It All Starts Up Front

[yukon cornelius]

He has said a couple of times in interviews he wants to come back.

He's also said the surgery is experimental and they're hoping for the best

Wanting too.....being ready when the season starts.....being able to come back at all......3 very different things

 

[Headcase]

I thought this was done a while ago honestly and the fact he could just bail because “they made me work hard” or wtfh ever made him do it, worries the fk out of me. Was there any specific reason he was quoted saying? Other than it being a **** show and him playing a position that wasn’t his natural one….but, good riddance.

I know I've read that the reason was a disagreement on how he would be used....he was a RT in Pitt for 5 years, came here and they wanted to move him to LT....he apparently told them it was going to take time for him to make the change, he looked bad at LT, something happened and he left.

He wasn't a world beater by any means, but he did have starting NFL experience at RT, if they had just left him there the line would have been marginally better.

Note on FAs and the Draft.....get/take guys that played the position you expect them to play.

 

[n1997y]

And great QB, WRs, and RBs always make their o-lines look better.

Howd that work out last night?

The team with the better RB's and WR's won so I say it worked out pretty good.

Yeah but…

You didn’t say great WRs RBs and QB always win, just that they make it OL look better. Last night KC o line looked like crap.

 

[XLIX]

Yeah but…

You didn’t say great WRs RBs and QB always win, just that they make it OL look better. Last night KC o line looked like crap.

That's because KC's o-line is crap. Statistically they look better than they are because their QB is so elusive and does an unbelievable job avoiding sacks, but even the almighty Mahomes took a career high 36 sacks this year, not to mention being sacked every other play yesterday.

 

[BennyBledsoe]

Or at the very least, both sides have to be willing to take the time to make a position switch.

 

[imahobgoblin]

I know I've read that the reason was a disagreement on how he would be used....he was a RT in Pitt for 5 years, came here and they wanted to move him to LT....he apparently told them it was going to take time for him to make the change, he looked bad at LT, something happened and he left.

He wasn't a world beater by any means, but he did have starting NFL experience at RT, if they had just left him there the line would have been marginally better.

Note on FAs and the Draft.....get/take guys that played the position you expect them to play.

Why did you leave out that he got benched in Pittsburg while playing RT? Thats the whole point. He stunk there too.

 

[Pape]

He already had this cuff repaired, and this time it didnt tear off the bone.....either the tendon blew up or the tendon tore at the muscle attachment, so they tried an experimental surgery that entailed placing an artificial sheath over the repair

His return is very much in doubt

we will wait and see i guess

 

[bakes781]

That's because KC's o-line is crap. Statistically they look better than they are because their QB is so elusive and does an unbelievable job avoiding sacks, but even the almighty Mahomes took a career high 36 sacks this year, not to mention being sacked every other play yesterday.

They did draft Kingsley who I liked but I guess he didn't work out as a Tackle and may be relegated to guard.

Kingsley Suamataia reflects on his first NFL season, chasing a Super Bowl ring and BYU’s success

The former Cougar left tackle has found a new home in Kansas City, even amid rookie struggles.

www.deseret.com

 

[1960Pats]

It is very easy to talk about how "it all starts up front" when you have a great QB, an all-world RB, and 2 great WR's.

Patrick Mahomes is an all-world QB and the ChiRefs have been almost unstoppable for a few years now.

The Philly lines on both sides dominated this game from start to finish.

 

[bakes781]

The Eagle's domination points to a key lesson - it all starts up front. Four DL guys each capable of winning one-on-one, and a massive OL that gives your QB time to throw and allows you to run the ball. Obviously the Eagles didn't run much, but the threat of the run still played a big part in the game.

So my plea - forget the fancy divas for the WR room, and use the draft to strengthen the OL and DL. There are a lot of great edge players in the draft.

So we need two tackles, and if Barmore comes back (and he is apparently in training) then two more on the DL to go with White. So four new players could transform the team - add one mid-level WR and you actually have a team that will win a decent number of games, especially now we have a full suite of competent coaches.

