Idle thoughts - the "No playoffs for YOU" edition

[Patriot Missile]

It’s just our time to be a bad football team. We’ve been lucky, there is not one football team of the 32 that have not had to go through this at some point in the last 20 years. Its a teatament of how good we’ve had it. I’m looking at another 2-5 years of rebuilding and I’m ok with it I guess. Be a fan and watch and follow the rebirth of the Patriots is all I can say.

I remember as a kid wondering if the Patriots would ever be good. Didn’t get to experience the 70s great teams that were robbed. Then they drafted Irving Fryar and I was excited. Soon afterward they made that great push into sb 20. (Getting waxed in the process) Then the Tuna and Bledsoe. Then BB, Brady and 6 SuperBowls cementing them as one of the greatest franchises in football. If history repeats itself there will be another leader that emerges down the road. Won’t be Brady great but I’m sure it’s someone that will infuse hope and get the fans believing.
Should be fun.

 

[Nikolai]

We were competent QB play away from being a playoff contender this year, and the young guys on the team were a big reason why. They're still learning, making dumb "young guy" mistakes, but this team has potential. A lot of it.

 

[NG Pats Fan]

It’s amazing how many people are happy in here with a 6-8 record. Blame cam! No one blames belichick and his horrendous drafting of offense the past 5 years

 

[BradytoMosstoGronk]

I'm leaning towards it taking 2 years to right the ship, because the QB situation is such dire straits I don't know any realistic solution to fix it for next year.

 

[PatsFanInVa]

It’s amazing how many people are happy in here with a 6-8 record. Blame cam! No one blames belichick and his horrendous drafting of offense the past 5 years

Okay, the answer you want: which of them will be around in a year? ta da.

That William of Occam guy's answer:

Cam Newton - Carolina Panthers Quarterback - ESPN

View the profile of Carolina Panthers Quarterback Cam Newton on ESPN. Get the latest news, live stats and game highlights.

www.espn.com

5 TDs. 10 Int.s.

Pretty sure Bill didn't TELL him to hit those numbers.

Once it becomes clear you have ahem a jersey recognition issue, a lot can go wrong, not least of which is more throwing the ball to the other guys. But you don't think you lose the flexibility to dial up what you want for your QB? You don't think you lose the ability to score because you haven't seen any "magic" in a QB?

I don't hate on Cam. I just can't look at a guy who's thrown for something like 2300 yards with 5 TDs and 10 Int.s, and think "damn that head coach!!!!" Unless you want to complete that sentence "Damn that head coach, why didn't he find a way to keep Brady?"

And That said, I'd rather be rid of Brady. Bandaid's off. He's 43. It'll eventually be the right decision

But er, as a result, here we are. For now.

 

[Ring 6]

I’ve never seen the worst rushing team in the league have that much success against anyone.

The flashbacks to 2002 when Ricky Williams was doing exactly the same thing on those runs to the outside...

Do you get paid every time you post this?

 

[Nikolai]

It’s amazing how many people are happy in here with a 6-8 record. Blame cam! No one blames belichick and his horrendous drafting of offense the past 5 years

Weren't you one of the "5-11" guys earlier this year? By that definition, the team exceeded your standards. So what are you winging about?

 

[captain stone]

Pretty much in agreement with the OP except for 7c, somewhat.

No one is suggesting that Bill tell those who do play these last two completely meaningless games to not try their best - in fact that would be counter-productive to evaluating what if any role they could have here next season - but there is also no reason to dress those with injuries who still have time on their contracts here (Wynn, Harris) or those who just plain suck and have No future here whatsoever (Cant Newton, Terry Brooks, Calhoun, Simon), unless we need one of them as fodder (Thanksdad Ferentz) to replace somebody who's actually good.

