X's & O's Hou@NE -- REWATCH Thread

[Hammer of Thor]

The board has become more derailed than usual and it has nothing to do with football. For those who come here just for football, this thread was very successful and enlightening last week, so I thought I'd start a thread for this week. Particularly looking forward to @Tony2046 's analysis of the all-22 film.

Here's some stuff to get it started out. On PatsPulpit, the first TD to Gronk:
Patriots vs Texans film review: Tom Brady hits Rob Gronkowski for the game's first touchdown

Right after the snap, the quarterback's eyes went to the expected left side of the field. However, the safety manning the middle – Andre Hal (#29) – did not immediately react and key in on Gronkowski. Instead, he was hesitant to abandon the area underneath due to White releasing into the left-side flat:

Here's a link to another thread here by @shmessy highlighting Thuney's role in the GW TD.
Thuney During the Winning TD: It's The Details

Hope I'm not stealing anyone's thunder here.

 

[irishfanatic]

Hope I'm not stealing anyone's thunder here.

Well in fairness, you are the Norse God of it (lol).

 

[oldrover]

The board has become more derailed than usual and it has nothing to do with football. For those who come here just for football, this thread was very successful and enlightening last week, so I thought I'd start a thread for this week.

 

[mosi]

Thanks. I did not get to see the game but listened on Sirus radio. Any chance this gets re-broadcast on the NFL network?

 

[NE-VT]

I would like to re-watch the big plays that the Pats gave up to the Texans:

I am curious to see how much of it was blown coverages and mental mistakes vs. how much of it was players losing physical battles. I would also like to get a sense of if the Patriots were getting burned while playing man or zone.

 

[Hammer of Thor]

Here's an analysis of the late 4th quarter defense by Mike Dussault at Pats Propaganda.

Film Review: Patriots D Gives Tom Brady a Chance - PatsPropaganda

Regarding the 2nd and 3 on the Texans' penultimate drive (the field goal):

The key guys in holding this to just two yards are Branch and Brown, who hold their ground and allow the free hitter Kyle Van Noy to cut through the line from the back side to make the play.

Then the 3rd and 1:

Branch especially is overwhelming at the point of attack as you can see below, as Guy pushes his blocker back. Lamar Miller simply has nowhere to go and his hesitation allows Kyle Van Noy to reinforce from the second level. Brown and Guy pinch in and finish him off for no gain.

 

[Tony2046]

Coaches film is up. Any requests?

I saw yours @NE-VT . If you could elaborate a little further it would be helpful.

I'll start with the big plays from both teams which usually includes all TD's and passing plays over 15 yards and running plays over 11. (Big Plays is a search option in gamepass. It doesn't always include all big plays)

I'll attach the play by play from Houston Texans at New England Patriots - September 24th, 2017 | Pro-Football-Reference.com. If you want to see a particular play or set of plays just reference the play # in the left column.

I'm not sure if this is a good way to do this or not. Please let me know or if you have any other suggestions..

 

[Hammer of Thor]

Coaches film is up. Any requests?

I saw yours @NE-VT . If you could elaborate a little further it would be helpful.

I'll start with the big plays from both teams which usually includes all TD's and passing plays over 15 yards and running plays over 11. (Big Plays is a search option in gamepass. It doesn't always include all big plays)

I'll attach the play by play from Houston Texans at New England Patriots - September 24th, 2017 | Pro-Football-Reference.com. If you want to see a particular play or set of plays just reference the play # in the left column.

I'm not sure if this is a good way to do this or not. Please let me know or if you have any other suggestions..

Thanks Tony! Here are my requests -- I'm going to be a negative Nancy and focus on a few plays that bothered me: runs, and the Watson scramble completion that caused my wife complain about my swearing.... All late 3rd - 4th quarter plays. Basically curious to find out what caused all the breakdowns here.

133 & 134 -- two Houston runs up the gut
146 & 147 -- also two Houston runs up the gut, although 147 wasn't terrible
148 -- I think the world knew this was going to be a QB draw. Who messed up the contain?
161 -- I think this is my aforementioned swearing fest, where Watson evaded a few tackles and someone let their man go to allow a big completion. Correct me if I've got the wrong play.

144 -- The Gillislee 3rd and 1 stuff. Curious to find out what went wrong here.

Thanks in advance!

 

[NE-VT]

Thanks for this Tony2046! Maybe we could look at plays where our D gives up 10+ yards, a first down, or a touchdown? Using that criteria, I think we would need this plays from your list:

17, 18, 37, 38, 56, 60, 61, 85, 105, 108, 114, 131, 134, 136, 148, 149, 159, 181.

There is a chance I missed some.

 

[long distance]

Coaches film is up. Any requests?

I saw yours @NE-VT . If you could elaborate a little further it would be helpful.

I'll start with the big plays from both teams which usually includes all TD's and passing plays over 15 yards and running plays over 11. (Big Plays is a search option in gamepass. It doesn't always include all big plays)

I'll attach the play by play from Houston Texans at New England Patriots - September 24th, 2017 | Pro-Football-Reference.com. If you want to see a particular play or set of plays just reference the play # in the left column.

I'm not sure if this is a good way to do this or not. Please let me know or if you have any other suggestions..

Tony, the re-watch Santa! Thanks for time, generosity.
All others here as well.
And to Hammer to open it etc. I thought Tuesday is the perfect day for this thread..

 

[Tony2046]

I'm working on the big plays at the moment.