Anyone disagree?

Completely agree!

It would seem very hard to NOT get at least 1 if not 2 solid DL from this class.

OL could be a bit more difficult, but there are some massive mountain size options....

Hollin Pierce - Rutgers 6' 8", 344



Anthony Belton - NC State 6' 6", 336

 

[KCSVEN]

Typical knee jerk reaction to a Super Bowl winner. It is always "lets copy what they did!"

The Eagles line could not block for the run game, gave up 35% pressure rate and people say the Eagles O Line won the game so the way to win is to build the O Line? Might be true but this game did not prove that.

They won this game because of the ability to get enough pressure with the front 4, but based on the % of actual wins in the pass rush was heavily aided by the incredible coverage the DB's were giving.

Mahomes has 3.24 seconds to throw. He threw 2 horrible picks. Hurts had 3.6 to throw and threw a bad pick.

Mahomes was never a great processor, thus the running around, but makes up for it with great play calling, scrambling ability and an incredibly strong and accurate arm.

The data from this game shows drafting Travis Hunter to go with Gonzalez would allow the pass rush to get there. It also shows that you have a 4 man rush than can get there in 3-4 seconds the DB's can then cover. They go hand in hand.

The reality is the Eagles were stacked at all positions. If you can get to the QB, even if it takes 3-4 seconds with a 4 person rush and have 7 in coverage along with an elite corner or 2, yeah you can stop the offense, especially one that didn't score 30 points all year.

Seems like all this Super Bowl proved is you have to have really good players, so drafting or signing player solely for need is not a good approach. Patriots have all kinds of needs, you are not passing up Travis Hunter for Mason Graham or Wil Campbell because you need to build the line, you are taking the best player. But this is also why you overpay for the best players in free agency, talent wins.
It all starts with the QB, #1 CB, Good Edge Rusher, WR1 and LT.

 

[bakes781]

Typical knee jerk reaction to a Super Bowl winner. It is always "lets copy what they did!"

The Eagles line could not block for the run game, gave up 35% pressure rate and people say the Eagles O Line won the game so the way to win is to build the O Line? Might be true but this game did not prove that.

They won this game because of the ability to get enough pressure with the front 4, but based on the % of actual wins in the pass rush was heavily aided by the incredible coverage the DB's were giving.

Mahomes has 3.24 seconds to throw. He threw 2 horrible picks. Hurts had 3.6 to throw and threw a bad pick.

Mahomes was never a great processor, thus the running around, but makes up for it with great play calling, scrambling ability and an incredibly strong and accurate arm.

The data from this game shows drafting Travis Hunter to go with Gonzalez would allow the pass rush to get there. It also shows that you have a 4 man rush than can get there in 3-4 seconds the DB's can then cover. They go hand in hand.

The reality is the Eagles were stacked at all positions. If you can get to the QB, even if it takes 3-4 seconds with a 4 person rush and have 7 in coverage along with an elite corner or 2, yeah you can stop the offense, especially one that didn't score 30 points all year.

Seems like all this Super Bowl proved is you have to have really good players, so drafting or signing player solely for need is not a good approach. Patriots have all kinds of needs, you are not passing up Travis Hunter for Mason Graham or Wil Campbell because you need to build the line, you are taking the best player. But this is also why you overpay for the best players in free agency, talent wins.
It all starts with the QB, #1 CB, Good Edge Rusher, WR1 and LT.

You could argue that the coverage helped, but coverage can only assist for so long. You need to pressure a good QB. If Jameis Winston were the QB sure you can get away with it because you can always count on him chucking it up into coverage, but Mahomes is obviously on an elite level. That said if you gave Mahomes: Saquon Barkley, AJ Brown and DeVonta Smith he still wasn't going to win that game.

 

[1960Pats]

Mahomes had to deal with constant pressure from only 4 DL. That left 7 in coverage.

Hurts had plenty of time and they scored 40 points.

It's interesting seeing fans here try and make this game about anything other than the lines.

