ILB Additions

[sebman2112]

If BB didn't recognize the problem at receiver last year, he wouldn't recognize the difference between a football field and his own toilet. (Which would still make him twice the coach as Herm Edwards.)

They thought Branch was going to come back, so his leaving is what messed everything up. Funny thing is I wanted them to trade for Stallworth last year.

 

[DW Toys]

There are only 11 linebackers on the roster right now, so I think chances are they add a couple more.

It seems unlikely they will sign Ed Hartwell, but if they did I would support it. Apparently the Pats contacted his agent early in free agency and I think if something were going to happen it would have happened already.
MA
I hope they resign Seau. He far exeeded my expectations and proved that despite his age he can still play. Even if we only use him part time, he is worth having.

What about Barry Gardner? I think he had a shot of making it into the ILB rotation last year (a least occasionally) before he broke his leg in preseason. He is free agent. Does anyone know anything about what his plans are? He could be worth resigning.

Can anyone think of other possibilities?

Cousin,
I have a trade that could be made in one second and would help two teams with my explanation of each player involved and why I would do the deal if I were the Pioli and Savage.

NE PATRIOTS-
FACT:THE PATS DEFINITELY NEED AN ILB AND THE DRAFT CHOICES, UDFA AND PRESENT ROSTER DOES NOT FILL THAT NEED.

FACT:WE HAVE A LOG JAM AT OT. WE SIGNED BRITT TO A NEW CONTRACT. WE PICKED UP A POSSIBLE FUTURE RT STARTER IN THE DRAFT AND WE HAVE ONE OF OUR OT'S WE CAN LEVERAGE IN A TRADE.

FACT: THE PATS DID NOT DRAFT OR OBTAIN A SS IN THE FA MARKET NOR SIGNED ANYONE IN THE UDFA POOL TO WORK IN TO REPLACE RODNEY. IF ANYONE SAW THE COLTS PLAYOFF GAME, MR. SANDERS NEEDS A CHANGE OF VENUE. HE PUT FORTH "0" EFFORT TO STOP ADAI IN THE CHAMPIONSHIP GAME FOR THE GO-AHEAD TD. HE IS A BACKUP AND THAT IS ALL.

FACT:ALTHOUGH DRAFTED IN THE SECOND ROUND, DE MARQUIS HILL WILL NEVER START HERE WITH THE TALENT BEFORE HIM AND HE NEEDS A NEW START TO COMPETE ELSEWHERE AS HE MIGHT BE A POSSIBLE CUT.WE DRAFTED HIS REPLACEMENT AND ANOTHER TWO UDFA PICKS.

FACT:WE HAVE A LOG JAM AT WR. FIVE HAVE CONTRACTS THAT COULD END IN 2008. CALDWELL WAS THE MOST PRODUCTIVE BUT HIS STATUS IS TENUOUS AT BEST.

FACT:NE HAS TWO QB'S PLUS A UDFA. CASSELL CAN BE GROOMED AS A SCHAUB TYPE TRADE VALUE FOR 2008 BUT WE NEED A QB TO WORK INTO PLACE.

CLEVELAND BROWNS-
FACT: THEY NEED A STARTING RT AS KEVIN SHAFER SAYS HE WILL NOT PLAY THERE AND REQUESTED A TRADE. THE NY GIANTS WOULD LIKE TO OBTAIN SHAFER BUT THE BROWNS NEED SOMEONE WHO CAN PLAY THERE.

FACT:THE BROWNS HAVE A LOG JAM AT ILB AND IN FACT HAVE PICKED UP ANOTHER IN FA IN ANTWAN PEEK WHO CAN PLAY OLB, DE AND ILB.

FACT: THE BROWNS HAVE A LOG JAM AT S. SAFETY WITH TWO VERY GOOD PLAYERS IN SEAN JONES AND BRODNEY POOL. THEY HAVE SIGNED OR PICKED UP IN THE DRAFT AT LEAST 5 NEW DBS'.

