game....it's mind numbing

We are currently the 30th ranked offense in red zone efficiency. In the last 3 games we have only gotten into the EZ <15% of the time. They better have a breakout game in terms of that if we want to win

 

[PScottman]

We are currently the 30th ranked offense in red zone efficiency. In the last 3 games we have only gotten into the EZ <15% of the time. They better have a breakout game in terms of that if we want to win

It's a risk reward proposition. Their RZ offense is even more conservative than the rest of their approach right now. Every team knows they're going to run on first down, shotgun alignment WR/TE screen on second down, and then (usually) hold the ball waiting for someone to get a three step separation (which rarely happens in the RZ) or RB check down on third down.

The entire approach is about protecting the ball (at least to me) with the least risky throws in football. Is that Mac's early season recklessness? Likely some. Is it Patricia's "engineer mindset" (love that BTW whoever coined it) which values safety over risk? Likely some. Is it the unsettled and poorly executing OL? Likely some as well. Is it BB not wanting to further damage his QB's confidence by putting him in risky situations where failure and success are not as balanced? Also probable.

Winning against teams that are more talented is probably not going to happen without taking some risks. Can they explode in the Patriots' face? Absolutely - we've already seen the terribly timed pick-6s from riskier throws, but we also have seen zero reward recently as well with production in the red zone an all time low for the Pats.

The Vikes won in large part due to trust and risk - Jefferson was well covered and even double covered on some throws. The odds weren't in the offenses favor, but they threw it anyway and the kid made the plays.

I'm not saying chuck it up for grabs (which is what the first four games of the year were...back foot desperation heaves to no one in many cases), but sometimes for this team to take the next step they will have to throw it to the guy that's covered and trust him to win the matchup. (I dunno...maybe not Parker or Agholor....on second thought it was their non-wins that led to some of those early year INTs...maybe Meyers, Rham, and Henry?)

 

[PatsFan2]

This needs to be McCourty's last season. Too many Pats fans could beat him in a foot race.

And a hit race too love his love tap on a WR in a obvious clean up situation. Devin just doesn't hit at all for a Safety.

 

[h0c2000]

Could’ve gone better but certainly could’ve gone a lot worse. Admittedly, I thought he had fewer catches.

He had one of the top 30 games by a receiver this season so far. If they were focused on taking on Cook, that was a huge defensive coaching blunder because Jefferson owned this defense.

 

[1960Pats]

And a hit race too love his love tap on a WR in a obvious clean up situation. Devin just doesn't hit at all for a Safety.

He's clearly one of Bill's favorites. Otherwise he would have been shown the door too early rather than too late.

 

[PatsFan2]

Getting everyone ready for a Saturday:

Bill's have a #1 WR in Diggs who will get his like Jefferson. And a legitimate #2 WR In Gabe Davis who's better than any Patriots WR Meyers included. Yeah that Gabe Davis torched KC for 200 in the playoffs.

 

[PatsFan2]

Here's something worth watching IF Meyers can't go I don't think we have a snow balls chance in hell. Two deep coverage takes Parker away. Bourne is next to useless and Thornton is Rookie: slim pickings there for Mac against the SB favorites.

 

[Pats2000]

It's a risk reward proposition. Their RZ offense is even more conservative than the rest of their approach right now. Every team knows they're going to run on first down, shotgun alignment WR/TE screen on second down, and then (usually) hold the ball waiting for someone to get a three step separation (which rarely happens in the RZ) or RB check down on third down.

The entire approach is about protecting the ball (at least to me) with the least risky throws in football. Is that Mac's early season recklessness? Likely some. Is it Patricia's "engineer mindset" (love that BTW whoever coined it) which values safety over risk? Likely some. Is it the unsettled and poorly executing OL? Likely some as well. Is it BB not wanting to further damage his QB's confidence by putting him in risky situations where failure and success are not as balanced? Also probable.

Winning against teams that are more talented is probably not going to happen without taking some risks. Can they explode in the Patriots' face? Absolutely - we've already seen the terribly timed pick-6s from riskier throws, but we also have seen zero reward recently as well with production in the red zone an all time low for the Pats.

The Vikes won in large part due to trust and risk - Jefferson was well covered and even double covered on some throws. The odds weren't in the offenses favor, but they threw it anyway and the kid made the plays.

I'm not saying chuck it up for grabs (which is what the first four games of the year were...back foot desperation heaves to no one in many cases), but sometimes for this team to take the next step they will have to throw it to the guy that's covered and trust him to win the matchup. (I dunno...maybe not Parker or Agholor....on second thought it was their non-wins that led to some of those early year INTs...maybe Meyers, Rham, and Henry?)

You're forgetting the most important part. The bad decisions and poor accuracy and mechanics by Mac for most of the year. Having the right mechanics and ability to make good decisions under pressure is a key trait for good QB's. That has been lacking as well

 

[JarOfMayo51]

He's clearly one of Bill's favorites. Otherwise he would have been shown the door too early rather than too late.

