Felger and Reiss go at it over Welker

[RayClay]

Anyone want to dispute that this is an agent screwing his client?

By rolling the dice and being wrong, Welker ends up with no more money, a moving van, left on his doorstep with a suitcase while the agent blows smoke up the ass of some other naive would be superstar.

 

[Gronkandez]

Anyone want to dispute that this is an agent screwing his client?

By rolling the dice and being wrong, Welker ends up with no more money, a moving van, left on his doorstep with a suitcase while the agent blows smoke up the ass of some other naive would be superstar.

Yes I will dispute that. There was a three day legal tampering period. Welker knew what the offers we're and decided to turn down the Pats offer anyway. Perhaps Welker or his agent thought they could go to another team and then go back to the Pats to drive up the price but the Pats smartly moved on to make sure they got Amendola before they potentially lost out on both guys

 

[goheels22002]

Anyone want to dispute that this is an agent screwing his client?

By rolling the dice and being wrong, Welker ends up with no more money, a moving van, left on his doorstep with a suitcase while the agent blows smoke up the ass of some other naive would be superstar.

Welker sounded disoriented during his press conference in Denver, like he couldn't believe he had signed with Denver when the Broncos were just supposed to be leverage with Kraft and Belichick.

He's probably fuming right now trying to figure out the channels on his new cable box.

 

[IcyPatriot]

.... also how about the Broncos knew of the Amendola signing and ended up paying less?

 

[DocHoliday]

Welker sounded disoriented during his press conference in Denver, like he couldn't believe he had signed with Denver when the Broncos were just supposed to be leverage with Kraft and Belichick.

He's probably fuming right now trying to figure out the channels on his new cable box.

I think the Broncos were smart to not contact Welker during the tampering period. They might have known the market was bad, and that New England wouldn't allow the chance Amendola would sign elsewhere - really one of the few real alternatives out there.

By offering after FA started, they essentially got Welker cornered.

Sucks how it ended up. I just want to know if the Patriots really planned Welker as their Plan A or if DA was in the cards all along. It's just a shame.

 

[RayClay]

Yes I will dispute that. There was a three day legal tampering period. Welker knew what the offers we're and decided to turn down the Pats offer anyway. Perhaps Welker or his agent thought they could go to another team and then go back to the Pats to drive up the price but the Pats smartly moved on to make sure they got Amendola before they potentially lost out on both guys

So Welker, gauging the market on his own, even though he had an agent, decided to leave his home, Brady, his friends etc to get basically the same money somewhere else.

 

[signbabybrady]

That was the best thing I have ever heard on talk radio. I was listening earlier.

and this is the timeline for me.

They came on the air and Felger started spewing his crap like always and there were probably five points I would have wanted to challenge.

Than he legit calls out Reiss for being a Patriot butt boy.

And I didnt think much of that cause I dont care what he calls another reporter.

But boom within 5 minutes Reiss calls in.

And not only criticizes him for calling him a butt boy but proceeds to knock down each one of Felgers dumb ass points.

Felger couldnt really argue much while he was on the phone and even after Reiss hung up it took him like an hour to figure out how to fight back and even still it was lame.

 

[RayClay]

Welker sounded disoriented during his press conference in Denver, like he couldn't believe he had signed with Denver when the Broncos were just supposed to be leverage with Kraft and Belichick.

He's probably fuming right now trying to figure out the channels on his new cable box.

I'm guessing he hired an agent to negotiate things like that. Think they agent was whispering 3 for 24 mil in his ear the whole way to Denver until he realized whatever deals he thought he was working weren't working and dumped Wes on a skilift somewhere?

Wonder if he even said sorry?

 

[IcyPatriot]

.... and now Felgy has to deal with the loss of Jennings. :singing:

 

[cmasspatsfan]

Originally Posted by Gronkandez
Yes I will dispute that. There was a three day legal tampering period. Welker knew what the offers we're and decided to turn down the Pats offer anyway. Perhaps Welker or his agent thought they could go to another team and then go back to the Pats to drive up the price but the Pats smartly moved on to make sure they got Amendola before they potentially lost out on both guys

So Welker, gauging the market on his own, even though he had an agent, decided to leave his home, Brady, his friends etc to get basically the same money somewhere else.

Your right Ray Clay (God, I sound like Mazz), Welkers agent should know the market and let Wes know what was going on, or he should have got him signed where he wanted to be for the most he could get.
Mike Giardi said Welkers agent messed up last year and this year.
The real story doesnt fit into Felgers story line so he has to disregard what Mike Reiss says but as a fan I know which of those guys to put my faith in.

 

[goheels22002]

So Welker, gauging the market on his own, even though he had an agent, decided to leave his home, Brady, his friends etc to get basically the same money somewhere else.

$2 million more guaranteed. A million here, a million there, and pretty soon you're talking about real money.

 

[MTM558]

Loved the whole thing. Reiss sounded pissed. Felger is still clueless though.

 

[IcyPatriot]

Curran also was talking about how the Patriots kicked the tires on Amendola last year ... so how could Welker and his agent be so clueless?

 

[Fencer]

It sounds as if Welker's agent made multiple mistakes.

The big one was either misreading the market or failing to represent his client to best advantage.

The smaller one was whatever else went into him handling the last stretch of negotiations so that Welker wound up with his second-choice offer (from among deals he could actually get) rather than the one he wanted most (same dollars, more or less, staying with Pats).

 

[patsfaninpa]

I listened to their opening monologue. Heard their dog and pony sound affects and turned them off while Mazz was ranting about getting ponies instead of horses. Texted them that they were both arse-hats and listened to WEEI. WW's agent bleeped up. Don't blame Belichick for wanting him back on the Pats terms. That's his job. To get players back on his terms. Not the media, fans or buddies(BRADY) terms.