FACT: THE BROWNS HAVE A LOG JAM AT QB (SEE BRADY QUINN). THEY HOLD LEVERAGING THERE TO TRADE ONE OR PERHAPS A CUT WILL NEED TO BE MADE. I BELIEVE THEY WILL KEEP FRYE AND HE MIGHT START IN 2007 UNTIL BRADY IS READY.

FACT: THE BROWNS FAILED TO OBTAIN ANY REAL EXPERIENCED DEPTH AT WR AND HAVE LOST DENNIS NORTHCUT TO FA. WILSON HAD ONLY TWO RECEPTIONS AND WAS SUPPOSEDLY TO PLAY OPPOSITE EDWARDS. JUREVICIOUS IS 33 YEARS OLD AND ALMOST DONE. THEY NEED A DECENT NUMBER TWO OR NUMBER THREE EXPERIENCED RECEIVER FOR THE YOUNG QB'S.

FACT: THE BROWNS CAN USE BACK-UP DL HELP.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------

BLOCKBUSTER TRADE******

N.E.TRADES:

NICK KACZUR-OT= GOOD STARING LEFT OR RIGHT TACKLE TO START UNTIL THOMAS IS READY TO PLAY LEFT. THEN KACZUR PLAYS RIGHT

MARQUIS HILL-DE=BACK UP DL HELP ROMEO IS FAMILIAR WITH AND MIGHT CAN IMPROVE WITH PLAYING TIME.

JAMES SANDERS-SS=BACK UP TO JONES AT SS OR MAYBE HE IS A BETTER FS. DON'T REALLY WANT TO KNOW.

RECHE CALDWELL-WR=SOLID VETERAN PRODUCTION IN 2006. CAN HELP BROWNS YOUNG WRS AND WILL HELP HIMSELF WITH EDWARDS DOUBLE TEAMED.HIS 62 RECEPTIONS WOULD HAVE BEEN THE BEST OF THE BROWNS WR IN 2006.

-----------------------------------------------

CLEVELAND TRADES:
ANDRA DAVIS-ILB=STARTS IMMEDIATELY FOR THE PATS IN A ROTATION. GREAT PRODUCTION. STILL ONLY 28 YEARS OLD.

BRODNEY POOL-SS=FUTURE HARRISON REPLACEMENT. PLAYS THE GAME RODNEYS' WAY. A TREMENDOUS UPGRADE OVER SANDERS. A BRODNEY MUST TAKE OVER FOR A RODNEY.

DEREK ANDERSON-QB=SHOWED SOME SIGNS OF TALENT. HAS MUCH MORE NFL STARTING EXPERIENCE THAN CASSEL AT FOUR, IF GOD FORBID.........
WILL BE THE IMMEDIATE NUMBER TWO QB IF THE PATS CAN GET A DECENT DRAFT CHOICE FOR CASSEL. QUINN MADE HIM EXPENDABLE.

DW Toys

 

[cstjohn17]

Trades are fun but I am not good at figuring them out. I think they will bring in a veteran FA or two to fight for a backup spot but not until after the rookie camp.

Names (not all good names but a list of names)
http://insider.espn.go.com/nfl/fa?p...tp://insider.espn.go.com/nfl/fa?positionId=30
- Short, Hartwell, Seau, James Allen, Foreman, Godfrey, Irons, Huff, Kacyvenski, Tim Johnson, Singleton, Taylor, Torrey)

Throw them into the Octagon, winner takes 1 spot and the winner of the Warren/Lua undercard takes the other.


From Reiss "The team has a rookie minicamp scheduled for May 12-13, a full-team minicamp June 5-7, and the offseason program extends through June 22."

 

[AzPatsFan]

I could see a trade with Philly for Trotter, who they are trying to phase out.