Vets who are up-coming UFAs whom Bill would likely want to see return, and who might also be nursing injuries (Andrews, Guy, Butler), might appreciate a wellness game or two off the field in order to better prepare for the offseason, which hopefully includes re-signing with the NEP...I would also tell Devin McCourty to not dress these last two completely meaningless games and get ready for one last run next season, a run that ass-umes a new starting QB who doesn't totally suck.

If we by some miracle defeat the Billdoes and/or the Jesters with this reduced roster, then Yay us, I guess..."culture" and all that...If we don't, then that's not the end of the world either, not by a damn sight.

 

[IllegalContact]

Pretty much in agreement with the OP except for 7c, somewhat.

No one is suggesting that Bill tell those who do play these last two completely meaningless games to not try their best - in fact that would be counter-productive to evaluating what if any role they could have here next season - but there is also no reason to dress those with injuries who still have time on their contracts here (Wynn, Harris etc.) or those who just suck and have No future here whatsoever (Cant Newton).

Vets who are up-coming UFAs whom Bill would likely want to see return, and who might also be nursing injuries (Lawrence Guy), might appreciate a wellness day or two off the field in order to better prepare for the offseason, which hopefully includes re-signing with the NEP...I would also tell Devin McCourty to rest up now and get ready for one last run, a run that ass-umes a new starting QB who doesn't totally suck.

If we by some miracle defeat the Billdoes and/or the Jesters with this reduced roster, then Yay us, I guess..."culture" and all that...If we don't, then that's not the end of the world either, not by a damn sight.

between Brady departure, dead money, and covid killing the summer..........I think this season was one big dress rehearsal........had to play hard to see who's worth keeping........tanking just creates a roster of losers.......

the early season losses to the seahawks and broncos were gifts........had they won, this team would still be playing the way it is right now and watching the playoffs slip away would have been more painful.

this team is in rebuild.....someone is going to spend money on Newton and I doubt it's this team.

I see a different team but still in rebuild next year.........it will feel better this time next year than it does now

 

[everlong]

2009 was the bottom out of the first part of the dynasty. I know people will say they rebuilt in one year because the 2010 team went 14-2 but really that team way overachieved and so did the SB team the next year. The offense rebuilt on the fly adding Gronk and Hernandez to a team that already had the Goat, Welker and JE11. The defensive rebuild really wasn't complete until 2014 when Hightower, Jones and Collins came of age and they brought in Revis and Browner.

To be fair those teams only carried over four players who would win a championship. Brady, VW, Mayo and Slater and the later two were only drafted in 08.

They drafted players who would contribute heavily to championships (eliminating Hernandez and others)

09: Chung, JE11
10: McCorty, Gronkowski
11: Solder, Vereen, Cannon
12: Jones, Hightower, Ebner
13: Collins, Ryan, Harmon
14: Stork, White, Fleming (JG who turned into picks that helped extend thing)

That's 5 years of solid drafts where you also added in FA the likes of Nink, LaFell, Bolden (UDFA), Blount, Devlin (UDFA), Amendola, Revis, Browner, Branch, Aarington, Butler (UDFA), Ayers, Casillias, Siliga and I'm probably missing a few.

My point is you don't have the Goat to carry you though the 5 years of a rebuild. Hell you don't even have a serviceable option at quarterback. I highly expect that it's going to take 5 years and that's the NFL reality not the bubble Patriots fans have been wrapped in for 2 decades. And that's if they're able to hit on the draft again like they did 09-14 (15 was pretty good too) and nail your FA acquisitions.

So who will still be on the roster from this team 5 years from now?

Probably nobody. Dugger is probably the best bet. Owenu is possible. Myers, maybe but as a 3rd or 4th receiver. Uche could be but we have no idea what he is yet.

A guy like Harris, ya maybe. However 5 years in the life of an NFL running back is an eternity. Winovich? Doubtful. Although he flashes I think Bill hates that he freelances ala Collins.

