PATRIOTS NEWS NFL announces deal with Walsh; Goodell meeting set for May 13

[ctpatsfan77]

I understand that my point is most of them are choosing to emphasize the additional penalty possibility as opposed to the fact that the penalties only happen IF Falsh has a walk through tape and IF Roger believes the tape was authorized by the team.

This whole thing stinks like 10 day old garbage in the sun. Me thinks we're about to get screwed a 2nd time for nothing of any significance.

Even JEST fan Mike Greenberg--who couldn't be happier if this did blow up in the Pats' faces--thinks Walsh doesn't have any bombshells to drop.

 

[MoLewisrocks]

That's because most newspapers are going with variants of the AP story; they're not going to bother writing their own.

This all goes back to how marble mouth so poorly crafts whatever statements he makes to the media. On NFLN last night the updates were being done by one of their female reporters who kept saying that Walsh was going to show the walkthrough tape to the commissioner at the meeting... Nobody from the NFL knows what Walsh has or will produce beyond lots of stuff the team now presumes he stole because they haven't been able to talk to him prior to signing an indemnity agreement. His lawyer earlier contended he has damaging tapes and information, but he may have misconstrued the value of old signal tapes when he made that statement several weeks ago. He also characterized the audio taped conversation allegation by the team as a total fabrication, only there is language in the agreement that indemnifies his client specifically against having audiotaped such a conversation...

Goodell just mismanages his media contact. It sucks for us where this episode is concerned. It will suck for everyone once he and Upshaw start addressing the labor impasse this league is heading into. At some point thereafter is when it will cease to suck because he'll be replaced hopefully by someone of broader stature with the capacity to anticipate the effect of what he is attempting to communicate. I believe he is just trying to set the stage for everyone to accept that he will do the right thing even if it means more penalties (i.e. he's not looking to cover anything up). He just sucks at articulating his intent or his thought process (think back to his MNF sit down with Costas that later required a provate sit down the others resented to clarify what he thought he was saying as opposed to what they took from it...). He is what he is - a 5th round compromise candidate for a high profile job that should probably never be filled from within the ranks of existing middle management. He was probably a damn fine middle manager.

 

[PatsWickedPissah]

This all goes back to how marble mouth so poorly crafts whatever statements he makes to the media. ..
Goodell just mismanages his media contact. It sucks for us where this episode is concerned. It will suck for everyone once he and Upshaw start addressing the labor impasse this league is heading into. At some point thereafter is when it will cease to suck because he'll be replaced hopefully by someone of broader stature with the capacity to anticipate the effect of what he is attempting to communicate. I believe he is just trying to set the stage for everyone to accept that he will do the right thing even if it means more penalties (i.e. he's not looking to cover anything up). He just sucks at articulating his intent or his thought process (think back to his MNF sit down with Costas that later required a provate sit down the others resented to clarify what he thought he was saying as opposed to what they took from it...). He is what he is - a 5th round compromise candidate for a high profile job that should probably never be filled from within the ranks of existing middle management. He was probably a damn fine middle manager.

I'm not worried about the Walsh thing. I AM worried about the inept Commish Goodell managing the next contract with the players union. Were football to be chaotic and run like MLB, I'd stop watching the NFL. And that's after decades of fandom.

 

[Clonamery]

I'm not worried about the Walsh thing. I AM worried about the inept Commish Goodell managing the next contract with the players union. Were football to be chaotic and run like MLB, I'd stop watching the NFL. And that's after decades of fandom.

Ditto. Without making political allusions, the lack of confidence in my favorite sports leaders is all too foreboding.

 

[Zeus]

Let's face it - Commsioner Blockhead is a dunce. He has consistently fanned the flames on this with the media nitwits and in so doing has unwittingly lent credibilty to Walsh (despite the fact that Walsh has been caught in a number of lies and has sought various legal protections -including threatening to invoke his fifth amendment rights in legal proceedings).

Now we learn that Blockhead has entered a legal agreement to indemify Walsh without having any earthly idea what Walsh has to offer and knowing full well that Walsh is merely agreeing to return property he has stolen from his former employer to the league. Some deal.

From a business standpoint, tearing down the Patriots is indescribably stupid. NE put huge money in the pockets of every NFL owner last year by setting a number to television rating records. Someone explain to me how the league is better off by turning a misdeanor rules infraction into a rumor fueled scandal.

