Malcolm Butler Mega Thread

[DaBruinz]

Yes, but it wasn't listed that he missed the flight because of anything other then he was sick and was coming the next day.

More things have come out, such as him cleaning out his locker after the team left..

 

[YOUGOTMOSSED]

Hypothetical question: If you knew for certain a miscreant player (particularly one who had played in all the other games during the season) would be the difference in winning the SB, would you play him?

Secondary question: If you're not going to play him, why activate him?

It's impossible to know "for certain." Life doesn't work like that.

 

[Kdo5]

And, if by "manning up" he paints Butler in a horrific light, costing him millions, then what? HUH?

Seriously, stop acting like a spoiled brat and thinking you are owed anything. You aren't.

He already embarrassed Butler in the worst of ways. He also embarrassed himself. Let's not pretend that Belichick is looking out for Butler's best interests.

You are right though, I am not owed anything. Belichick owes his players for ****ing up however.

 

[Brady6]

No. You can't. The fact is that you have no clue what would have happened and you're deluding yourself to claim otherwise.

You are ignoring the fact that the Eagles play-calling would have changed if Butler had been in there and there would have been no guarantee that the Eagles wouldn't have done the same thing.

Or you can just go back to the other game Rowe started over Butler and see that Brees threw for 356 yards. Or you could take a look at the turnaround in the secondary took place in the games Rowe missed. Upon his return the secondary returned to its previous form making Cutler look like an all pro and then Rowe and Richards allowing JuJu Smith-Schuster to break off a play for 69 yards that would have cost us the game if not for the James catch being overturned.

 

[Soliel]

Minnehan on the radio this morning said his sources inside the Patriots said Belichick has soured on Butler's play over the year and wanted to bench him during the AFC Championship game, but was talked out of it. He decided a few hours before the Super Bowl, after watching him in practice all week, he was benching him and informed Patricia. The coaches and the players did not know, which confirms what Rowe said that he didn't know he was starting until an hour before the game.

The source said the players aren't happy and that it may have cost them the Super Bowl. This was based more on his play then any disciplinary action. For what it's worth, Minnehan's source has given him some good info in the past that Minnehan broke.

If this is true and Butler was benched more for play then some huge indiscretion then this loss is 100% on Belichick's arrogance and if I was a player who has given their all this year I'd be extremely pissed.

Hypothetical question: If you knew for certain a miscreant player (particularly one who had played in all the other games during the season) would be the difference in winning the SB, would you play him?

Secondary question: If you're not going to play him, why activate him?

This question Really depends on severity of offense.

1. Butler misses meeting and literally did stay out past curfew and was drunk and or stoned. No, I would neither play him and would probably just send him home.

2. If it’s just a bad practice and I’m upset about his play then I may sit him until I saw this nightmare going down then I’d try him just to see if he could pull off a stop

3. If it’s like one guy saying all it was is women and weed. It’s hard to say bro. I mean with the league and the utter crap storm that would happen if it was discovered. I don’t know what I would do.

That’s the thing though . B.B. has to of been faced with something dire to do this and refuse to adjust. Or, maybe I’m wrong and the guy just missed a meeting and B.B. said to hell with your bs Malcolm. I don’t see it this way though, I think it’s many things

 

[Froob]

This makes sense

Barstool Sports

 

[alvinnf]

I’m sorrry if they are over your head

Dude, you have been blathering on with this nonsense for 10 years. Everything you know about football is done through a google search. I think it's funny, it's not over my head, just funny, like funny haha.

 

[Simpelton]

Sitting MB was a dumb move.

No one is questioning the winning culture,

You just did.

 

[RobertWeathers]

Sitting MB was a dumb move.

I disagree for reasons I've already stated

No one is questioning the winning culture, but we are saying this game was not one of BB's finest moment. Especially considering how great Brady was on Sunday

Wrong- By saying its OK to play Malcolm you are questioning the winning culture.

 

[DaBruinz]

So you're saying it's OK to sacrifice the SB in order to enforce some sort of future discipline?