Guys like Mason, Jackson, Wynn, Andrews and others even if they are around will be on the north side of 30. That doesn't mean they can't be solid contributors. I'm merely setting context of where they'll be in their careers.

I'm not trying to be negative. Merely setting expectations and hunkering down so I can enjoy the rebuild without the expectations of the dynasty which was a once in a lifetime convergence I never thought to see being a Pats fan since 1976. Fans of other teams like the Bills can buy all the billboards they want because I got to live the dream of every fan. They can only hope to get a portion of that joy.

 

[Actual Pats Fan]

Sony Michel Sunday: Ten carries.

Ten.

He gets 25-30 carries, we win by two touchdowns.

Josh.

Must.

Finally.

Go.

Now.

 

[ivanvamp]

Alex Smith - ALEX SMITH!!!! - has been better than Cam Newton this year. By a sizable margin. It won't take much effort at all to improve at the QB position in 2021. With even a guy of Smith's ability, the Pats are probably at 8-6 right now, with a very real chance for the playoffs. And this is after playing a brutally difficult schedule.

 

[jdlboot14]

No reason for doom and gloom. I fully expected a ceiling of 9-7 this year. It's not just Brady's departure, but everything that's been building with this teams looming reset. So many new parts. But what we have found this year is a very promising run game (Harris) and WR's for next year (Meyers, Byrd, and maybe even Gunner. Not to mention Moncrief and Lee as solid vets). We also saw that our young D pieces have hope (Dugger, Wino, Hall, Uche, Jennings, Butler, Cowart, Bryant). Top of the list for offseason is QB, TE, DE, OG/OT, NT.

 

[ohiopatsfan]

This may be the year McDaniels takes the leap back to HC. I feel he is stagnating in NE. Also, Fisch is looking to get back to college coaching. A coaching shakeup may be a good thing for this offense. I don't know who to get as OC, but I think a vet QB like Hoyer might be a good Fisch replacement coach for any young QB the Pats might draft.

 

[Hyped]

My off season wish list:

a.) Revisit Thuney's contract....either re-sign him to a long term deal OR let him walk. Given our rookies on the OL plus a 2022 comp pick...I am OK with him walking and giving us 15M+ more in cap space vs. franchising him again.

b.) Not worried about the RB group...and we also get Bolden back there too in 2021. I'd like to see Harris/Michel catch even more balls....and maybe even let White walk in FA. We will need a pass catching RB though if that happens. I love White...the hero of Houston...but he could be pricey and I think his talent was wasted this year with Cam and the run heavy offense this year.

c.) TE....yes bring in a veteran..but not a high priced one. I think Dalton/Asiasi will be competent in year 2...but that might be asking a lot....I could be OK with Jacob Hollister or Tyler Eifert. Hunter Henry will be expensive and I'd rather save the money for elsewhere on the roster.

d.) WR: Sign Corey Davis and Kenny Golladay in FA (with that Hunter Henry $$$). Forget the draft for WR's...sure roll the dice on guys in rounds 5+....

e.) DL: Yes, get a space eater....I don't care how...just plug someone in there so we stop getting pushed off the LOS!

f.) LB: Yes, SPEED at LB please!!! Yeah, I know they don't grow on trees....and I think with our safeties...we can get away with this...but doesn't mean we shouldn't try.

g.) Secondary: Happy with all of our safeties...even if Chung retires. Want to upgrade JMac....and maybe trade Gilmore for something....Jackson and Jones are definitely quality CB2/3s. Would be nice to take a corner in the draft to replace Gilmore... Maybe Caleb Farley/Va Tech or Patrick Surtain II/Bama in the first round...they will be within range of our pick.

h.) I hope Rohwasser is the real deal and has a shot at unseating Folk...but I can live with Folk as long as his leg doesn't fall off. Bailey is our MVP....Cardona is fine. We still have the best coverage teams and get Bolden back too.....

i.) Love our coaching staff.....thought the new OL coaches did good this year and nobody is gonna be interviewed for HC jobs as far as I know....

j.) Quarterback....this is our biggest problem by FAR. I think I have now given up on hope for Cam Newton...I like him and am happy with him here....but like the OP said...no pocket awareness...and a clumsy throwing motion.... yes a part of it is personnel related...if he had better talent around him...but we need a QB for the future and it isn't Cam even if he's relatively young. Not sure what we do here...but I agree with the OP...no on trading up for the big QB names....I'd rather sit pat in round 1 and take the best available player...play it safe. Free agency? I don't like anyone available very much...and they are available for a reason.