Tonight I'll go through and start to piece together the requests. It may take a day or two to complete them.

 

[long distance]

@Tony
thanks . appreciate&admire the time invested
but do it only as long as you enjoy it..
__

meanwhile .. non-analysis intermezzo . i bet this one stays on BBs Monday Film menu for a long time..

 

[Hammer of Thor]

@Tony
thanks . appreciate&admire the time invested
but do it only as long as you enjoy it..
__

meanwhile .. non-analysis intermezzo . i bet this one stays on BBs Monday Film menu for a long time..

Ok -- that's the play I was thinking of, play number 159 not 161.

Sadly after review I'm not sure what else could have been done better on the coverage side. Flowers was the guy who came off his man, but he had to -- he was in no man's land of playing the receiver or the mobile QB. Maybe he should have trusted Roberts to get there and make Watson break the line of scrimmage before attacking?

Ultimately I think the problem was with 3 of the rushers -- Brown, Butler and Guy all took bad angles to the QB. Brown I think was a little understandable as Watson slide nicely at the last minute to avoid him, but the other two did not go head on, which allowed him to "escape". This wasn't an Eli Manning Houdini act in the Super Bowl, I think the only real move he made was on Brown, and his speed and scrambling combined with the bad angles of the others engineered the rest. I know they are playing contain, but there comes a point in a play where they have to go head on, and Brown and Butler were at that point in my opinion. Maybe I blame Guy the most since he was the one who overplayed it the most and let the edge get unsealed.

 

[luuked]

Thanks for everything @Tony2046.

Inspired by the same guy @long distance mentioned (Baldy):




Maybe at some point we can look at the issues Solder had and see how much of it was due to the Texans just setting things up nicely vs. him using bad technique/losing the physical battle. Not sure I will find the time to look at it but it could be a good learning experience for some of the posters to see how complex playing on the OL can become.

 

[luuked]

Ok -- that's the play I was thinking of, play number 159 not 161.

Sadly after review I'm not sure what else could have been done better on the coverage side. Flowers was the guy who came off his man, but he had to -- he was in no man's land of playing the receiver or the mobile QB. Maybe he should have trusted Roberts to get there and make Watson break the line of scrimmage before attacking?

Ultimately the problem was with 3 of the rushers -- Brown, Butler and Guy all took bad angles to the QB. Brown I think was a little acceptable as Watson did a nice slide, but the other three did not go head on, which allowed him to "escape". This wasn't an Eli Manning Houdini act in the Super Bowl, I think the only real move he made was on Brown, and his speed and scrambling combined with the bad angles of the others engineered the rest.

Not to excuse this terrible tackling but I wonder how much of a role the heat played in players becoming sloppy towards the end of plays like that. They use a lot of energy and power already for the initial fight with the OL, then they break through and are facing a quick QB who is totally fresh on that play.. I dont think conditioning in general was a big issue especially because you only get so many of those hot days a season but it just makes me wonder..

 

[long distance]

Thanks for everything @Tony2046.

Inspired by the same guy @long distance mentioned (Baldy):




Maybe at some point we can look at the issues Solder had and see how much of it was due to the Texans just setting things up nicely vs. him using bad technique/losing the physical battle. Not sure I will find the time to look at it but it could be a good learning experience for some of the posters to see how complex playing on the OL can become.

hope you can find time and share . bc Solder didn't look himself for 3 weeks now and its getting beyond the “rust“ period. he “leaked“ inside, outside..

i had a very non-analytical thought the other day after seeing him so passionate about his great new non-football ventures . that maybe in his head he might have . at least somewhat, unconsciously . moved on (also family..)

 

[luuked]

hope you can find time and share . bc Solder didn't look himself for 3 weeks now and its getting beyond the “rust“ period. he “leaked“ inside, outside..

i had a very non-analytical thought the other day after seeing him so passionate about his great new non-football ventures . that maybe in his head he might have . at least somewhat, unconsciously . moved on (also family..)

Just pure speculation but given how Reiss have now hinted for 2 years that Solder might not sign another NFL contract you might be on to something. To be fair I am not surprised given what he and his family has been through if his priorities have shifted a bit. If it is true hopefully he is as open about his thoughts with BB and Caserio as Ninkovich reportedly was.

 

[Tony2046]

hope you can find time and share . bc Solder didn't look himself for 3 weeks now and its getting beyond the “rust“ period. he “leaked“ inside, outside..

i had a very non-analytical thought the other day after seeing him so passionate about his great new non-football ventures . that maybe in his head he might have . at least somewhat, unconsciously . moved on (also family..)

@luuked

I'll try to put together something with all of Brady's sacks and some of his pressures. Pressures are tougher because they aren't annotated in any of the game film or play by play sheets.

 

[Tony2046]

Just pure speculation but given how Reiss have now hinted for 2 years that Solder might not sign another NFL contract you might be on to something. To be fair I am not surprised given what he and his family has been through if his priorities have shifted a bit. If it is true hopefully he is as open about his thoughts with BB and Caserio as Ninkovich reportedly was.

I read something the other day that he has been dealing with a hamstring issue. Someone posted something about it in the other thread. Just food for thought.

 

[luuked]

@luuked

I'll try to put together something with all of Brady's sacks and some of his pressures. Pressures are tougher because they aren't annotated in any of the game film or play by play sheets.

Will try to take a look myself through gamepass. I dont think it is necessary to have an exhaustive list of plays. A handful should be enough to get an idea if there is a more fundamental issue.