 

[Ochmed Jones]

I really don't see BB trading for anymore bodies anytime soon, however I would not be surprised to see him trade excess bodies to other teams for draft picks (or conditional draft picks) after the first game or tow of the preseason schedule. Kind of like what he did with Gorin last season.

 

[PATRIOTSFANINPA]

I hadn't thought of that but that's worth a shot for both teams - but I've felt a trade was one of the best routes we could go for awhile now.

Rookies usually need time to learn our system. Much better to trade for an established veteran (yes I know about Beisel) that already has some of the fundamentals.

Look for BB to pick up some training camp roster cuts to try them out here too

Generally we're OK at LB but having another guy or two for depth and to rotate, giving BB the fleixibility he needs to move AD around. We get that and I think we've got a helluva shot at a perfect season.

Perfect Season?..I don't know how you can even expect anything like that,Its ridiculous - 12-4 most likely and even if we had the best 4 LBs in the league we will NEVER go 19-0...Dreaming is free - Reality check needed buddy

 

[psychoPat]

I agree:


- I think it's premature to say Vrabel lost a step, but some would disagree.
- I think Rosey's 8.5 sacks in the NEP defense is comparable to his 10.5 at Chicago.
- I think Adalius is a pretty decent signing.
- I think the Coaches are happy with Alexander's development.
- I think Seau can be had.
- I expect at least one more veteran signing as clubs trim down for training camp.


I DISagree:

- I think it's premature to say Bruschi lost a step, but some would disagree.
- I wouldn't be surprised to see the Pats bringing in additional UDFA LB prospects for tryouts as clubs weed through their rookie camp rosters.


Ya talked me into it, ya silver-tongued fox:

- I think Woods is further along than TBC was at the same point in his career.
- I think Mays is a stud ST'er, and may even be a bit ahead of Alexander at the same point in his career.
- I think Rogers, Lua, and Warren are good signings and players to keep an eye on.
- I think things aren't as bad at LB as some would believe, especially if Troy Brown's knee is doing well.Fun twist! But i thought the same thing this time last year ... and the year before that.
Well, okay. In for a penny, in for a pound!

 

[psychoPat]

I liked crazyeye's trade at first sight ...
without even knowing who Chaun Thompson is.

But DWToys' blockbuster is even better - or some facsimile thereof.

SERIOUS trade propositions require giving comparable value ... with each of the two parties happy with what it gets.
DW would offer serious value - at positions where we are oversubscribed.
That makes it realistic.

 

[DaBruinz]

- I think it's premature to say Bruschi lost a step, but some would disagree.
- I think it's premature to say Vrabel lost a step, but some would disagree.
- I think Rosey's 8.5 sacks in the NEP defense is comparable to his 10.5 at Chicago.
- I think Adalius is a pretty decent signing.
- I think the Coaches are happy with Alexander's development.
- I think Woods is further along than TBC was at the same point in his career.
- I think Mays is a stud ST'er, and may even be a bit ahead of Alexander at the same point in his career.
- I think Rogers, Lua, and Warren are good signings and players to keep an eye on.
- I think Seau can be had.
- I wouldn't be surprised to see the Pats bringing in additional UDFA LB prospects for tryouts as clubs weed through their rookie camp rosters.
- I expect at least one more veteran signing as clubs trim down for training camp.
- I think things aren't as bad at LB as some would believe, especially if Troy Brown's knee is doing well.

BOX -
I have got to disagree with you on Mays. Woods is a STUD special teamer. Mays is a DUD special teamer. If I am not mistaken, Mays was the most penalized special teamer last year.... and he only played in 8 games last year.

I know you and I disagree on Alexander. I think that the Patriots coaching staff disagrees with you as well. I think that in the AFCCG, it was a case of the lesser of two evils. Basically, I mean that I believe that Alexander saw the field because having TBC on the field didn't give them enough pressure on the QB from the OLB position and that Alexander was the best of a bad crop of LBers who could attempt to cover the TE.

