For Rebuild Year One - The OL Isn't That Bad

[hornetfb85]

QB:
Brissett > Jones
Maye
Zappe
Milton

I’m pretty comforrable saying that position group is improved

RB:
Hopefully Stevenson 2024 > Stevenson 2023
Gibson > Elliott

RB a wash or improved slightly

TE:
Hooper maybe >Gesicki
Bell maybe a decent weapon

TE a wash or slightly improved

WR:
Only lost Parker, added Polk, Baker and Osborn…If you can’t see the upgrade that is…I don’t know what to tell ya

 

[Fuzz]

I agree with you. The OL isnt in as bad shape as people make it out to be. PFF rated them #20 at the end of the season (even with all the injuries and poor coaching). I expect them to be an average unit this year. The main problem last year was QB and WR play. Both positions should be improved this year, so this offense has a good chance to be watchable again.

 

[Wozzy]

They were among the worst three teams overall in the league. The offense was the very worst in the league, undeniably. That kind of crap, you rebuild. Don't like the term? Call it a "resuscitation" or something.

The offense was dead last, that was the result of injuries, coaching calamity and having no QB… not a lack of talent.

Install the new offense, stay healthy, play Brissett and you’ve fixed most of what went wrong last season. If they can do this they should win a lot of games.

 

[Vindicate]

The offense was dead last, that was the result of injuries, coaching calamity and having no QB… not a lack of talent.

Install the new offense, stay healthy, play Brissett and you’ve fixed most of what went wrong last season. If they can do this they should win a lot of games.

We can't just gloss over those tasks as if it's said and done.

This is a rebuild - I think the only room for debate is where it's happening. But if you take into account both the rehauling of an offense and an almost entirely new house of coaches who haven't yet worked together, been tested on gameday together, etc. ~ I think it's fair to say you have a rebuild going on.

Furthermore, I remember a lot of talk about how receivers couldn't even get open when Mac would have the time. They definitely had a lack of talent.

 

[Wozzy]

We can't just gloss over those tasks as if it's said and done.

Teams install new offenses or variations every season. These guys are football players and the system is only getting easier than the previous that was notorious for its difficulty.

Health is necessary for all 32 teams, there’s nothing unique about the Patriots situation. They had an undue amount of injuries last season at OL and WR. They need to stay healthy, theres no predicting injury.

This is a rebuild - I think the only room for debate is where it's happening. But if you take into account both the rehauling of an offense and an almost entirely new house of coaches who haven't yet worked together, been tested on gameday together, etc. ~ I think it's fair to say you have a rebuild going on.

Most of the coaches have worked together, as most of the players have. They’re returning a majority of both. They’re not launching a satellite to space, it’s football.

Furthermore, I remember a lot of talk about how receivers couldn't even get open when Mac would have the time. They definitely had a lack of talent.

After the OL, the WR’s dealt the next most injuries. They needed to get younger and deeper at WR, easy enough, they have some vets who can play now and some rookies behind them.

Not a rebuild, mostly just a new QB and a better offensive environment and attitude. Positivity is a good thing. Rebuild is what they had to do after 2019. Fix the offense.

 

[AQPE]

 

[borg]

Not a rebuild, mostly just a new QB

Result:

4.5 win projection

17 underdog betting lines

 

[Wozzy]

Result:

4.5 win projection

17 underdog betting lines

I'll give my win total prediction after camp, I want to see what happens from now til then.

 

[hornetfb85]

I don't know about "greatly" for QB or WR. Slightly improvements were made. Maye may or may not play this year and we don't know how he'll do if he gets in there. So really, the only known commodity at QB is Brissett (meh) or Zappe (ugh). It's a slight upgrade over Mac but a lot of his problems stemmed from not having an O-line. Polk is a rookie. So is Baker. Neither is projected to be a game-breaking WR. So, again, it's a slight improvement. Parker leaving is an addition by subtraction.

I'm not seeing a great improvement at RB. It's Rham and a bunch of JAG's. AVP's offense is based around a strong running game. If Rham breaks down like he did last year, it's a big question mark as to who picks up the slack. Zeke did that last year. I'm not sure who does that this year.

Will the offense be improved over last year? Well, it can't get any worse since they ranked dead last in most offensive categories. But I'm not seeing a big leap forward since it's the 4th offensive coordinator in as many years and a ton of new offensive coaches installing yet another new system. There's going to be a lot of growing pains from the rookie head coach on down.

The Pats still don't have a true LT on the roster. They have a bunch of guys who could fill that role but no one who's specialty is that role. Will it pan out? Again, it's yet another offensive line coach installing a new system. Will the guys on the roster take to it? Will the rookies and second year guys pan out and excel if they move over to LT from the G position? I dunno. I tend to come down on the "probably not" side since of so many other variables on that side of the ball.

So we gain Polk, Baker and Osborn.
Bourne is hopefully healthy.
Douglas another year older, but looked like a solid addition last year
And lose Parker, which as you said, is addition by subtraction and that’s only a minimal upgrade…
I understand we don’t have a game breaking #1 maybe. We didn’t have that last year either. Not sure how those additions don’t equate to a decent upgrade. But we’re all entitled to our opinions.

 

[archstanton543]

So we gain Polk, Baker and Osborn.
Bourne is hopefully healthy.
Douglas another year older, but looked like a solid addition last year
And lose Parker, which as you said, is addition by subtraction and that’s only a minimal upgrade…
I understand we don’t have a game breaking #1 maybe. We didn’t have that last year either. Not sure how those additions don’t equate to a decent upgrade. But we’re all entitled to our opinions.

