Mike Vrabel reveals whether Patriots will run a 3-4 or 4-3 defense

[Real fan 02]

A one score blow out? EWith Brady at QB? C'mon man. Again, I was there. In spite of the 4 Int's (the last one really was on Faulk) the Pats showed every indication they'd take it to OT until they turned it over with @ 1;30 left. Brady had a brutal game. Zone was def the way to play vs Harrison and Wayne, the idea was to keep them out of the end zone. We might've gotten away with playing those two straight up with Gonzo and Davis but with ol' 'play the ball not the wideout' Ass-ante and Ellis Hobbs? NFW you're going man against those 2 assassins with them at corner.

I'm with you bro.. I'm not your adversary LOL..said it felt..like more than a 27-20 loss.. but you were at the game so I can't argue anything.. nothing beats seeing a game live!

We're you at the playoff game when we played man and we picked off Manning 3xs? And held indy to 3 points?

 

[TheRainMaker]

NFL defenses are like the NBA - there's no identity and they all are built the same way.

It's extremely difficult to run a 3-4 in todays game with players smaller and no true run stuffing NT's like Vince Wilfork. Remember Bill had to finally scrap it in the early 2010's after trying to make it work from 2008-2010? He then brought it back a hybrid from 2019-2023. This team looks built for a 4-3 or 4-2-5.

 

[Kasmir]

When Fairbanks introduced the Bullough 3-4 (Oklahoma 5-2 with stand up defensive ends), Ray Hamilton was playing NT at 250lbs, which was light for 2-gapping even back then (Hannah was 265 and Lenkaitis was 250 for instance).

I remembered -- and Grok verified -- Hamilton saying that he was "moving on every snap" and almost always played 1-gap technique in coordination with Nelson and Hunt particularly. It was a hybrid defense because Julius Adams and Dave Rowe were usually 2-gapping in the base defense.

So in the modern re-introduction of the 3-4 by Fairbanks/Bullough in 1973 it was a hybrid.

The (old) Houston Oilers introduced their own 3-4 in 1974, because they that year signed 265lb all-pro Curly Culp at NT and he enabled successful 2-gap technique because of his size and strength.

Update: I had always believed that because the Dolphins/Arnsparger "53" 3-DL defense was not a base defense, their base defense was a 4--3. But Grok says that the base defense for their early Superbowl's was a 2-gap 3-4 with Bob Heinz at NT and Manny Fernandez (265 lbs) foreshadowing Seymour at DE. VernDenherder was the other DE at 245 lbs.

So Fairbanks and Bum Phillips are falsely credited with introducing the 3-4 -- according to Grok, which is a wonderful tool that is seldom wrong with prompts like this. Check it out.

Caution: Grok made some errors that I exposed under further questioning. In particular, Fairbanks introduced the 3-4 in 1974, not when he arrived in 1973. See details in my follow-on post below.

 

[maust]

I'm with you bro.. I'm not your adversary LOL..said it felt..like more than a 27-20 loss.. but you were at the game so I can't argue anything.. nothing beats seeing a game live!

We're you at the playoff game when we played man and we picked off Manning 3xs? And held indy to 3 points?

Got a lot more use out of our ST's back then lol, our sons and grandsons use 'em now. I went to most home games back then and ofc all the home playoff games. IIRC the Pats did not play straight man in that one, Poole and Law were both out and Troy 'My Man' Brown was playing more than you'd like awkwardly covering slot receiver Stokely. It was a real mixed bag of mostly disguised coverages. The D had a hella game but I'd be lying if I said the weather didn't help. For all their gaudy in season stats the dome loving Dolts were Charmin soft in the snow

 

[patfanken]

3-4, 4-3, 5-2, just terminology for the fans and media. Given the size and skill level of the skill players and blockers these days it would be IMPOSSIBLE to stop an offense today running a static standard defense like you used to be able to do 20 years ago. Especially with all the rules that favor the offensive side of the ball.

The ONLY way a defense has a shot a stopping even a moderately skilled offense is to try and confuse then by never lining up in the same positions for more than a couple of plays in a row. That is why we get so many personnel packages and wholesale continuous substitutions during the game. So many watching so much movement by the defense prior to the snap. The radical look that Bill showed us using those "amoeba" swarm Defensive looks are no longer radical.

So, remember those press conferences are given to placate the media and fans NOT to give insight and information. You do NOT want people to know what you are doing, let alone announce it in a press conference in ****ing May.

So Vrabel's comment that the Pats will be a 3-4 based team has the same importance in reality that the sky is falling because Maye threw 4 picks in a shorts and t-shirt practice 2 months before TC. That is none at all.

 

[Real fan 02]

Got a lot more use out of our ST's back then lol, our sons and grandsons use 'em now. I went to most home games back then and ofc all the home playoff games. IIRC the Pats did not play straight man in that one, Poole and Law were both out and Troy 'My Man' Brown was playing more than you'd like awkwardly covering slot receiver Stokely. It was a real mixed bag of mostly disguised coverages. The D had a hella game but I'd be lying if I said the weather didn't help. For all their gaudy in season stats the dome loving Dolts were Charmin soft in the snow

 

[Real fan 02]

@maust Ty most definitely played... your thinking About 05.. at Pittsburgh.. Ty hurt his ankle and was out..

 

[JohnJH]

I believe that Vrabel and Williams will be running a game plan defense. Thier scheme will be a one-gap, But they won't be like..say Pittsburgh in never adjusting to what an offense is doing.

Sure. Vrabel and Williams will always be making adjustment's.

 

[maust]

@maust Ty most definitely played... your thinking About 05.. at Pittsburgh.. Ty hurt his ankle and was out..

