How good has Barmore been this year?

[captain stone]

Not on one of the best defenses in the NFL. Team success is individual player success.

You can’t “suck” as one of the most utilized starters on one of the best defenses in the NFL. That’s a contradiction.

And whose defense would that be?

 

[Real fan 02]

Not on one of the best defenses in the NFL. Team success is individual player success.

You can’t “suck” as one of the most utilized starters on one of the best defenses in the NFL. That’s a contradiction.

Good points. We do have one of the best defenses in the league flawed and all. However guys can still play better.

 

[Thelonious]

Objectively speaking, his effort is inconsistent, and his performance is so-so. Overall, I don't think he is very much above "serviceable." As he is probably better than anyone on the current roster who might replace him, I hope, speaking as a fan, that he can play out the season. As one who believes in a civil society, i don't give a damn what happens to him. He is certainly replaceable, though with all our (depth) needs, I would hate to waste a pick or a lot of money on accomplishing that. Put it all together, if he goes, I'll probably just shrug.

 

[Gumby]

Objectively speaking, his effort is inconsistent, and his performance is so-so. Overall, I don't think he is very much above "serviceable." As he is probably better than anyone on the current roster who might replace him, I hope, speaking as a fan, that he can play out the season. As one who believes in a civil society, i don't give a damn what happens to him. He is certainly replaceable, though with all our (depth) needs, I would hate to waste a pick or a lot of money on accomplishing that. Put it all together, if he goes, I'll probably just shrug.

Assuming 2 starting DT per Team (undercounting most likely, as few play 3-4 w a true NT and DL subs a lot) bu anyway …
so of 64 DTs:

I would say Barmore has played in the 10-30 range. Sometimes 10-15; sometimes 20-30. So can agree w the inconsistent.

But for “much above serviceable”, I would suggest you are underscoring him just to win an argument.
I see him as slightly above average (32-33) at a whole season perspective.

Then you talk about REPLACEMENT, AYE, there’s the rub….. Good DTs are much like we experienced in OT last FA/offseason. Either you are going to overpay for those limited ones of them good DE/DT (ex: Parsons, etc) that are available OR you are going to draft them.
— I would submit w Milly on the payroll, we aren’t buying a second of him.
— With a draft pick anywhere from 24-32, we likely aren’t drafting any immediate-rookie-year-step-into-starting-lineup DT;
(and I would prefer best available among: OG, LB, or S in rd 1 anyway).

BL: get used to Barmore, he ain’t going anywhere.

 

[Wozzy]

And whose defense would that be?

When the defense was healthy weeks ago they led the entire NFL in fewest rush yards allowed, fewest yards per carry and were ranked #1 in fewest rushing TD’s allowed. They ranked 5th in points allowed.

As of today they rank 8th in fewest rushing yards and tied for 4th in fewest rushing TD’s. They’re 10th in points allowed.

You suggesting the slip in defense overall, but especially the slip in run defense is the result of Barmore forgetting how to play football the last few weeks and not the absence of Williams/Spillane/Tonga/Landry/Farmer because (checks notes) PFF said so is some real mouth breathing analysis.

They’re still a top ten defense despite these injuries, they need to get healthy to become a top five unit once again.

 

[Real fan 02]

Oh I agree, they have been gutted by injuries to key run defenders.
I certainly don't expect Barmore, or the teams run numbers to get better in that case.
But when Williams went out, Tonga and Spillane were still playing.
It was the Willams injury that really hurt, and that's when the run D started to go downhill, and we still had Barmore/Tonga/Spillane.
We went from the #1 run D to the #8 without Williams.
Should that not tell us that Williams is the key to our run D?

DD... no Achane for the Defensive line to have to handle.. guys need to dominate.. get some TOs, big plays, this will be good for the defense as a whole heading into the playoffs.. they don't need to play down to the competition with Achane and Waddle out. Be aggressive and establish playoff intensity on defense.

 

[Real fan 02]

Assuming 2 starting DT per Team (undercounting most likely, as few play 3-4 w a true NT and DL subs a lot) bu anyway …
so of 64 DTs:

I would say Barmore has played in the 10-30 range. Sometimes 10-15; sometimes 20-30. So can agree w the inconsistent.

But for “much above serviceable”, I would suggest you are underscoring him just to win an argument.
I see him as slightly above average (32-33) at a whole season perspective.

Then you talk about REPLACEMENT, AYE, there’s the rub….. Good DTs are much like we experienced in OT last FA/offseason. Either you are going to overpay for those limited ones of them good DE/DT (ex: Parsons, etc) that are available OR you are going to draft them.
— I would submit w Milly on the payroll, we aren’t buying a second of him.
— With a draft pick anywhere from 24-32, we likely aren’t drafting any immediate-rookie-year-step-into-starting-lineup DT;
(and I would prefer best available among: OG, LB, or S in rd 1 anyway).

BL: get used to Barmore, he ain’t going anywhere.