 

[Real fan 02]

Patriots Releasing OT Chukwuma Okorafor

Field Yates reports that the Patriots are releasing OT Chukwuma Okorafor to give him a head start on finding a new team. Okorafor intends to play for a new franchise in 2025 after he was

nfltraderumors.co

I thought he was already released

 

[Real fan 02]

Mahomes had to deal with constant pressure from only 4 DL. That left 7 in coverage.

Hurts had plenty of time and they scored 40 points.

It's interesting seeing fans here try and make this game about anything other than the lines.

100% correct. This off season absolutely positively is about reinforcing the line of scrimmage. I as a fan truly believe this. Vrabel wants a tough OL and tough DL.. utterly embarrassing watching both lines last season.

 

[Real fan 02]

You could argue that the coverage helped, but coverage can only assist for so long. You need to pressure a good QB. If Jameis Winston were the QB sure you can get away with it because you can always count on him chucking it up into coverage, but Mahomes is obviously on an elite level. That said if you gave Mahomes: Saquon Barkley, AJ Brown and DeVonta Smith he still wasn't going to win that game.

Your right Mahomes is elite.. but he hasn't looked like the same guy he was 2 seasons ago. Having guys on the D line like Carter and Williams allows the LBs to make plays.. Philly took the approach that I'm confident Vrabel will in reestablish the LOS. We have the coaching and QB in place the most important thing a franchise has to have now of course it's about adding quality starters and back ups to the roster.

 

[Pape]

I thought he was already released

Kept him on the roster so he couldn't get picked up anywhere else... Petty move maybe... But I liked it

 

[Pape]

Your right Mahomes is elite.. but he hasn't looked like the same guy he was 2 seasons ago. Having guys on the D line like Carter and Williams allows the LBs to make plays.. Philly took the approach that I'm confident Vrabel will in reestablish the LOS. We have the coaching and QB in place the most important thing a franchise has to have now of course it's about adding quality starters and back ups to the roster.

He hasn't looked the same because they have been struggling to replace Reek... And kc was dumb enough to let Orlando Brown go with out a bona fide replacement LT... That bit them in the ass on Sunday

 

[KCSVEN]

You could argue that the coverage helped, but coverage can only assist for so long. You need to pressure a good QB. If Jameis Winston were the QB sure you can get away with it because you can always count on him chucking it up into coverage, but Mahomes is obviously on an elite level. That said if you gave Mahomes: Saquon Barkley, AJ Brown and DeVonta Smith he still wasn't going to win that game.

Like I said it all goes hand in hand. You can't have the Pats pass Rush and have 5 seconds to throw.
Mahomes time to throw all year average: 2.81 seconds
Mahomes time to throw Super Bowl: 3.24 seconds
Guys were not open right away like they normally are for the Chiefs.
Chiefs annually are close to #1 in the NFL in % of throws to open receivers.

They disrupted the Chiefs timing and were able to get pressure once first read wasn't there. If first read was there would not have mattered on the pass rush.

Brady in 2007: 2.50 Seconds and one of the higher years due to waiting for Moss downfield. Did the line need to be that good? No, was probably overrated due to Brady.

 

[bakes781]

Like I said it all goes hand in hand. You can't have the Pats pass Rush and have 5 seconds to throw.
Mahomes time to throw all year average: 2.81 seconds
Mahomes time to throw Super Bowl: 3.24 seconds
Guys were not open right away like they normally are for the Chiefs.
Chiefs annually are close to #1 in the NFL in % of throws to open receivers.

They disrupted the Chiefs timing and were able to get pressure once first read wasn't there. If first read was there would not have mattered on the pass rush.

Brady in 2007: 2.50 Seconds and one of the higher years due to waiting for Moss downfield. Did the line need to be that good? No, was probably overrated due to Brady.

I did see him miss some wide open targets on occasion that night. But overall I agree that they were out coached as well. If they tried to run the ball to keep them from spreading out so wide they might have had a chance to at least keep it close.