The Pats held Manning to 3 points at home in the snow in January of '05. Feel free to PM if you feel the need to discuss, we really shouldn't derail this thread further. I may be an inconsiderate richard at times but this shouldn't be one of them.

 

[TomPatriot]

Huh, i didn't think milton williams was a 3-4 kind of guy, he seems a better fit for the 4-3

https://www.masslive.com/patriots/2025/05/mike-vrabel-reveals-whether-patriots-will-run-a-3-4-or-4-3-defense.htm

Mike Vrabel says the New England Patriots will be running a 3-4 structure for their base defense. However, he notes that the distinction doesn’t matter as much in today’s NFL.


During an appearance on “The Triple Option” podcast with Urban Meyer and Mark Ingram II, the Patriots coach was asked what type of defense his team plans to run this year.
Mike Vrabel

Interesting. I seem to recall a few people who said that 4-3 and 3-4 distinctions weren’t relevant anymore and were summarily dismissed.

 

[Ring 6]

I think it has been pretty well reported the D will play 1 gap and the LB's will need to play east to west rather than north to south.
I do believe we see 4 players on the LOS. White, Barmore, Williams, Landry/Jennings.
I also believe we see more 3 Safety schemes than 3 CB schemes.

Vrabels history is 3 corner nickel not 3 safety nickel

 

[Real fan 02]

Vrabels history is 3 corner nickel not 3 safety nickel

Ring, your right.. but Vrabel has never had an all pro CB like gonzo, now he does. I can easily see a combination of peppers, Dugger, and Woodson on some formations. To your point gonzo, Jones and Davis will be the starting 3 CBs.

 

[Real fan 02]

Interesting. I seem to recall a few people who said that 4-3 and 3-4 distinctions weren’t relevant anymore and were summarily dismissed.

As I mentioned to ring 6.. a few things i'm looking at.. is Vrabel’s never had an all pro at CB like he has in gonzo, I feel like the overall scheme is a one-gap. But will also be a game plan defense. I can see 3 CB formations and 3 safety formations as well. This defense is so multiple they can match up with any offense.

 

[Real fan 02]

Sure. Vrabel and Williams will always be making adjustment's.

@PatsFan2 @JohnJH @signbabybrady

Be nice to get back to one of these games again..

Throwback Highlights: Patriots 2003 AFC Championship Win Over Colts

 

[Ring 6]

Ring, your right.. but Vrabel has never had an all pro CB like gonzo, now he does. I can easily see a combination of peppers, Dugger, and Woodson on some formations. To your point gonzo, Jones and Davis will be the starting 3 CBs.

Why would having Gonzales make him change his scheme at nickel?
I think what you will see is against running teams in early downs Duggar or peppers will become the 4th LB and the nickel replaced by a S but that’s not happening more than a handful of snaps. I also think Epps is miles ahead of Woodson. I would expect much out of Woodson this year other then special teams.
Mapu could figure into this mix too. If think he gets moved to LB.

 

[Ring 6]

Interesting. I seem to recall a few people who said that 4-3 and 3-4 distinctions weren’t relevant anymore and were summarily dismissed.

When ?

 

[Real fan 02]

Why would having Gonzales make him change his scheme at nickel?
I think what you will see is against running teams in early downs Duggar or peppers will become the 4th LB and the nickel replaced by a S but that’s not happening more than a handful of snaps. I also think Epps is miles ahead of Woodson. I would expect much out of Woodson this year other then special teams.
Mapu could figure into this mix too. If think he gets moved to LB.

Good analysis.. gonzo factors in here because he's the all pro that's never coming off the field and will always take whatever side of field away.. so therefore you can be more multiple and exotic.. Epps IMO projects more as a camp possibly STs player.. Woodson was drafted to be a contributing player. Spillane and landry are 3 down players they aren't coming off the field IMO

 

[Real fan 02]

As I mentioned to ring 6.. a few things i'm looking at.. is Vrabel’s never had an all pro at CB like he has in gonzo, I feel like the overall scheme is a one-gap. But will also be a game plan defense. I can see 3 CB formations and 3 safety formations as well. This defense is so multiple they can match up with any offense.

@signbabybrady

Check your PM.

 

[Triumph]

I think it has been pretty well reported the D will play 1 gap and the LB's will need to play east to west rather than north to south.
I do believe we see 4 players on the LOS. White, Barmore, Williams, Landry/Jennings.
I also believe we see more 3 Safety schemes than 3 CB schemes.

Todays Defenses are all about pass rush.

The Eagles just put on a clinic totally destroying the Chiefs - though KC was crippled at OL. The Philly DL said that they prided themselves on not adding additional pass rushers and stuck with 4 guys getting the job done. The Pats will no doubt mix it up and add a pass rusher or 2 on occasion.

Who doesn't love a Safety blitz?

 

[Huckleberry1]

NFL defenses are like the NBA - there's no identity and they all are built the same way.

It's extremely difficult to run a 3-4 in todays game with players smaller and no true run stuffing NT's like Vince Wilfork. Remember Bill had to finally scrap it in the early 2010's after trying to make it work from 2008-2010? He then brought it back a hybrid from 2019-2023. This team looks built for a 4-3 or 4-2-5.

Which is why most here see it as more of a base that is easier to adapt all of their hybrid packages to on the fly than an actual 2 gap 3-4 defense that they use predominantly. And Vrabel said they would only use it about 20% of the time, which would probably be on first downs, with them switching to their other packages for 2nd and 3rd down. My guess is that it also has to do with how much Barmore, Williams, and White are expected to be on the field. The DL would be more constant while the edge guys and defensive backs come in and out, depending on packages they are using that day against the opposing offense.