This is amateur hour at NFL headquarters. Shoot first and ask questions later is a proven failure as a management style. Put on the dunce cap Roger - you earned it.

 

[lapatsfan]

I am sooooooooooo tired of this "story."

 

[NE39]

Here is a lawyer's interpretation of hte document, and the conclusion is that is it a pretty much what is to be expected:

LINK

I don't think you can read too much about what will happen from the document, or comments by anyone about it.

 

[JAYHAWKS34]

F Walsh i'm sick of him

 

[allworldrussfrancis]

Here's how I see it:

A. Walsh has a tape of the Walkthrough.
Probability: less than one percent
Impact if true: disaster. Specter holds hearings. The Pats SB era and Dynasty is discredited across the board. Goodell is pressured to ask for a return of the XXXVI Lombardi. Belichick is finished.

Sorry but I don't know how you could read post #237 from Mo (which is also what I have been thinking form the very beginning) and think the impact is disaster. I say the probability is at least 50/50 he has a tape, but for reasons stated many, many times, this is something he made on his own or stole from other non-Patriot employees. This is why he needs the indemnity, to cover his theft and his lying.

Sure - the mere existence of the tape would bring a huge media barrage, but if the Commish punishes the Pats without looking at all the evidence, the Pats will not accept it like the last time and will instead fire back with all guns blaring. I think the Pats legal team is likely prepared to make a major move anyway, irregardless of the indemnity.

 

[blackglass3]

Another think that we really should keep in mind...this whole thing happened a couple of months after September 11th. The mediots seem to forget how high security was at the Superdome...there is no way "some guy" (who I don't believe would have had any credentials) snuck into the place and filmed some red zone practice. Security would have noticed him and SOMEONE would have come foward by now saying "Oh, yeah, I remember seeing someone with a camera there filming the Rams".


If there is a website taking bets on if Walsh has any new information or not, I would lay money on the "Not".

 

[PatsFanSince74]

Sorry but I don't know how you could read post #237 from Mo (which is also what I have been thinking form the very beginning) and think the impact is disaster. I say the probability is at least 50/50 he has a tape, but for reasons stated many, many times, this is something he made on his own or stole from other non-Patriot employees. This is why he needs the indemnity, to cover his theft and his lying.

Sure - the mere existence of the tape would bring a huge media barrage, but if the Commish punishes the Pats without looking at all the evidence, the Pats will not accept it like the last time and will instead fire back with all guns blaring. I think the Pats legal team is likely prepared to make a major move anyway, irregardless of the indemnity.

Hope you're wrong about the "50-50" chance of a walkthrough tape. If there is such a tape, no one outside this board and other loyalists will believe that it was "unauthorized." There will be a former (if disgruntled) Pats employee with a tape made by a member of the Pats staff (himself or whoever he claims made it) of a Super Bowl walkthrough. That will be all that 95% of people outside of New England will have to hear. Since the organization has already acknowledged breaking other rules, the case will be closed in the court of public opinion. As a result, the pressure on Goodell to go along with that majority will be overwhelming, from Specter to sponsors to other owners to the media, so i think you're whistling past the graveyard there.

I join those who would like the Patriots to be more active and believe that the organization has dropped the ball since September by not having an aggressive, in-your-face, crisis response strategy that addressed every false claim head on as soon as it was raised not through press releases but by making members of the organization (and other supporters) available with talking points to directly refute the outrageous stuff that has been thrown around. The fact that the greatest effort in this regard had to be initiated by people on this board shames the Patriots' management and I don't know what the folks in Foxboro were thinking.

Beyond that, though, I don't see what legal recourse the patriots have (please read to the end of my comment before responding) if the object is some sort of law suit for material damages. I'm not sure how much they've given up in their indemnification of Mr. Walsh, since we don't know what he has. However, if they are going to sue somebody for monetary damages (and not just try to get Walsh in trouble for walking off with tapes and papers, which happens every day in the business world and which is rarely if ever prosecuted unless major damages can be shown), two things will be necessary: one, they need a target with deep pockets or at least a mammoth insurance policy; two, they need to be able to quantify the damages they have suffered--to date, the team has a 98% response on its season ticket sales at dramatically increased prices (with plenty of people ready to snap up the 2%), there is no impact on their TV revenues as they are contractual and I doubt that their Merchandise sales have taken much of a hit that couldn't be explained by a second consecutive Playoff exit in disappointing fashion.

