How to be competitive in the AFC again

[BTTA]

I think the offense is pretty close. They need a third down back, a binkie go-to WR for Mac, and minor retooling on the line.

The defense is pretty much a complete rebuild. The have a few pieces like Barmore, Philipps, maybe JC, maybe Judon, Dugger, but that's about it.

You can not function as an offense when every time you get the ball there's another score from the other team. And this was not a limited event.

To say "maybe" about Judon and Dugger is nuts.
JC and Jones make up one of the best CB duo's in the league. Just need one more and it is a strength again.
With Barmore and the young, recovering LB's, they could be four players away from being damn good again.

 

[One-If-By-Sea]

To say "maybe" about Judon and Dugger is nuts.
JC and Jones make up one of the best CB duo's in the league. Just need one more and it is a strength again.
With Barmore and the young, recovering LB's, they could be four players away from being damn good again.

Agree but those 4 players have to be studs, not Guy or Wise types. I think we need 2 DTs, 1 Outside CB, and 1 LB or DE. I assume DMac is coming back and that will not take much cap space because we can spread his dead money.

 

[BTTA]

Agree but those 4 players have to be studs, not Guy or Wise types. I think we need 2 DTs, 1 Outside CB, and 1 LB or DE. I assume DMac is coming back and that will not take much cap space because we can spread his dead money.

You just created a new term: "WiseGuy types".
Sorry, I can't help my Dad humor.
I don't know what to think about DMac. He's been one of the more mature human beings on the roster, and clearly has life priorities. I don't think we have a clue about all that.
Would LOVE him as a coach though.

 

[Family]

To say "maybe" about Judon and Dugger is nuts.

You're right. That's why my post only says "maybe Judon", not Dugger. Dugger is obviously a keeper.

Judon is listed as a question mark only if he wasn't hurt at the end of the season, which I think he was. His play down the stretch was even worse than the horrible stats.

You disagree?

 

[BTTA]

You're right. That's why my post only says "maybe Judon", not Dugger. Dugger is obviously a keeper.

Judon is listed as a question mark only if he wasn't hurt at the end of the season, which I think he was. His play down the stretch was even worse than the horrible stats.

You disagree?

I do, in the sense that these year end evals need to be focused on the next 3 years going forward. What happened with Dugger at the end of this year isn't that relevant to me. His ceiling is very high, and year 3/4 is when we'll start to benefit from that.

 

[Family]

I do, in the sense that these year end evals need to be focused on the next 3 years going forward. What happened with Dugger at the end of this year isn't that relevant to me. His ceiling is very high, and year 3/4 is when we'll start to benefit from that.

Do you read the posts you quote?

 

[Keyser Söze]

Can we get Wise off this team already. I don’t know what BB sees in him.

 

[Family]

Can we get Wise off this team already. I don’t know what BB sees in him.

Unless someone wants to trade for Wise, that's a no.

His cap hit if cut next year is greater than the cap hit if he stays.

Deatrich Wise | NFL | Spotrac.com

Deatrich Wise contract and salary cap details, full contract breakdowns, salaries, signing bonus, roster bonus, dead money, and valuations.

www.spotrac.com

 

[Toofy]

Unless someone wants to trade for Wise, that's a no.

His cap hit if cut next year is greater than the cap hit if he stays.

Deatrich Wise | NFL | Spotrac.com

Deatrich Wise contract and salary cap details, full contract breakdowns, salaries, signing bonus, roster bonus, dead money, and valuations.

www.spotrac.com

6 million hit next year . We can't cut unless someone offers to take him for 3 million this year and 2.5 million next year and we absorb 3 million cap hit. I honestly don't think wise is going anywhere.

We seem to have bloated contracts ..

2022 is a lost season. Don't invest too much resources into free agency. Use 2022 to find out the core for 2023 and start to splurge again in 2023. Agholor contract is over . wise contracts would be easier to exit .

Let's pray Jonnu comes up decent.

 

[MrBigglesWorth]

The d linemen get pushed back... Cant hold their ground... Slow and weak

 

[Family]

We seem to have bloated contracts ..

2022 is a lost season. Don't invest too much resources into free agency. Use 2022 to find out the core for 2023 and start to splurge again in 2023. Agholor contract is over . wise contracts would be easier to exit .

Let's pray Jonnu comes up decent.

Wise contract was actually 12M for 2 years with 2.5 cap hit in 2023. I don't see that as horrible.

Agholor is likely here next year unless someone is stupid enough to take the contract. It will likely be rewritten IMO to put off some of the cap until 2023.

Why would you say 2022 is a lost season? The team has multiple second year players who can step up, veterans on IR, a full rookie class, as well as free agency to fill in about 10 holes.

Mac will be a year more experienced. If he is the real thing the team has a great chance to improve on being already a playoff team.

 

[Toofy]

Wise contract was actually 12M for 2 years with 2.5 cap hit in 2023. I don't see that as horrible.

Agholor is likely here next year unless someone is stupid enough to take the contract. It will likely be rewritten IMO to put off some of the cap until 2023.