How about the damage that does to the rest of the team knowing that their coach did not deploy all available weapons in order to enforce some sort of discipline? What does that now do the perception of the Pats as a winning organization when it comes to recruiting free agents?

WOW.. Considering that there is absolutely NO guarantee they'd have won if Butler was dressed, your question is worthless. There was no "sacrificing a SB in order to enforce discipline".

What damage? You honestly think that the other players are going to be pissed at Belichick for benching Butler if he did, indeed, break a plethora of team rules, including missing Saturday's Team Meeting?

The perception is that the Patriots team rules are the Patriots team rules and that no one is above them. They've been the same for 17 seasons. As Richard Seymour. Ask Wes Welker. Ask Randy Moss. Ask Adalius Thomas. Ask Jamie Collins. Ask Jabaal Sheard. If you think that this somehow changes that perception, then you just don't understand integrity.

 

[mosslost]

Any future free agents will look at what happened and make their decision accordingly

god i hope not.. no free agent will want to join a team whose coach is willing to cough up a Super Bowl so some future 30 for 30 might talk about his toughness

 

[luuked]

Giardi has a pretty extensive take here: Giardi: Malcolm Butler Benching Was "Culmination Of Events"

Excerpts that were of interest to me:

He was sick and he wasn’t able to fly with the team. As far as I’ve been told, there was no B.S. there. He didn’t miss the flight. That was, ‘We’re quarantining you because we do not want you in that little tube with everybody else.’

The missed flight doesn't sound like anything that was on him.

“Talking to a couple of ex-players, if you violate the rules, you’re gone. It doesn’t really matter who you are. I think bottom line is if they didn’t dress him, they would have had three active corners on the roster, and they didn’t feel like that was smart business against that team that lines up with at least three wide receivers on almost every single play.

As most people assumed he was dressed as an emergency player that would only hit the field if absolutely necessary. If Jonathan Jones was still healthy there was a good chance Butler is inactive.

“As far as marijuana goes, I’ve had different people say yes, no – so I’m not reporting that,” Giardi sad. “I’ll just say this: When it comes to marijuana, I don’t think it’s a big deal. I don’t think it’s a big deal for the team.

Weed is still in play but no clear confirmation yet.

“The curfew thing is real,” Giardi said. “I don’t know how dramatic the curfew miss was, but I will tell you that in talking to players both current and past that Bill has a few rules, and that is a big one. There is a no tolerance for missing curfew, just as if there’s no tolerance for having (non-team members) on your floor during game week. Nobody’s supposed to be up there. That is a team space and it’s for team personnel and players only.”

Not only did he miss curfew he also brought "someone" back to his room. Both are no tolerance things. This kinda meshes well with that odd Reiss article from summer where he emphasized vaguely that most other players on the team are married with children.

I think the other thing, too, is Malcolm is someone that has frustrated them for a long time. I think that contributed to the fact that they weren’t willing to extend him to the length that he wanted to be extended to at the end of last season. I think that’s what prompted them to go out and get Stephon Gilmore

He’s always been someone that they’ve had to put in extra work with to get him to be part of the program, to participate in the program the way they wanted him to participate in the program. I think this is a culmination of a lot of events and a lot of frustration that, unfortunately for him – and unfortunately, I guess, for the team – reared its head Super Bowl week.”

It seems like the tight lips at Foxboro have held back quite a lot of things Butler was up to throughout his stay here. And it all came together in one big bang in his final game because he could not maintain himself during SB week for a few more days.

 

[Soliel]

This makes sense

Barstool Sports

That’s the most sensible thing so far really.

These “other things” not being known it’s still hard to come to a concrete decision on weather B.B. completely screwed up or did he do this to avoid another storm of lost picks, fines and suspensions.

 

[luuked]

Dude, you have been blathering on with this nonsense for 10 years. Everything you know about football is done through a google search. I think it's funny, it's not over my head, just funny, like funny haha.

Sounds a lot like projecting. Not that Andy and I are particularly friendly most of the time but the last thing you should call out is his football knowledge.