 

[PatsFanInVa]

Weren't you one of the "5-11" guys earlier this year? By that definition, the team exceeded your standards. So what are you winging about?

Bonus for best stateside use of a Britishism.

 

[Actual Pats Fan]

Bonus for best stateside use of a Britishism.

By George!

No, not Boy George.

...but he is a Brit, isn't he?

Anyway if Kraft moved the team to London it would be the biggest contradictory name since the Utah Jazz. Or LA Lakers.

 

[micronin127]

2020 Team Assessment - Defense
Lack of every down impact players requires team to commit to one set of role players to stop the run or to another set of role players to stop the pass.

Lack of high end talent on the defensive line is telling. We have rotational players and backups forced into starter workloads. Little to work with on the defensive line in terms of building blocks. Can’t stop the run. This is fatal flaw number one.

Sufficient talent in the secondary, must use first round tender on JC Jackson. Figure out what to do with Stephon Gilmore to maximize value to the team via trade considering his age and health.

Linebacker talent is mixed. At times, we looked slow and plodding, with Bentley and Jennings on the field together roaming the middle of the field like buffalo on a prairie. Or we could watch more athletic LBs like Uche, Hall and Winovich fly around, but often not able to set edges or match up physically. Hightower may return or he may retire.

2020 Team Assessment - Offense
Lack of skill position talent, except for running back, and no threats in the passing game at all. Need to clean house at QB and TE, and bring in top talent at WR too. Offensive line needs bolstering.

QB plan this offseason is to sign a veteran free agent and then to draft two quarterbacks. Stidham is under contract but not assured a roster spot next season. Looking for three new faces, though open to the possibility that Cam Newton is the veteran free agent on another one year deal, though would prefer a quarterback that can throw the ball. This is fatal flaw number two.

RB depth is good with Damien Harris, Sony Michel, JJ Taylor, and Jakob Johnson on rookie/ERFA deals. Brandon Bolden and Danny Vitale may return or retire. James White is a big loss. Team needs a power back.

WR skill is terrible. Jakobi Myers is a bright spot. He should be at most a third option. N’Keal Harry may also develop into a third option, possibly working from the slot. We are missing two better options than anyone currently on the roster. This is fatal flaw number three.

TE plan is to view all TEs under contract as needing to be replaced. Sign at least one veteran free agent, possibly two. This is fatal flaw number four.

Offensive Line has solid building block players: Onwenu, Mason, Wynn, Herron. Lacks quality depth and needs a center. Since New England will likely be a player in free agency, losing Thuney won’t net a comp pick because they’ll more than cancel out their losses. So why not offer Thuney money you likely have to offer to someone else?

2021 Team Assessment - Overall
Without a plan at quarterback and so many holes spread across the roster, this team is at least two possibly three years away. 2021 will be a building year though possibly a successful year. With expanded wild cards, you can’t rule out a playoff run. Or even a path.

 

[PatsFanInVa]

By George!

No, not Boy George.

...but he is a Brit, isn't he?

Anyway if Kraft moved the team to London it would be the biggest contradictory name since the Utah Jazz. Or LA Lakers.

Yeah, little known fact, David "Boy" George was the British negotiator at Versailles.

 

[Actual Pats Fan]

Yeah, little known fact, David "Boy" George was the British negotiator at Versailles.

God he must be old