He's been a team captain for years, and one of the top 3-4 elite safeties in the entire league for most of his career

I didnt think they would extend him for the 2022 season, but im sure he's been a net positive for the development of our secondary

He should be shown the proper respect tho

 

[JarOfMayo51]

You're forgetting the most important part. The bad decisions and poor accuracy and mechanics by Mac for most of the year. Having the right mechanics and ability to make good decisions under pressure is a key trait for good QB's. That has been lacking as well

It wasnt lacking in the Vikings game, he was very efficient with the football and made some big time throws... His WRs let him down in quite a few cases, as well as all the offensive penalties, special teams giving up a td, etc

 

[Tunescribe]

IF Meyers can't go I don't think we have a snow balls chance in hell.

Keep your fingers crossed on that, you can get to bed early.

 

[JMC00]

9 catches, 139 yards and a TD isn't owning?

Outside 3 catches 1 which shouldn't have even happened because the defense should have been off the field no he didn't really "own". His 15.4 ypc was his 6th best game of this season, his 9 rec was his 5th best game this season, his yards were 5th best for a game for him this season
For the WR he is which is arguably the best WR in the game right now he pretty much had a mid-tier game based on his season so far and it was a game where he had the benefit of playing at home and against a defense on 2 days prep.

 

[Tunescribe]

You're forgetting the most important part. The bad decisions and poor accuracy and mechanics by Mac for most of the year. Having the right mechanics and ability to make good decisions under pressure is a key trait for good QB's. That has been lacking as well

You want the right mechanics. I understand these guys make good decisions with (tire) pressure:

 

[ashley]

Bill's have a #1 WR in Diggs who will get his like Jefferson. And a legitimate #2 WR In Gabe Davis who's better than any Patriots WR Meyers included. Yeah that Gabe Davis torched KC for 200 in the playoffs.

The thing your not taking into consideration is BB will always take your number one option away. Against Buffalo I believe it will be Diggs. Against Minnesota, he wanted to take away Cook, which he did. I believe he thought we'd get a better pass rush and could double Jefferson and limit him. Usually an effective strategy, this time it didn't work.

 

[h0c2000]

Outside 3 catches 1 which shouldn't have even happened because the defense should have been off the field no he didn't really "own". His 15.4 ypc was his 6th best game of this season, his 9 rec was his 5th best game this season, his yards were 5th best for a game for him this season
For the WR he is which is arguably the best WR in the game right now he pretty much had a mid-tier game based on his season so far and it was a game where he had the benefit of playing at home and against a defense on 2 days prep.

So much for the days of taking away a team's best weapon. Let's just have that player have a better than average game for himself against a paper tiger good defense.

 

[JMC00]

So much for the days of taking away a team's best weapon. Let's just have that player have a better than average game for himself against a paper tiger good defense.

What an absolute pink hat doom and gloomer you are. Is this your weekly "coming out from under your bridge" to moan about the terrible Pats No one is forcing you to continue to watch the "terrible" Patriots.

Take away Pierre Strong's bonehead play and Jefferson would have been shutdown in the 2nd half to a tune of 3 targets, 2 rec 8 yards and a false start. i.e. they made the proper adjustment and Jefferson did jack **** in the 2nd half if Pierre Strong wasn't dumb. piss off, ya uneducated troll

 

[h0c2000]

What an absolute pink hat doom and gloomer you are. Is this your weekly "coming out from under your bridge" to moan about the terrible Pats No one is forcing you to continue to watch the "terrible" Patriots.

Take away Pierre Strong's bonehead play and Jefferson would have been shutdown in the 2nd half to a tune of 3 targets, 2 rec 8 yards and a false start. i.e. they made the proper adjustment and Jefferson did jack **** in the 2nd half if Pierre Strong wasn't dumb. piss off, ya uneducated troll

Bury your head some more, the defense was great. That's nice "pink hat" talk.

 

[signbabybrady]

So much for the days of taking away a team's best weapon. Let's just have that player have a better than average game for himself against a paper tiger good defense.

As Ashley pointed out they did take away Cook. You can argue wether that was the right choice to focus on but there was purpose to what they did. And they made adjustments in the second half on Jefferson.

 

[mgteich]

We are currently the 30th ranked offense in red zone efficiency. In the last 3 games we have only gotten into the EZ <15% of the time. They better have a breakout game in terms of that if we want to win

I agree that red zone efficiency is the key to the rest of the season.

 

[1960Pats]

I think we're far enough into the season to get a feel for where this team is right now. With the soft schedule in the beginning it's difficult to gage exactly how strong they are.

Before the season most of us figured that the defense would be ahead of the offense and that's where we are. The problem is that neither of them is performing as well as expected. The offense hasn't improved at all and the defense is below average against the run and a little above average vs the pass. Luckily they aren't giving up too many points so they're still in the hunt.

It wouldn't take a heck of a lot of improvement to make a serious playoff run.