 

[Steve102]

god i hope not.. no free agent will want to join a team whose coach is willing to cough up a Super Bowl so some future 30 for 30 might talk about his toughness

I think you're selling players short. I am sure there's free agents out there who will, upon hearing BB's first hand account of why, will want to win more than anything in the world.

I think there's far more who want to get paid big $$$ and could care less about winning. I think there's plenty out there who look at where is the best night life, where are the honeys, and how much fun can they have. But, for a select few, there's a crappy little corner in Massachusetts that cares about winning and not much else.

 

[SalemPats]

The perception is that the Patriots team rules are the Patriots team rules and that no one is above them. They've been the same for 17 seasons. As Richard Seymour. Ask Wes Welker. Ask Randy Moss. Ask Adalius Thomas. Ask Jamie Collins. Ask Jabaal Sheard. If you think that this somehow changes that perception, then you just don't understand integrity.

Welker benching was dumb, Seymour was traded to get a high pick and because he was expensive.

Lets be honest their is no winning culture without Brady.

 

[DaBruinz]

Hypothetical question: If you knew for certain a miscreant player (particularly one who had played in all the other games during the season) would be the difference in winning the SB, would you play him?

Secondary question: If you're not going to play him, why activate him?

Well, first, BB isn't so arrogant to believe that a single "miscreant player" would be the difference between winning and losing the SB. At best, he'd weigh the options and assign a percentage. While also considering the other factors.. Trying to ignore the other salient factors in a decision like this is just a way to bias the narrative.

In the case of Butler, i believe it was for injury purposes only. Remember that the Pats had already lost Jonathan Jones and Cyrus Jones on the season. This left them short-handed at CB.

 

[fxmallon]

No matter who you believe, why to hell was Butler on the sideline and part of the 46-man roster if he wasn't going to play. We lost Cooks early and we could have lost other players, so we sacrifice a possible backup in exchange for a more explicit humiliation of Butler. Were all seven inactives so bad that BB preferred a wasted player on the sideline? C'mon, no way.

I'm with those who believes Butler's absence messed up the whole backfield defense, and almost certainly cost us the game.

 

[SalemPats]

I disagree for reasons I've already stated



Wrong- By saying its OK to play Malcolm you are questioning the winning culture.

He could have sent him home or made him a scratch. Why was he only told after warmups. This was not BB's finest moment

 

[Chris Stevenson]

Giardi has a pretty extensive take here: Giardi: Malcolm Butler Benching Was "Culmination Of Events"

Excerpts that were of interest to me:



The missed flight doesn't sound like anything that was on him.



As most people assumed he was dressed as an emergency player that would only hit the field if absolutely necessary. If Jonathan Jones was still healthy there was a good chance Butler is inactive.




Weed is still in play but no clear confirmation yet.




Not only did he miss curfew he also brought "someone" back to his room. Both are no tolerance things. This kinda meshes well with that odd Reiss article from summer where he emphasized vaguely that most other players on the team are married with children.





It seems like the tight lips at Foxboro have held back quite a lot of things Butler was up to throughout his stay here. And it all came together in one big bang in his final game because he could not maintain himself during SB week for a few more days.

Pretty much everything we suspected,. I was wrong questioning the flu, but how it all sounded, and how unreported his quarantined flight was, I absolutely was questioning it.

This will do a number on Butler's FA status, that is for sure. Someone got into his head and told him he was a #1 lock down Revis CB, which clearly, he is not.

Everyone knows this. I am sure Sean Peyton was wondering if Butler had a screw loose as well with his contract demands, knowing a 1st rd pick at rookie money deal is right there waiting.

Butler got awful advice, his head exploded, he never got over it, and he sabotaged our team's week of focus.

I was wondering why the Pats were leaking out things like "The team looks focused". when they never say stuff like that.

Great. Now, we know why.

Thanks for SB 49 and your Pro Bowl 2015 season, but no thanks to the delusion and greed, which ends up becoming a cancer.