Why would you say 2022 is a lost season? The team has multiple second year players who can step up, veterans on IR, a full rookie class, as well as free agency to fill in about 10 holes.

Mac will be a year more experienced. If he is the real thing the team has a great chance to improve on being already a playoff team.

Tbh we got lucky with injuries to other teams and we also got carried away with the 7-0 streak . Next year with relatively less COVID and better injury management other teams would be in better shape .

We had an advantage of cap space this season, so we utilized that and were able to compete.

Now our veterans have regressed massively, we have few overpaid contracts like agholor, Jonnu which we need to tide over. So it might be better for Not make any big free agency bets this year and look for next year .

And give the young players a chance to prove their worth and make changes on defensive coaching staff. This was the worst pats beatdown I have seen in last few years . I want to see what Jennings, mcgrone, uche can do.

 

[jdlboot14]

Sign Berrios off the Jets! He's an UFA.
He's all we're missing - the Welker type that Mac needs to win inside and PR.

 

[masterbouncer]

Unless someone wants to trade for Wise, that's a no.

His cap hit if cut next year is greater than the cap hit if he stays.

Deatrich Wise | NFL | Spotrac.com

Deatrich Wise contract and salary cap details, full contract breakdowns, salaries, signing bonus, roster bonus, dead money, and valuations.

www.spotrac.com

if you cut him post june 1 2022, you have 1,25M DC and 5M cap savings according to OTC

 

[boodog]

We need defensive playmakers. Lot of them. Our offense will need to be complemented by a stout defense with playmakers that can make game winning plays.

Here’s some context regarding competitive Pats teams of the past. Every Pats SB winning defense had multiple playmakers at each of the three levels Today, there are players who project potential (Barmore) to be playmakers but the reality is that at the present time we just have two. Judon and Dugger. Jackson (now a FA, could be resigned). IMO, we need another potential playmaker at DL, 2 at LB and 1 at DB (even if we keep Jackson).

Playmakers on D from SB winning teams.

‘01 - BigSey, Willie, Tedy, Ty, Milloy, Vrabel
‘03 - BigSey, Willie, Tedy, Ty, Rodney, Vrabel
‘04 - BigSey, Willie, Tedy, Ty, Rodney, Vrabel
‘14 - Vince, High, Mayo, Collins, Dmac, Revis, Chung
‘16 - Flowers, High, Collins, Dmac, Butler, Chung
‘18 - Flowers, High, KVN, Dmac, Chung, Gilmore

 

[ivanvamp]

The team is ALREADY competitive in the AFC. They won 10 games with a rookie at QB. They won just one less game than Buffalo did this year. They were within 2 points of Tampa, and took Dallas to OT. They beat Tennessee (obviously without Henry, but they won a lot of games without Henry so were still no pushovers). They beat borderline playoff teams in Cleveland (badly) and the Chargers. They split with Buffalo in the regular season. They went 8-4 in conference play.

Obviously they're not ELITE, but they're already "competitive". How to get to the next level, where they're right there in the legit mix to win the conference?

1. Development and improvement of Mac Jones.
2. Speed at LB and some better run stuffers on defense. Plus help at CB (re-sign Jackson and add another, or else you've gotta add TWO legit corners).
3. Improved special teams, which were unfathomably bad this year (and inexplicably so).
4. Ideally, one more legit WR threat but I still think the offense can work with what they have so this is a lower priority.

 

[BTTA]

Do you read the posts you quote?

I'm reframing the question the quote asked or answered. I'm not arguing with it, just offering a different viewpoint.

If you read what I write from a combative stance and with a defensive mindset, it'll appear that I'm distorting the original.

The Argument Culture — Deborah Tannen

www.deborahtannen.com

 

[Family]

I'm reframing the question the quote asked or answered. I'm not arguing with it, just offering a different viewpoint.

If you read what I write from a combative stance and with a defensive mindset, it'll appear that I'm distorting the original.

I'm sorry. I'm trying to understand what you are saying, but am completely lost.

The only comment I made on Dugger was he was one of the keepers.

How does reframing your post offer any viewpoint different from mine?

 

[BTTA]

Do you read the posts you quote?

Yeah, I didn't read this carefully enough. I read the maybe as applying to both players, including Dugger. Either interpretation is grammatically correct.

 

[boodog]

The team is ALREADY competitive in the AFC. They won 10 games with a rookie at QB. They won just one less game than Buffalo did this year. They were within 2 points of Tampa, and took Dallas to OT. They beat Tennessee (obviously without Henry, but they won a lot of games without Henry so were still no pushovers). They beat borderline playoff teams in Cleveland (badly) and the Chargers. They split with Buffalo in the regular season. They went 8-4 in conference play.

Obviously they're not ELITE, but they're already "competitive". How to get to the next level, where they're right there in the legit mix to win the conference?

1. Development and improvement of Mac Jones.
2. Speed at LB and some better run stuffers on defense. Plus help at CB (re-sign Jackson and add another, or else you've gotta add TWO legit corners).
3. Improved special teams, which were unfathomably bad this year (and inexplicably so).
4. Ideally, one more legit WR threat but I still think the offense can work with what they have so this is a lower priority.