Good points. Ideally you'd like the farm system to help with allowing for those guys to replace players who leave or get released. We just need to continue the course with the draft, maximizing guys under contract and signing quality FAs.

Barmore ain't going anywhere for now... 2027 is where the team could likely make a move should they chose too.. Barmore is a talented player. Who knows if his health situation has affected him probably so.. at this point he's here.. so hopefully he will become more impactful.

 

[Real fan 02]

And whose defense would that be?

Today's finale no Achane, no Waddle.. the defense needs to go out and dominate..

 

[mgteich]

Assuming 2 starting DT per Team (undercounting most likely, as few play 3-4 w a true NT and DL subs a lot) bu anyway …
so of 64 DTs:

I would say Barmore has played in the 10-30 range. Sometimes 10-15; sometimes 20-30. So can agree w the inconsistent.

But for “much above serviceable”, I would suggest you are underscoring him just to win an argument.
I see him as slightly above average (32-33) at a whole season perspective.

Then you talk about REPLACEMENT, AYE, there’s the rub….. Good DTs are much like we experienced in OT last FA/offseason. Either you are going to overpay for those limited ones of them good DE/DT (ex: Parsons, etc) that are available OR you are going to draft them.
— I would submit w Milly on the payroll, we aren’t buying a second of him.
— With a draft pick anywhere from 24-32, we likely aren’t drafting any immediate-rookie-year-step-into-starting-lineup DT;
(and I would prefer best available among: OG, LB, or S in rd 1 anyway).

BL: get used to Barmore, he ain’t going anywhere.

I don't think that the situation is that clear. BTW, I am not even considering anything but signing a player who we think would be approximately equal to Barmore.

QUESTION
Would you sign Barmore for $13.5M, $18M and $19M? That is our situation. New money is all that counts unless a team has a serious cap problem and cannot handled the dead cap money.
===========
The open question is whether Barmore is worth $13.5M of new money for his 2026 services, and $18M and $19M for non-guaranteed 2027 and 2028 salary.

ALTERNATIVE ONE
Keep Barmore for another year and see what happens.

ALTERNATIVE TWO
Cut Barmore and sign someone else to a contract that has a 2026 cap hit of around $13.5M, and $18M and $19M. Have the player signed before cutting Barmore.

ALTERNATIVE THREE
Trade Barmore for a 2027 7th and sign someone else for a 2026 of about $15.5M, and $18M and $19M. Have the player signed before trading Barmore.

 

[Gumby]

I do agree.
HOWEVER, the open question is whether Barmore is worth $13.5M of new money for his 2026 services.

ALTERNATIVE ONE
Cut Barmore and sign someone else to a contract that has a 2026 cap hit of around $13.5M

ALTERNATIVE TWO
Trade Barmore for a 2027 7th and sign someone else.

I dont see 13.5 as all that excessive. Your “sign someone else” will cost 15-20.
Costs always escalate.

 

[mgteich]

I dont see 13.5 as all that excessive. Your “sign someone else” will cost 15-20.
Costs always escalate.

If $15M is possible, we save a bit of cap money by trading him even for a 7th.

Maybe a bit extra is worth it for the right player. The value is that Barmore has two question marks: his previous illness and his off the field issues. That presumes that his on-the-field play is worthy of the cost.

 

[Real fan 02]

I dont see 13.5 as all that excessive. Your “sign someone else” will cost 15-20.
Costs always escalate.

I believe the real issue at bay here is Barmore off the field. Provided he gets through this domestic situation if another situation arises in the future I the believe ownership will make the call and Vrabel I'm sure would advocate for him but the optics would be to great for RK to overlook.. so at that point he probably would get right out released?

 

[mgteich]

I believe the real issue at bay here is Barmore off the field. Provided he gets through this domestic situation if another situation arises in the future I the believe ownership will make the call and Vrabel I'm sure would advocate for him but the optics would be to great for RK to overlook.. so at that point he probably would get right out released?

Are you saying that Vrabel wouldn't consider signing a similar player for $15M a year if his staff presented the possibility?

 

[Real fan 02]

Are you saying that Vrabel wouldn't consider signing a similar player for $15M a year if his staff presented the possibility?

No, I think he would.. as TheRainMaker stated we have two defensive lineman making $40 million in Barmore and Williams.. should the unfortunate even happen where Barmore is moved/realeased absolutely Vrabel would sign a player of that price range. I can bet you Vrabel and Cowden have already done thier due diligence on 2025 FAs.. at that position.

 

[DoubleDeluxe]

BL: get used to Barmore, he ain’t going anywhere.

Unless details come out that are damning.
RKK will kick him to the curb in a nanosecond in that scenario.
That is why we are having this conversation, off-field may determine his future here, not his on-field play.

 

[Gumby]

Unless details come out that are damning.
RKK will kick him to the curb in a nanosecond in that scenario.
That is why we are having this conversation, off-field may determine his future here, not his on-field play.

Yeah, and I simply don’t believe that prediction. / possibility. But if thought wrong about lots of things.