They still don't have anyone that's going to keep opposing defensive coordinators up at night.

 

[hornetfb85]

They still don't have anyone that's going to keep opposing defensive coordinators up at night.

Totally agree, but that doesn’t mean this group as a whole is not a good bit better than last year, just from the aspect of adding what they did and subtracting Parker.

Now if we can add an Aiyuk next year after a year of Polk, Baker and Douglas playing and maturing…that would be ****ing amazing

 

[Stu Pidassle]

They still don't have anyone that's going to keep opposing defensive coordinators up at night.

The team picked a QB at number 3. If Maye develops he will scare DC's all by himself. At a minimum he should become good enough to compliment the other weapons.

 

[rkarp1]

my assumption is that NEXT year, we see a LT drafted, Sow at LG (or Robinson), Turner at OC, Onwenu at RG and Wallace at RT.
this has always been a 2 year + turn over of the roster. given that timeline we will not see Henry, D Andrews or Strange be here when Maye "arrives". remains to be seen if they can get something done with Mondre and keep him. I believe they do try

 

[BennyBledsoe]

My main concern is that we need more of those guys that 'just get open'. The only one who appears close to that is Douglas. I hope the rookies can do it.

 

[TomPatriot]

I love the optimism, but . . .

Kugler will need to scheme plays to help at LT. Hopefully, somebody (Okorafor, Wallace?) can be adequate with a little help. Onwenu is a stud even at RT. The jury is still out on Sow, especially as a pass blocker. Andrews is experienced, hard nosed and still good enough to anchor the OL at C. Mafi, Strange, Robinson - who knows?

 

[rkarp1]

I love the optimism, but . . .

Kugler will need to scheme plays to help at LT. Hopefully, somebody (Okorafor, Wallace?) can be adequate with a little help. Onwenu is a stud even at RT. The jury is still out on Sow, especially as a pass blocker. Andrews is experienced, hard nosed and still good enough to anchor the OL at C. Mafi, Strange, Robinson - who knows?

I actually love Mafi. size, strength, nastiness. he needs coaching. never got it last year, and it showed. played little OL as he was a DL player to start. can the team get him to the PS? or will they keep him to develop?

 

[TheRazorsEdge]

They are rebuilding the Oline and it's depth. Installing a new system and reorganizing.

Added talent to all the position groups across the line.

We knew going into the draft that the Patriots weren't going to be able to fill every need on offense in 1 draft. Looks like they concluded based on how the board fell - that LT was going to be the one that 'drew the short straw'.

If Wallace turns into a solid LT as a consolation and buys us a few seasons of average/decent play - we did good. If they turns into a stud that's a hr pick. We will find out.

Imo, last year the disorganization - coaches being half in/ half out - switching philosophy mid season - coaches upset that they didn't get a say in talent ... That's what killed us more than anything - outside of roster management.

They got a new staff who are held in high regard, brought in 2 veterans (Leverette and Okafor), brought in young competition across the board.
On paper, it might not be sexy but the situation/competition/operation all seem to have improved.

Elite Franchise LT's don't just pop up every year. Most teams in the league suffer from the same things. If we can get a average/decent line play that is consistent ( most important) , we'll be in good shape.

 

[Wozzy]

They are rebuilding the Oline and it's depth. Installing a new system and reorganizing.

Added talent to all the position groups across the line.

We knew going into the draft that the Patriots weren't going to be able to fill every need on offense in 1 draft. Looks like they concluded based on how the board fell - that LT was going to be the one that 'drew the short straw'.

If Wallace turns into a solid LT as a consolation and buys us a few seasons of average/decent play - we did good. If they turns into a stud that's a hr pick. We will find out.

Imo, last year the disorganization - coaches being half in/ half out - switching philosophy mid season - coaches upset that they didn't get a say in talent ... That's what killed us more than anything - outside of roster management.

They got a new staff who are held in high regard, brought in 2 veterans (Leverette and Okafor), brought in young competition across the board.
On paper, it might not be sexy but the situation/competition/operation all seem to have improved.

Elite Franchise LT's don't just pop up every year. Most teams in the league suffer from the same things. If we can get a average/decent line play that is consistent ( most important) , we'll be in good shape.

Time will show whether they should have taken the left tackle in the second round, if the kids Miami and Kansas selected there become studs and Wallace doesn't we'll have our answer.

 

[Wozzy]

I love the optimism, but . . .

Kugler will need to scheme plays to help at LT. Hopefully, somebody (Okorafor, Wallace?) can be adequate with a little help. Onwenu is a stud even at RT. The jury is still out on Sow, especially as a pass blocker. Andrews is experienced, hard nosed and still good enough to anchor the OL at C. Mafi, Strange, Robinson - who knows?

Assuming health everywhere else they can get by with just an average left tackle... it will be hard if they can't find even average. The biggest problem with the line last year...



It doesn't matter if you have five All Pro's... if you can't stay healthy blocking will be difficult.

 

[TheRazorsEdge]

Time will show whether they should have taken the left tackle in the second round, if the kids Miami and Kansas selected there become studs and Wallace doesn't we'll have our answer.

Very fair.

What if Wallace is just 'ok' and Polk is a stud? How would you feel then?