Lawson or Carpenter?

[R_T26]

I would rather have Lawson, when i think of Carpenter I think of the word "gerneric' dont know why. Lawson is a freak, kinda reminds me of a Merriman type. Carpenter may be the surer thing, but lawson has more upside. Also someone asked earlier, Hawk is being regarded as an ILB in a 3-4.
and dont forget Greenway played under ferentz, so he has a BB connection there.

 

[maverick4]

re

But I've looked at his Sack totals and that don't compare to Bobby or Manny.

Lawson looks like a possible Willie replacement, but the Pats also need an ILB, and Greenway seems like a great future Tedy replacement.

.

 

[PATRIOTS-80]

Carpenter. Or Greenway if he is there.

http://www.nfldraftcountdown.com/scoutingreports/olb/bobbycarpenter.html

Carpenter is more polished than Manny, having played 4 years at the OLB position. He's also 256 lbs. Ideal for our scheme because that's the same as Vrabel, Big Willie and Colvin. Manny and Greenway are little light at 242 and 241.
Besides he does an "excellent job" in pass-coverage, according to the link. Which is what BB needs from a LB. Besides he could in the future be put inside.

Manny, Wimbley and Kiwianuka are project DE learning a new position. Carpenter is more of a immediate sure thing who could start week 1.

 

[R_T26]

we should'nt worry about the wait to much, because an NFL conditiong program can add 10 pounds or so. @ 242 thats workable. But lawson also played on the other side of Mario Williams.

 

[PATRIOTS-80]

Just for reference concerning the size and weight of our LB

54 Tedy Bruschi LB 6-1 247
95 Tully Banta-Cain LB 6-2 254
47 Ryan Claridge OLB 6-2 259
59 Rosevelt Colvin LB 6-3 250
50 Mike Vrabel LB 6-4 261

By contrast Beisel is a little small, and that is why the Pats told him to put on weight.

52 Monty Beisel LB 6-3 238
49 Eric Alexander LB 6-2 240
51 Don Davis LB 6-1 235

Manny does have more upside, but right now he's just a speedy pass-rusher.

 

[BionicPatriot]

I dunno, as of right now, I'll say Greenway. I just have a real feeling about this guy, I think he'll be special. Honestly, I'd be happy with any of the 3, because I think any of them will turn into fine pros. But without a doubt, Lawson looks just like Merriman.

 

[PATRIOTS-80]

Manny's link

http://www.nfldraftcountdown.com/scoutingreports/de/mannylawson.html

Greenway's link

http://www.nfldraftcountdown.com/scoutingreports/olb/chadgreenway.html

To be honest, I'd be happy with any of the three.

 

[MrTibbs]

Why isn't anyone talking about this guy here?

Chris Gocong Cal Poly


http://www.nfldraftcountdown.com/scoutingreports/de/chrisgocong.html

 

[Remix 6]

Lawson ran a 4.43 in the 40...a DE/OLB that fast. a lot of players moving from DE to OLB are criticized about run stopping but hes got a solid core of players around him if he comes here.

you say Manny benefited from playing next to Mario? Well how about Carpenter benefiting from playing next to Hawk on opposite side?

 

[CrazyDave]

Parham is dropping and he's a solid ILB.... we can get him in the 3rd round..

He looks interesting. Rd 3 might be a good deal.

 

[ayjackson]

Carpenter. Or Greenway if he is there.

http://www.nfldraftcountdown.com/scoutingreports/olb/bobbycarpenter.html

Carpenter is more polished than Manny, having played 4 years at the OLB position. He's also 256 lbs. Ideal for our scheme because that's the same as Vrabel, Big Willie and Colvin. Manny and Greenway are little light at 242 and 241.
Besides he does an "excellent job" in pass-coverage, according to the link. Which is what BB needs from a LB. Besides he could in the future be put inside.

Manny, Wimbley and Kiwianuka are project DE learning a new position. Carpenter is more of a immediate sure thing who could start week 1.

somebody finally mentions Wimbley...he'll be a beast at 3-4 OLB, whereas i think Kiwi is being looked at by some 4-3 teams.....Wimbley is rocketing up boards going as high as 12 i think....

 

[maverick4]

re

What is great is that this year's draft is rich in LB's. The more I think about it, the more I realize this Pats team is already ridiculously stacked. If the Pats picked only LB's and WR's in this draft (along with a late-round kicker), I would have no problem at all. Or, if the Pats traded all of their many picks just to take the top 2 LB's and top WR, that would be fine as well.


.

