ESPN Forsberg says Yea & Reiss says Nay on Ochocinco as a Patriot

[PATRIOTSFANINPA]

ESPN Boston's Hot Button Topic of the Week - ESPN Boston

I will side with Reiss on this one while hoping Forsberg is the correct assessor when the season is over.

 

[BradyFTW!]

Another indication that Reiss probably isn't the best source for in-depth analysis. "What you've seen from Ochocinco is what you'll get" is a pretty ridiculous statement, given how long he's been here and how much time he has to get comfortable in the offense.

 

[bagwell368]

If Welker catches 75+, AH 60+, Gronk 50+, and Price, Slater and Branch come in at 50 combined, what will be good enough for 85?

46 for 697 and 3 TD's ? That's Stallworth in 2007. He's even decent at 38 for 550, IMO. Anyone looking for 80 for 1175 and 8 TD's won't be happy.

We are going to throw a lot more screens this year to the backs as well.

Diversification. That's what I think the key word is this year.

 

[Armchair Quarterback]

ESPN absolutely blows, with NFLN showing nothing but replays of exhibition games 24 hours a day - How Exciting!!!! I have had the misfortune of tuning in to ESPN a couple times this week and all they do is point/counterpoint, agree/disagree, good/evil dumb/dumber etc, etc....They can't just give the news, it always has to be a pathetic attempt at creating controversy. Now I know why I haven't tune into that crap network in years.

 

[Disco Volante]

I miss the days when Reiss just reported things, I don't find his analysis that valuable most of the time.

 

[Ochmed Jones]

I miss the days when Reiss just reported things, I don't find his analysis that valuable most of the time.

Have to agree. Although it seems to me that when he was with the Globe he did a lot of analysis only it was via the chats and questions he answered.

 

[livinginthe past]

I don't know.

2 reporters.

2 options.

2 different opinions.

If I didn't know better i'd say its almost as if they are trying to generate hits and comments.

Maybe i'm just getting cynical in my old age.

 

[Rob0729]

It could be worse. Jermaine Wiggins today said that after spending the entire offseason and OTAs studying the playbook, Ochocinco should know the playbook backwards and forward by now. Do anyone know if Wiggins had a history of concussions during his career? I swear he is the dumbest person in the media. He is the same guy who said that Belichick has never run a 4-3 base during his coaching career even though Beichick ran a 4-3 base while Wiggins was a Patriot and practicing against the defense.

Last Friday, Chris Gasper said that when judging Ochocinco, we should use Jabar Gaffney as the measuring stick because he was a player who came here in 2006 and "immediately clicked with Brady" and grasped the offense. Funny, I don't think getting 10 catches for 142 yards and a TD in 10 games in the 2006 seson is classified as clicking. I remember Gaffney as a bubble player in 2007 and many people feeling that Caldwell had a better chance of making the 53 man roster.

Yes, Mike Reiss is not a good analyst, but he is far better than some of the guys we got here to listen to. Besides, it seemed like Reiss was taking the opposing point to give two different views and not necessarily because he believed that view point.

 

[Rob0729]

BTW, too many people thought Ochocinco was brought here to be another Randy Moss. I never believed that. He is replacing Brandon Tate, not Moss. He is just another piece to this offense, not the focal point. He could turn into the primary target, but the Pats need him to be an upgrade to the #3 WR position and anything else is a bonus.

 

[patriot lifer]

It could be worse. Jermaine Wiggins today said that after spending the entire offseason and OTAs studying the playbook, Ochocinco should know the playbook backwards and forward by now. Do anyone know if Wiggins had a history of concussions during his career? I swear he is the dumbest person in the media. He is the same guy who said that Belichick has never run a 4-3 base during his coaching career even though Beichick ran a 4-3 base while Wiggins was a Patriot and practicing against the defense.

Last Friday, Chris Gasper said that when judging Ochocinco, we should use Jabar Gaffney as the measuring stick because he was a player who came here in 2006 and "immediately clicked with Brady" and grasped the offense. Funny, I don't think getting 10 catches for 142 yards and a TD in 10 games in the 2006 seson is classified as clicking. I remember Gaffney as a bubble player in 2007 and many people feeling that Caldwell had a better chance of making the 53 man roster.

Yes, Mike Reiss is not a good analyst, but he is far better than some of the guys we got here to listen to. Besides, it seemed like Reiss was taking the opposing point to give two different views and not necessarily because he believed that view point.

While I think it's unfair to compare him to Gaffney, I think there is something to the point that some receivers seem to click very quickly while others don't ever seem to develop that comfort. Galloway didn't, Caldwell never really did, David P. did, Givens did, and Gaffney did. Guys like Branch and Moss seem to fit right in while a guy like Stallworth struggles. While Gaffney didn't have a ton of receptions in 2006, he seemed to develop a rapport with Brady midseason. If they are going to develop good chemistry this season, I think we'll see it sooner rather than later (first quarter of the season).

 

[Rob0729]

While I think it's unfair to compare him to Gaffney, I think there is something to the point that some receivers seem to click very quickly while others don't ever seem to develop that comfort. Galloway didn't, Caldwell never really did, David P. did, Givens did, and Gaffney did. Guys like Branch and Moss seem to fit right in while a guy like Stallworth struggles. While Gaffney didn't have a ton of receptions in 2006, he seemed to develop a rapport with Brady midseason. If they are going to develop good chemistry this season, I think we'll see it sooner rather than later (first quarter of the season).

Gaffney did? Really? You are remembering it wrong. In his last four games in the regular season in 2006, he had 5 catches for 41 yards and a TD. His longest reception was 12 yards. He had one game where he didn't have a reception, three games with one reception only, and one game with three receptions. The most he had in any game down the stretch was 26 yards. Ok, he did have one 28 yard reception in November.