 

[RayClay]

$2 million more guaranteed. A million here, a million there, and pretty soon you're talking about real money.

Well, 2 million in incentives isn;t the same as 2 million, I'll grant.

Of course guaranteed is another thing, i don't know what was guaranteed in either.

I think Reiss's point is valid, though. Had the Patriots the opportunity to negotiate to firm up the 2 million in incentives, maybe they would have. What they were negotiating against was 3 years 24 mil and finally, when they had to go after players, they couldn't see a middle ground.

Curran has a good column that's an eye opener...

Given the $6 million per year offer he signed with Denver, the Patriots would counter with the fact they paid him nearly $10 million on the franchise tag last year. That, they might say, was above-market.

When I spoke to Welker's agent David Dunn last year, he suggested that a four-year $32 million deal with about $20 million guaranteed would have gotten it done.

In the end, the Patriots were offering Welker -- including last year's deal -- three years for $20 million. The money Dunn believed Welker should be paid and Welker was convinced he should be paid was not realistic and the Broncos offer Welker agreed to seems to be proof of that.

Curran: Patriots signed younger Welker in Amendola | Comcast SportsNet - CSNNE.com

The Patriots just don't give big, long term contracts to older players and it's pretty obvious the agent has either misgauged or lied to Welker about his worth around the league.

 

[Gronkandez]

So Welker, gauging the market on his own, even though he had an agent, decided to leave his home, Brady, his friends etc to get basically the same money somewhere else.

His agent went to the market and presumably told him the contracts that were offered. That's pretty standard.

"Sometimes it good to stick it in Bills face every once in a while"

 

[fair catch fryar]

$2 million more guaranteed. A million here, a million there, and pretty soon you're talking about real money.

You have to think that anything short of winning a Superbowl with Denver will be a monumental disappointment for Welker if all of this is true. He and his agent went all in and NE called their bluff. Welker should have retired a Patriot and cemented his legacy in Foxborough forever. I thought I heard on the radio that even his 2/yr deal with Denver can be voided after a year by March 15th which could ultimately make it only a 1/yr-6 million deal in a worst case scenario.

 

[patfanken]

What doesn't seem to get out is that the Pats nailed the market, while Welker, his agents, and everyone on this board, including myself completely overestimated it....by a lot. In Felger's defense, his question comes more about the timing AFTER Welker goes on the market.

According to Reiss, since the 2 sides are so far apart (2 for 10-16 vs 3 for 24) the Pats immediately go to plan B, which was Amendola. By Wednesday Welker has found out that the market isn't what he thought it was and the best deal out there was the 2 for 12 that the Broncos offered.

According to Reiss, by the time Welker comes back to the Pats, to counter, they have had to move on DA, who was being pursued by others. Felger can't get past the talk just before FA that it looked good for Welker coming back. He doesn't understand why the talk was so optimistic if the sides were so far apart. Reiss counters by saying everyone was so optimistic because Welker wanted to stay and the Pats wanted him. Clearly the Pats were assuming that when Welker saw the REAL market for him, he'd come back, and they'd be able to make a deal.

That's what the Pats hoped, but couldn't count on. They had to be prepared in case Welker was right and he'd get the money he wanted elsewhere. Plan B was DA, and the market for him was very competitive. If they didn't move on him by early Wednesday, he'd be gone and the Pats were facing a real chance of not getting either of their 2 top choices. Thinking they didn't have time to wait, they made the tough choice, so when Welker came back with the Denver offer (just speculating here) sadly that ship had sailed.

IF this was the actual scenario, then you can blame the agents for overly estimating the market, and you can blame the Pats for not waiting at least a day to give Wes a chance to come back with a counter once he realized that the Pats were right about the market

Felger's point is that if they were so far apart on Tuesday, why was there so much optimism. leading up to Tues. He can't get past that. But we should all understand that part of Felger's bias comes from having a very bad relationship with the team when he was the beat reporter. This sometimes leads to Felger's monomania about certain issues.

It's interesting that it had been widely reported (and repeated by myself) that the Pats would have been glad to have BOTH Welker and DA. According to Reiss that wasn't the case. When Welker opted to go to FA, the Pats had to plan as if he wasn't coming back. DA was their first choice and a decision had to made that unfortunately precluded any back and forth with Welker.

Reiss speculates that if Welker and his agents had been closer in their demands, the Pats might have been more patient and a deal could have been worked out as soon as Welker realized he'd been wrong about the market.

Bottom line, what happened was sad and unfortunate, but on the plus side, both sides will do well without the other. I wish him well in Denver, except that week in November when he comes to Foxboro. On that night I'll wish him just good health

 

[BSR]

Felger's point is that if they were so far apart on Tuesday, why was there so much optimism. leading up to Tues. He can't get past that. But we should all understand that part of Felger's bias comes from having a very bad relationship with the team when he was the beat reporter. This sometimes leads to Felger's monomania about certain issues.

Reiss explained this as well but Felger couldn't wrap his little head around it, or at the very least didn't want to because it didn't fit his agenda. Reiss and others were confident that a deal would get done because A) Welker wanted to stay, B) Patriots were confident that Welker would find out his true market value in the legal tampering period. That of course didn't happen for a variety of possibilities. The rest is as you explain it.

The real kicker was later on when Felger goes on his rant on how agents are never to blame because it is a lazy cop out. I was incredulous on how he could say all at the same time Dumerville had just been released because of a possible agent error. If anyone is a shill its Felger...for his agent buddies.