OT: how would you rank these pre 1980’s quarterbacks?

[Zarozzor]

Was talking with a friend last night and he brought up a good point about how when people rank the greatest quarterbacks of all time, it’s usually very biased towards modern quarterbacks and the older guys usually get no love. How would you rank the following from 1-4?

Otto Graham
Johnny Unitas
Bart Starr
Roger Staubach

 

[Boomer B]

Not qualified to rank. Never saw one of them play.

 

[Deus Irae]

1. Bart Starr
2. Otto Graham
3. Johnny Unitas
4. Roger Staubach

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

1. Graham
2. Starr
3. Unitas
4. Staubach

 

[Pat the Pats Fan]

I saw all 4 play, but growing up in Baltimore, I saw Unitas and Staubach (at Navy) play many games. These guys played in a different era, where QBs got hit and hit hard. Unitas had his nose broken, came back to the huddle, shoved a clod of dirt up his nose to slow the bleeding, and called the next play. He finished the game and won.
Johnny U
Otto
Staubach
Starr

 

[Deus Irae]

This was written back in 2008, before Brady had the second half of his career, so the Brady ranking is off, but the rest holds up, at least through the top 8. You just slide Brady to #1 and slot everyone down accordingly:

The definitive list: Top 10 NFL quarterbacks

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

This was written back in 2008, before Brady had the second half of his career, so the Brady ranking is off, but the rest holds up, at least through the top 8. You just slide Brady to #1 and slot everyone down accordingly:

The definitive list: Top 10 NFL quarterbacks

Love Starr and think he's chronically underrated, as he should have been on the NFL100 and is top-4. But I don't see the case that he was better than Graham, and very much a stretch to put him over Montana IMO.

 

[Deus Irae]

Love Starr and think he's chronically underrated, as he should have been on the NFL100 and is top-4. But I don't see the case that he was better than Graham, and very much a stretch to put him over Montana IMO.

1. I waver between Starr and Montana at 2/3. I tend to pick Starr when I'm fresh off a deep comparison, and to backslide towards Montana as I get further removed from that point. Part of that is likely the bias of having seen Montana play a lot more. Part of it is forgetting to throw in the fact that Young took the 49ers to the title after Montana left (which is tough to use as a markdown, given Young's own greatness but, when you're looking to pick nits in order to rank the players at this high level, it does come into play IMO).
   
2. I don't find there to be any strong argument for Graham over Starr.

 

[Pape]

Otto Graham is a conundrum... He has the resume on paper to be the best of the four... But 4 of those championship trophy's were won in the AAFC, where the Browns were the dominant force... He had success in the NFL as well, which I don't want to overlook.... Which makes rating him difficult

The others? Unitas, Starr then Staubach

 

[AQPE]

Good to see Sammy Baugh recognized in the article Deus posted, thank you for sharing that Deus!

However, this sort of underscores the fundamental difficulty (or conundrum if you prefer) of this exercise. Other than for fun and to relieve boredom as we all self-quarantine for the next few weeks it is just really hard to come up with objective criteria to compare those guys. Google some video of Sammy Baugh and you'll see how different the ball looked when he played, which is why his throwing style was so different (thus "Slinging Sammy Baugh").

So with that accepted, my fall back is who dominated their era the most, which is also totally not objective, but for me yields the following:

1. Graham
2. Starr
3. Baugh
4. Unitas
5. Staubach

I considered adding Bradshaw and Tarkenton to this list, but concluded that Staubach's numbers were superior and we must remember that Staubach was great in college and gave 4 years of service to our country between college and the NFL.

 

[italian pat patriot]

For us !

Steve Grogan and Tony Eason

 

[Uptown]

 

[oldrover]

I saw all 4 play, but growing up in Baltimore, I saw Unitas and Staubach (at Navy) play many games. These guys played in a different era, where QBs got hit and hit hard. Unitas had his nose broken, came back to the huddle, shoved a clod of dirt up his nose to slow the bleeding, and called the next play. He finished the game and won.
Johnny U
Otto
Staubach
Starr

I’m on board with this.