Gaffney didn't click with Brady until the playoffs that season. That was nearly three months after the Pats signed him. It is a falicy that he and Brady clicked right away. We are killing Ochocinco for not grasping the offense in four weeks because he isn't like a guy who didn't click in the offense for 11 weeks.

Jabar Gaffney: Game Logs at NFL.com

 

[patriot lifer]

Gaffney did? Really? You are remembering it wrong. In his last four games in the regular season in 2006, he had 5 catches for 41 yards and a TD. His longest reception was 12 yards. He had one game where he didn't have a reception, three games with one reception only, and one game with three receptions. The most he had in any game down the stretch was 26 yards.

Gaffney didn't click with Brady until the playoffs that season. That was nearly three months after the Pats signed him. It is a falicy that he and Brady clicked right away. We are killing Ochocinco for not grasping the offense in four weeks because he isn't like a guy who didn't click in the offense for 11 weeks.

Jabar Gaffney: Game Logs at NFL.com

I didn't realize he had so few receptions. But that was an anemic pass offense afterall. Caldwell was lousy, Brown was in virtually his last season, and then Gaffney was brought in midseason. I think the rapport I recall was in the playoffs. He didn't have a lot of receptions, but so didn't anyone else on the team. Brady just seemed to be comfortable with him, moreso than Caldwell. That was the sense I had. But regardless, I really don't care about Gaffney. If 85 doesn't start clicking after 4 or 5 games, the homer in me will still hold out hope for him, but the other side of me will say he was overpaid.

 

[MoLewisrocks]

While I think it's unfair to compare him to Gaffney, I think there is something to the point that some receivers seem to click very quickly while others don't ever seem to develop that comfort. Galloway didn't, Caldwell never really did, David P. did, Givens did, and Gaffney did. Guys like Branch and Moss seem to fit right in while a guy like Stallworth struggles. While Gaffney didn't have a ton of receptions in 2006, he seemed to develop a rapport with Brady midseason. If they are going to develop good chemistry this season, I think we'll see it sooner rather than later (first quarter of the season).

Caldwell actually clicked remarkably well. His issue was while he was actually talented enough to occasionally make the circus catch it was the gimme ones that inexplicably eluded him, albeit at the most critical times... Consistent focus was his buggaboo (along with those bug eyes...that was the scouting skinny on him dating back to SD and why Belichick jettisoned him after one season...

Givens and Branch grew up in this system with Brady and he was their private tutor. Everyone else had a full off season to digest the playbook and workout with Tom. To be fair to Ocho he's had a month and he's not the only target and there are a number of targets on the roster he's competing for attention with and he's coming off a decade long career in a totally different system with a QB who struggled with his own reads and his accuracy increasingly over the last 3-4 years... Now as they start specific game planning and prep I think we will see it - if we do - later than sooner, probably after the bye. In the meantime his targets will be limited of necessity since job 1 now is winning and not acclimating Ocho. It is what it is. I don't like his drops % - that won't fly here. So we shall see. But he certainly seems to be trying.

Oddly I don't think Moss really fit in. I think Brady changed to fit Moss, and that worked until the league and/or age or emotional upheaval caught up to Moss. Moss never really got the system here and he wasn't asked to. Chad is being asked to.

 

[Deus Irae]

Reiss was just collecting his paycheck on that one, taking the assigned side in a debate.

 

[Halifax_Pats_Fan]

This just in:

Throw to the open guy. If 85 becomes an issue, send him away.

T-E-A-M team.

I am more concerned with the O-line and them shoring up pressure up the middle.

 

[Patriot Missile]

Chad is always a threat. No matter how much critics think he has declined, he still has the experience and drive to go over the middle and get the ball on the 15 and 20 yard in's where the hits are the most severe. He's a great addition even if he only catches 40 balls. He keeps the defense honest and will be savy enough to occasionally get behind the defense for a long score with his awkward-unique route running.

He did take one 75 yards over McCourty, albeit it was practice. Sorry doubters, I can't help but like this addition despite all the talk surrounding his learning curve. If he looks lost come week 4 or 5 that's when we should start worrying.

 

[TheSolderKing]

BTW, too many people thought Ochocinco was brought here to be another Randy Moss. I never believed that. He is replacing Brandon Tate, not Moss. He is just another piece to this offense, not the focal point. He could turn into the primary target, but the Pats need him to be an upgrade to the #3 WR position and anything else is a bonus.

I agree, But didn't Price replace Tate?


My point is Ocho should not be graded as a Randy Moss like WR. Ocho adds the ability of another SOLID route runner. Ocho is Ocho... an above average WR that busts his butt and is willing to go across the middle of the field unlike Randy. You ppl are expecting FAR too much. This is a share the wealth type of offense so don't expect any Vincent Jackson's. We have the most devastating offense in the sense that we create soooo many unfair match ups on the field. Ocho will be a fine addition and give him more leeway since his timing and chemistry w/ Brady has been a work in progress. They will be in-synch soon enough and when they do the doubters an go crawl under a rock

 

[FalconHeavy]

the beast will be unleashed against a very special opponent. No one will ever know what hit them

 

[cupofjoe1962]

ESPN absolutely blows, with NFLN showing nothing but replays of exhibition games 24 hours a day - How Exciting!!!! .

The NFL Network shows more than replays of the 2011 preseason games.

They also show the top 5 catches of 2010... over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over
and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over
and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over
and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over
and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over
and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over

 

[WhiZa]

the beast will be unleashed against a very special opponent. No one will ever know what hit them

I like the way you think. Ocho is going to want to make this season (and all seasons) as dramatic as possible. What better way to do that then to do nothing in the preseason and then just come out burning in the regular season.