Had Chad Scott been available to go against Dallas Clark, I think that we would have seen the Pats in a nickle package of some sort with Scott lined up against Clark.

 

[PatsWickedPissah]

Trade Marquise Hill to the Browns for Chaun Thompson. He is further down their depth chart, and Romeo needs some depth on that defensive line. Perhaps Romeo see's Hill as a big body he could develop that would get more playing time then he is going to get here.
I dont really think they would do it but it would add depth where both teams need it

I agree that they wouldn't do it but mainly because RAC was here and could see what a useless big stump Marquise Hill is.

 

[DW Toys]

I agree that they wouldn't do it but mainly because RAC was here and could see what a useless big stump Marquise Hill is.

Cousins,
Pats-We still haven't addressed the safety issue. The Colts exposed the Pats safeties. Sanders is a joke as a starter and contrary to belief is second string material tops. We know one thing, he is allergic to Joseph Adai.

We haven't addressed the QB issue. Matt G. might be camp fodder and an arm.

We haven't addressed the ILB issue. Love the kids we are bringing in, but as someone very astutely pointed out to me, they have a 7% shot to make it.

If the Pats sign Assante, and we hope they do, they can't keep Geno too, nor should they.He's gone after 2007.

There is a log jam at WR and perhaps Caldwell is odd man out. Get something for him.

Then for the Pats FO, they have a very embarrassing 2nd round drfat choice they need to deal with that BB's buddy convinced him to take while at LSU.

The Browns-

Have a log jam at ILB with Thompson, Peak and Davis-We can use either Davos or Thompson as they are both very decent ILB rotation possibilities. RAC has a similar defense and the learning curve is minimal. It took Chad Brown a whole year and Biesel never got it.

They need back up DL help. Maybe RAC can clean up Hill's game. He's the throw in.

Brodney Poole and Sean Jones are really two SS types. Geno could work with either. RAC knows Geno very well. We need a Brodney Poole, not a James "Opps, I Missed" Sanders as the SS future. Merriweather is an upgrade over Wilson on paper.

Browns back up QB Derek Anderson would be expendable, as Frye and Quinn have the upper hand and they have another QB with experience at #3 Dorsey from FLA, who by the way, threw to Caldwell. The Pats take Anderson and groom him to back up Brady and have Cassel available as the 2008 Schaub. Anderson was not too bad in four games started. More experience that Cassel.

The Browns need one more experienced WR. Jureviciuos is 33 years old and they got rid of Northcut. Wilson had three catches. Caldwell caught more balls than anyone on the Browns other than Winslow, including Edwards.

There is no reason this deal could not happen. But then again, I am not Savage, nor Pioli.
DW Toys

 

[braveht]

But then again, I am not Savage, nor Pioli.
DW Toys

thank goodness for the 2nd part!!

 

[mgteich]

I think that bb and pioli will use whatever methods he needs including trades. We don't see the critical need for a running back. They do. I expect this to come through free agency, but a trade is certainly an option. I think a trade for a backup ILB or NT is less likely, but still possible.

I looked at the players that might be expected to be cut. I don't expect for them to have any trade value, unless we decide to cut Gaffney or Caldwell. I know that people mention the OT's, but it makes no sense to be. Kaycur, O'Callaghan and Britt will not be beaten out if they are healthy. If they are not healthy, they won't be valuable as trade bait. I see a couple of OT's on the Practice Squad, with one making the squad if say O'Callaghan head injuries are more serious that we now know (which is quite possible).

I really don't see BB trading for anymore bodies anytime soon, however I would not be surprised to see him trade excess bodies to other teams for draft picks (or conditional draft picks) after the first game or tow of the preseason schedule. Kind of like what he did with Gorin last season.

 

[cstjohn17]

Cousins,
Pats-We still haven't addressed the safety issue. The Colts exposed the Pats safeties. Sanders is a joke as a starter and contrary to belief is second string material tops. We know one thing, he is allergic to Joseph Adai.