 

[NH #1 Pats Fan]

I kind of thought we would have some good discussion on this. I am also torn. I can't help of think of Lawson as a better replacement for Willie in a mold of a Jason Taylor (except more of an OLB then a DE).

Also, Abdul Hodge may be there at the top of round 3. Word is he is the best pure ILB in the draft. Could learn the position from some of the best as he matures setting the PATS up well for the future. :eat1:

 

[big mike]

Lawson does have more upside, but is somewhat more of a risk - Carpenter is more of a sure thing. As there are some other potentially great DE-> OLB converts that would be there later in the draft (Ryan LaCasse, 260 pounds, ran a 4.47 40 time, could be had in the 3rd or 4th, depending on how much his stock rises), I'd prefer to take Carpenter in round 1. His relationship with Vrabel helps out, and Carpenter could play either OLB or ILB in the 3-4. He's basically a young Vrabel.

And then in the 3rd through 5th round grab 2 of:
Ryan LaCasse (DE->OLB convert with stellar size and speed, not that different from Lawson in terms of raw numbers - a tad slower, but 20 pounds heavier)
Kai Parham (ILB. Dropping due to being slow, but speed isn't as important for a 3-4 ILB as it is for a 4-3 MLB)
Chris GoCong (OLB)

Trade a 3rd round pick for Javon Walker, and in the second round grab Joseph Addai, and I'm one happy camper. Pick up an OT and/or OG and a TE on day 2 as well.

 

[jgb95]

You think that A Hodge makes it to the 3rd round????

Even our early thrid I think is way to much to ask.

This kid is very good and will more than likely go mid 2nd.

 

[Box_O_Rocks]

Why isn't anyone talking about this guy here?

Chris Gocong Cal Poly


http://www.nfldraftcountdown.com/scoutingreports/de/chrisgocong.html

Most draftniks have him going in the 3rd round, I'd like to target him with Baltimore's pick, trading up a bit if we had to. I think this kid has the most "Bruschi" potential in the draft - excellent nose for the ball in the Shrine Game, High School QB and LB, played NT his sophomore year at Cal-Poly SLO before moving to DE and exploding his last two years - a pretty decent apprenticeship I'd say.

we should'nt worry about the wait to much, because an NFL conditiong program can add 10 pounds or so. @ 242 thats workable. But lawson also played on the other side of Mario Williams.

And had much higher production then Carpenter who played across from a lesser none player called Hawk. The more apt point for Lawson is to look at how well he did in terms of his production playing with a super talent across from him - wouldn't he do as well with a lesser talent such as Colvin or Vrabel on the other side?

 

[big mike]

You think that A Hodge makes it to the 3rd round????

Even our early thrid I think is way to much to ask.

This kid is very good and will more than likely go mid 2nd.

More than likely. THe issue is that this year is loaded with LBs. And while many teams are looking at LBs, it's not a top priority for more than perhaps 6-8 or so. Once you get into the second round, it becomes very difficult to predict where people will be taken. Guys you expect to go in the 2nd can easily slip into the 4th - it depends entirely on what teams are looking for. Hodge is someone on that bubble - where he could be taken in the 2nd, or if the teams that may take him then aren't looking so much at LB, he could easily slip into the 3rd, or even later. The large number of good LBs this year is going to result in a few LBs we expect to go in the 2nd round falling into the 3rd or even later. I can see Hodge being one of those guys.

 

[PATRIOTS-80]

Greenway, Carpenter, Manny

Those are the three I think could be at 21 that would be worth considering.

The thing to remember is that the Romeo is in front of us, and a lot of mocks have him draft McG.'s replacement, which means that he has first dibbs.

The other thing to remember is that BB is a defensive specialist who loves the 3-4 defense with its LB play. He knows exactly what the technical requirements he needs from a 3-4 LB, and either he will see it on film or he won't (something we don't really have the luxury of seeing).

A point that somebody brought up on the draft forum is that McG. really was not in coverage all that much, and was mostly either rushing the passer, or setting the edge, or hitting a receiver coming out of the backfield (something a rookie could do his first year). Besides if we draft a rookie LB, he probably will subbed out for a CB alot (I see the rookie being subbed out before Colvin).

Another issue is that it is not a good WR year for that ideal, protypical #1 WR, but its a great year for those little runts in the lower rounds that nobody likes but BB!!!!

Another point is that its a great LB year, one of the best ever!!!! This is the year we get younger at LB -- an issue pointed out in the past on the board in great detail. I think we pick LB at 21.

 

[PATRIOTS-80]

The reason I say "technical requirements" is because I'm pretty sure that there is a difference between what BB needs from OLB in his scheme, and what is required from OLB in a 4-3.