You just slide Brady to #1

Homer. (jk)

 

[PatsWickedPissah]

Great topic
Partial to Unitas & Staubach but not dissing Starr though I see him as the prototypical game manager with a great run game
Did not really see Graham play

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

Brady’s six titles become even more mind boggling the more you think about it. Nine Super Bowl appearances, thirteen Conference Championship game appearances. Those are outliers amongst outliers.

 

[everlong]

Keep in mind on Staubach that he didn't start until he was 27 and much likely Brady was a drop away from one SB and an unreal play by the other team away from another. History treats him a lot more kindly if he had those extra stat padding years and 2 more rings. With those rings the argument between he and Montana is a lot closer.

Before you say I'm wrong consider Brady's legacy with two more SBs and an undefeated season. At that point even players at other positions like Brown and Rice fade into the argument backdrop.

 

[Actual Pats Fan]

Love Starr and think he's chronically underrated, as he should have been on the NFL100

Bart is not even in the top 100? Joke.

 

[Actual Pats Fan]

Great topic
Partial to Unitas & Staubach but not dissing Starr though I see him as the prototypical game manager with a great run game
Did not really see Graham play

I saw all 4 play, but growing up in Baltimore, I saw Unitas and Staubach (at Navy) play many games. These guys played in a different era, where QBs got hit and hit hard. Unitas had his nose broken, came back to the huddle, shoved a clod of dirt up his nose to slow the bleeding, and called the next play. He finished the game and won.
Johnny U
Otto
Staubach
Starr

Unitas still merits consideration for #1.

Toughness and clutch play.

I do not believe the Colts lose SBIII with him starting.

I hear you - He was hurt!! Morrall was the MVP!! Blah Blah Blah.

I feel the same about the NFCCG on January 17, 1993.

(Joe was hurt!! Young was the MVP!! Blah Blah Blah.)

49ers start Montana, Cowboys piss their pants.

 

[PatsFanSince74]

Tough to slot Graham because of the era.
I'd go with
Starr
Unitas
Graham
Staubach

Staubach drops to the bottom because he was 2 of 7 in SB's. But, 7 SB's...kind of awesome. Starr definitely #1. I just flip Unitas and Graham because, admittedly, Graham's era was before my time following the sport. Wouldn't argue hard about shifting them, tho.

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

Here’s the case for Graham:

He’s the only QB on the list who was universally considered the greatest QB by individual accolades and the greatest QB by team accolades.

Starr was magnificent in the 60s and won 5 titles. During his career, though, he wasn’t regarded as the league’s best QB. He threw a lower volume of passes, and guys like Jurgensen and Unitas overshadowed him. I’d rank him right behind Graham personally. I love Starr.

Unitas is kind of the other half of Starr. Almost unheard of for individual accomplishments, and he was a relatively successful winner (not an all-time choker like Manning, but not Starr either); he came up short in the big games often. Arguably the Colts, and not the Packers, would have been the team of the 60s had Unitas not been upset with a bunch of superpower teams

Staubach was also awesome, but due to a shorter career and the Cowboys losing twice to the Steelers, it’s hard to rank him at the top of this very exclusive list. That said. I was really glad the NFL100 put him on their list because he is very underrated by modern short-sighted evaluators. I’d rank him best QB of the 70s.

Graham was universally hailed as the NFL’s best player of the 1950s. He dominated the stat sheet, end of season awards, and championships. He played in the AAFC’s four championships, winning all 4, and then in the NFL’s 6 championship games, winning 3. Yes, that’s 10 consecutive total championship games played, and 6 consecutive in the NFL. You can’t count AAFC, but consider that the competition at the top was similar to the NFL since the Browns made the transition and dominated. The 49ers and 1st iteration Baltimore Colts also came over. I imagine if Fantasy Football was around in the 50s, Graham would have a “Gretzky” effect where the team that has the first pick has to make a ton of concessions, or you just can’t draft him.

That said, I don’t claim to be smarter than anyone and to each their own. I won’t die on the hill ranking one of the very best over other very bests. @Deus Irae has also studied QBs meticulously, and we have a similar list with just Starr and Graham swapped.