So, what damages are they going to show if they want to sue the pants off of somebody (as much as I would like them to be able to do so)? If they argue that the value of the franchise has been impaired, they would need to put it up for bid and then show that the bids were lower than prior estimates of its value, such as are found in Forbes and among Investment Bankers.

 

[ctpatsfan77]

Hope you're wrong about the "50-50" chance of a walkthrough tape. If there is such a tape, no one outside this board and other loyalists will believe that it was "unauthorized." There will be a former (if disgruntled) Pats employee with a tape made by a member of the Pats staff (himself or whoever he claims made it) of a Super Bowl walkthrough. That will be all that 95% of people outside of New England will have to hear. Since the organization has already acknowledged breaking other rules, the case will be closed in the court of public opinion. As a result, the pressure on Goodell to go along with that majority will be overwhelming, from Specter to sponsors to other owners to the media, so i think you're whistling past the graveyard there.

I join those who would like the Patriots to be more active and believe that the organization has dropped the ball since September by not having an aggressive, in-your-face, crisis response strategy that addressed every false claim head on as soon as it was raised not through press releases but by making members of the organization (and other supporters) available with talking points to directly refute the outrageous stuff that has been thrown around. The fact that the greatest effort in this regard had to be initiated by people on this board shames the Patriots' management and I don't know what the folks in Foxboro were thinking.

Beyond that, though, I don't see what legal recourse the patriots have (please read to the end of my comment before responding) if the object is some sort of law suit for material damages. I'm not sure how much they've given up in their indemnification of Mr. Walsh, since we don't know what he has. However, if they are going to sue somebody for monetary damages (and not just try to get Walsh in trouble for walking off with tapes and papers, which happens every day in the business world and which is rarely if ever prosecuted unless major damages can be shown), two things will be necessary: one, they need a target with deep pockets or at least a mammoth insurance policy; two, they need to be able to quantify the damages they have suffered--to date, the team has a 98% response on its season ticket sales at dramatically increased prices (with plenty of people ready to snap up the 2%), there is no impact on their TV revenues as they are contractual and I doubt that their Merchandise sales have taken much of a hit that couldn't be explained by a second consecutive Playoff exit in disappointing fashion.

Walsh clearly does not have the large pockets necessary for anything other than making his life miserable.

Essentially, the only practical targets of a lawsuit regarding this would be the Herald and possibly E*PN; if you do a search here for "libel", you'll find the threads on which we discussed that issue (at least with respect to the Herald). Also, if you search for "actual malice," you'll see that the Patriots might not need to show actual damages.

 

[FootballFanetic]

Walsh clearly does not have the large pockets necessary for anything other than making his life miserable.

Essentially, the only practical targets of a lawsuit regarding this would be the Herald and possibly E*PN; if you do a search here for "libel", you'll find the threads on which we discussed that issue (at least with respect to the Herald). Also, if you search for "actual malice," you'll see that the Patriots might not need to show actual damages.

What you're all forgetting is that truth is a defense to libel--and perhaps that's why the Pats haven't been more aggressive in this regard either. They just preferred to lay low and hope it goes away. Call me a troll all you want, but that is also among the possibilities here--perhaps we'll soon see....

 

[flasox27]

You are correct about truth being a defense against libel but Walsh is a proven liar and thief. Keep in mind that walsh has no defense against the commonwealth of Massachusett for illegally taping conversations with Pioli.
Just keep on fantasizing troll.

 

[BSR]

What you're all forgetting is that truth is a defense to libel--and perhaps that's why the Pats haven't been more aggressive in this regard either. They just preferred to lay low and hope it goes away. Call me a troll all you want, but that is also among the possibilities here--perhaps we'll soon see....

Who says they haven't been aggressive? Remember the Patriots had to agree to the idemnity. It could very well be that they only agreed to it so that they can see if Walsh has anything. It would be silly to file anything before then. Plus many of the comments from the Pats Org have addressed that column directly.

 

[allworldrussfrancis]

What you're all forgetting is that truth is a defense to libel--and perhaps that's why the Pats haven't been more aggressive in this regard either. They just preferred to lay low and hope it goes away. Call me a troll all you want, but that is also among the possibilities here--perhaps we'll soon see....

Then why is he insisting on the indemnity? Because he is a known liar and his word against 50 members of the most respected organization in football will not hold water.

Don't worry, no matter what he has, the media will spin it into another spygate maelstrom and you can sit back and enjoy. Until the fall that is when our team crushes yours into the ground just like last year.

