Florio: Pats shopped Gronk before the draft, targeting Mayfield?

[Kontradiction]

Which is exactly my point. Except you were doing it in reverse by only mentioning the bad years.

I went to FO and checked for their "Adjusted Games Lost" analysis from 2011 to 2017. For anyone that doesn't know the stat here are their principles:



For the Pats the results were:

2011: 97.5 // #30
2012: 74.7 // #19
2013: 97.6 // #29
2014: 62.0 // #12
2015: 93.3 // #29
----
2016: 57.5 // #8
2017: 61.3 // #14


One can definitely make the argument that the data under Nash looked a lot more volatile snapping between "ok" years and "bad" years but so far it is only a sample of 2 vs. a sample of 5. Also lets keep in mind that those numbers are impacted a lot by severe injuries and not those lingering ones that you are actually talking about. It would be fascinating to see what the numbers look like if you remove all "severe" impact injuries and only look at the classic conditioning issues.



My assumption was because he did not prepare the team well enough in terms of conditioning throughout the season culminating in an abysmal performance in the AFCCG where many players seemed to be physically done midway through the third quarter. Yes, I understand it is in high altitude but it was just plain awful to watch.

But looking at the injury numbers from FO maybe BB really was not satisfied with his entire body of work. Interestingly when you look at the FO data for Detroit for 2016 and 2017 this is what you see:

2015: 76.7 // #23
----
2016: 71.1 // #14
2017: 71.7 // #17

So over there his methods more or less performed the same as it was before him and a bit worse than what Cabrera was able to accomplish here. But maybe that difference of about 10 games lost per season is exactly the kind of small nagging things that you were pointing towards. Either way the job Cabrera & co are doing right now is among the better ones in the league.

Interesting find. Thanks. Taking the data from that link and finding the average, you get 20th in the league. Lower half. And that's accounting for the years of 2016 and 2017. Taking those out, you get 24th. When you account for the nagging types of injuries that the skill position players seem to regularly suffer on this squad on top of the fact that the Pats' medical staff has put Gronk in a bad position (and he re-broke his forearm as a result) in the past, you can definitely see why the guy is hesitant to trust them. I don't blame him. I wouldn't trust him either if I was him and that's doubly so if he felt better in 2017, working with Guerrero, than he had in previous seasons.

 

[DarrylS]

...who is also our 2nd-best player...

...who isn't going anywhere...

...because Little Billy has proven himself incapable of finding his long-term replacement.

"Little Billy"??? Someone has gone off the rails, my guess is too much listening to Felger et al does strange things to the mind, step back from the edge...

"Vroom, Vroom"... not sure any team can find a long term replacement comparable to Gronkowski.. he is a unique football player.

 

[luuked]

Gronk only missed the train wreck Philly game in 2015 and if you want to blame someone for playing in DEN, BBs cataclysmic game plan vs MIA on week 17 must be considered.

As Mayo said in one of the QuickSlants podcasts this offseason. This was the game where BB essentially purposefully set out to only run the ball no matter what. Which resulted in a game where Brady had 134 yards passing. Weird time to make a point about the run game being ****.

 

[RobertWeathers]

As Mayo said in one of the QuickSlants podcasts this offseason. This was the game where BB essentially purposefully set out to only run the ball no matter what. Which resulted in a game where Brady had 134 yards passing. Weird time to make a point about the run game being ****.

Agree. Obviously BB was protecting Tom. The line was awful and receiving options were limited.

With that said there should have been a ton more 3 step drops, screens, etc.

 

[Off The Grid]

I would do Gronk for Mack without blinking.

He would be miserable with Gruden though.

You serious??

I don't want Gronkowski going anywhere unless we get a King's Ransom for'm, which we won't, and even then: I love the guy, and don't fancy seein'm wearin' anything but Red, White, and Blue...But if that happened? Gruden and Kong would party hardy, baby.

 

[Off The Grid]

Reflecting on the convo over the last page or two...

Yeah, it sure is mind-boggling to consider that Mad Bill arguably gave away not one but two Championships in the last 4 years ~ 4 in a row??? ~ via the inexplicable surrender of Home Field Advantage to the Broncos in 2015 and The Butler Decision in 2017.

And, yet...There's also no escaping the fact that he is inarguably one of the best Coaches and best General Managers of all time ~ and by "one of the best" I mean that only Lombardi, Brown, and Walsh are up there with'm as Coaches. Don't know about GMs.

And there's certainly no question that he is far and away the greatest of this Era.

In one way, you might say that he's Doctor Dynasty.

Yet in another way he's also Doctor Demento.

You might say he's a...pair o' Docs.

 

[luuked]

Agree. Obviously BB was protecting Tom. The line was awful and receiving options were limited.

With that said there should have been a ton more 3 step drops, screens, etc.

The way I understood what Mayo said was that this was more about running until they figure out a run game for the playoffs and only then about protecting Brady. And the abysmal run game not only cost us the game in Miami and the HFA but also was out biggest issue in Denver on offense.

On the one hand BB correctly knew that they needed to get this going on the other hand potentially throwing away HFA over this is what some might call a hissy fit. That was one ******ed finish to the regular season.

 

[RelocatedPatFan]

Do you think BB the GM would try to shop BB the coach, if he thought it would make the team better?

 

[patfanken]

I don't know if this was mentioned earlier because I'm not reading 4 pages of this drivel.

I really don't believe the rumor because it simply makes NO sense....and not just to the Pats. Back before the draft when all this was alleged to happen, Gronk had publicly stated he was unsure about playing in 2018. Now think about it. What team is going to give up ANYTHING let alone a "king's ransom" for a guy they don't know is even going to play, and if he does, don't know for how long, and even if he commits long term. what it would take to sign him.

It continually irks me when I see this SPECULATION constantly be reported as absolute fact, even after the owner stated categorically it never happened.

BTW- I would have no problem having the media SPECULATE about the Pats trading Gronk. Why not, its the offseason and they have content to fill. But the Gronk story has gone well beyond "speculation" to a point where it is a constant topic of discussion which it really doesn't deserve.

 

[mgteich]

IMHO, Gronk will be paid more this year for NFL play than he will get in his first 5 years at ANYTHING after he retires. Getting paid in Hollywood or the WWE? NOT!

does that constitute smoke or fire? asking for a friend.

makes sense to me as I think Gronk only has a couple of years left before he goes to Hollywood or WWE to get paid. Pats being one step ahead just trying to get some return before he reitres

 

[mgteich]

This is a matter of semantics.

Of course writers speculate about trades. And it is not really a major leap to think that the patriots MIGHT have considered trading any of our players not named Brady for the opportunity of getting our franchise quarterback of the future.

In the 24/7 news world, writers no longer have much time to get a second or third source (or event he first).

I don't know if this was mentioned earlier because I'm not reading 4 pages of this drivel.

I really don't believe the rumor because it simply makes NO sense....and not just to the Pats. Back before the draft when all this was alleged to happen, Gronk had publicly stated he was unsure about playing in 2018. Now think about it. What team is going to give up ANYTHING let alone a "king's ransom" for a guy they don't know is even going to play, and if he does, don't know for how long, and even if he commits long term. what it would take to sign him.

It continually irks me when I see this SPECULATION constantly be reported as absolute fact, even after the owner stated categorically it never happened.

BTW- I would have no problem having the media SPECULATE about the Pats trading Gronk. Why not, its the offseason and they have content to fill. But the Gronk story has gone well beyond "speculation" to a point where it is a constant topic of discussion which it really doesn't deserve.