We haven't addressed the QB issue. Matt G. might be camp fodder and an arm.

We haven't addressed the ILB issue. Love the kids we are bringing in, but as someone very astutely pointed out to me, they have a 7% shot to make it.
DW Toys

I disagree with a lot of this, working my way from to top bottom:
- Safety position is fine, the roster really has only one glaring weakness and that is depth at ILB
- I agree that Peyton Manning ripped us apart but IMO he is a sure fire 1st ballot hall of famer, top 10 of all time, not your average NFL QB
- he exposed our 4th and 5th string Safeties, who had no help from the D Line (he had all day to throw) and the ILB play was non existant as was the OLB (anyone ever hear of jamming the TE off the line?)
- no team in the NFL is 3 deep at both Safety spots
- at FS we have a 1st round pick and a player who started 2 Superbowls, I hope Hawkins doesn't have to play any snaps but as a 3rd option he is better than most
- at SS we have Harrison, Sanders (I grade him as an average starter, pretty good backup)

QB - if Brady goes down what does it matter? we may make the playoffs but a championship is out of the question

ILB - a Seau / Hartwell type would complete the picture, one of the rookies can be the 5th option (Bruschi, Vrabel, Seau, Alexander, ROOKIE), again if it comes down to option 5 at any position we are screwed

Trades - fun to play with but not a reality in football, the Cleveland LBs may look good on paper but their defense was terrible against the run, 4th worst in the league over 142 YPG. Plus I stopped reading as soon as you mentioned M. Hill....

 

[DW Toys]

thank goodness for the 2nd part!!

Oh come-on. You'd do the deal.
DW Toys

 

[AzPatsFan]

- I think it's premature to say Bruschi lost a step, but some would disagree.

Bruschii's game is/was predicated on his Jui-jitsu hand moves; having a hand in tha cast hurt more than mostand made him unable to catch INts.

- I think it's premature to say Vrabel lost a step, but some would disagree.
- I think Rosey's 8.5 sacks in the NEP defense is comparable to his 10.5 at Chicago.
- I think Adalius is a pretty decent signing.
- I think the Coaches are happy with Alexander's development.

I disagree.

- I think Woods is further along than TBC was at the same point in his career.

I concur; but TBC wasn't ready for three years.

- I think Mays is a stud ST'er, and may even be a bit ahead of Alexander at the same point in his career.

I disagreee.

- I think Rogers, Lua, and Warren are good signings and players to keep an eye on.
- I think Seau can be had.

I certainly hope that is the case. SD is changing their ILBs he might choose to stay home.

- I wouldn't be surprised to see the Pats bringing in additional UDFA LB prospects for tryouts as clubs weed through their rookie camp rosters.
- I expect at least one more veteran signing as clubs trim down for training camp.
- I think things aren't as bad at LB as some would believe, especially if Troy Brown's knee is doing well.

They still need ILB depth; although Jr would sure help.

 

[arrellbee]

- I think it's premature to say Bruschi lost a step, but some would disagree.
- I think it's premature to say Vrabel lost a step, but some would disagree.
- I think Rosey's 8.5 sacks in the NEP defense is comparable to his 10.5 at Chicago.
- I think Adalius is a pretty decent signing.
- I think the Coaches are happy with Alexander's development.
- I think Woods is further along than TBC was at the same point in his career.
- I think Mays is a stud ST'er, and may even be a bit ahead of Alexander at the same point in his career.
- I think Rogers, Lua, and Warren are good signings and players to keep an eye on.
- I think Seau can be had.
- I wouldn't be surprised to see the Pats bringing in additional UDFA LB prospects for tryouts as clubs weed through their rookie camp rosters.
- I expect at least one more veteran signing as clubs trim down for training camp.
- I think things aren't as bad at LB as some would believe, especially if Troy Brown's knee is doing well.

Appreciate you observations and perspectives. LB will be interesting to watch.