 

[Tbrady12to88]

Hope you're wrong about the "50-50" chance of a walkthrough tape. If there is such a tape, no one outside this board and other loyalists will believe that it was "unauthorized." There will be a former (if disgruntled) Pats employee with a tape made by a member of the Pats staff (himself or whoever he claims made it) of a Super Bowl walkthrough. That will be all that 95% of people outside of New England will have to hear. Since the organization has already acknowledged breaking other rules, the case will be closed in the court of public opinion. As a result, the pressure on Goodell to go along with that majority will be overwhelming, from Specter to sponsors to other owners to the media, so i think you're whistling past the graveyard there.

I join those who would like the Patriots to be more active and believe that the organization has dropped the ball since September by not having an aggressive, in-your-face, crisis response strategy that addressed every false claim head on as soon as it was raised not through press releases but by making members of the organization (and other supporters) available with talking points to directly refute the outrageous stuff that has been thrown around. The fact that the greatest effort in this regard had to be initiated by people on this board shames the Patriots' management and I don't know what the folks in Foxboro were thinking.

Beyond that, though, I don't see what legal recourse the patriots have (please read to the end of my comment before responding) if the object is some sort of law suit for material damages. I'm not sure how much they've given up in their indemnification of Mr. Walsh, since we don't know what he has. However, if they are going to sue somebody for monetary damages (and not just try to get Walsh in trouble for walking off with tapes and papers, which happens every day in the business world and which is rarely if ever prosecuted unless major damages can be shown), two things will be necessary: one, they need a target with deep pockets or at least a mammoth insurance policy; two, they need to be able to quantify the damages they have suffered--to date, the team has a 98% response on its season ticket sales at dramatically increased prices (with plenty of people ready to snap up the 2%), there is no impact on their TV revenues as they are contractual and I doubt that their Merchandise sales have taken much of a hit that couldn't be explained by a second consecutive Playoff exit in disappointing fashion.

So, what damages are they going to show if they want to sue the pants off of somebody (as much as I would like them to be able to do so)? If they argue that the value of the franchise has been impaired, they would need to put it up for bid and then show that the bids were lower than prior estimates of its value, such as are found in Forbes and among Investment Bankers.

You nailed it- all of it.

Anyone who thinks that there will be any amount of giving the Patriots the benefit of the doubt is wrong. Instead they will be crucified at even the Falsh mention of a Rams taping let alone the damnation that will take place if he can produce a tape. It's pie in the sky to think that the letter of the agreement will be honored in that event- it won't be, it won't be possible because the public backlash won't allow it. Goodell would have no options but to cut Bill's head off on live TV for the viewing audience or else his league would take such a beating it would take years to recover. You can't very well have the entire world believe the commissioner of the sport is taking the side of a cheater which is what would be the perception.

This has tragedy written all over it- all Falsh has to do is claim that he was asked to tape the Rams walkthrough and we are dead. All we can do is hope he's not the complete sleazeball we all think he is and he says he has nothing more than what is already known.

I scoff at the notion that the state would prosecute him, there's not a chance in hell that will happen without an individual with direct connection- i.e. Pioli, Kraft, or Bill- bringing the charges and the chances of that happening are about as good as Mike Vick matching Tom's td total this year. Talk about your pr nightmares we would be run out of the league on a rail.

 

[lorijean]

I think Walsh cannot just say he taped the Rams..he actually has to have a tape. And I do not believe he does.

 

[Tbrady12to88]

I think Walsh cannot just say he taped the Rams..he actually has to have a tape. And I do not believe he does.

He absolutely can just say it, so long as he isn't lying. You can't prove a negative. He's been granted a license to make any claims he wants. He could claim Bill had him poison McNabb and that's why he was throwing up and no one can do squat to him for saying it- can't prove it's a lie.

I'm pretty peeved that we signed off on this. Probably another issue where Goodell was out maneuvered and ended up giving up way more than he should have because he was chicken sh!t of Specter's repeated mental menstrations.

 

[peterforpats]

[/I]If walsh had no confidienciality clause with the pats and the pats agreed along time ago not to sue for TALKIng ,then he must have a tape of something-with permission or without,Goodell as judge and jury will crucify the pats. Iwish I could see a good ending to this, but I think we all know this will end badly. i will always love the pats , but this hubris could have been prevented and that is the real shame of all this.