Damien Woody's take on Maye timetable - its correct.

[XLIX]

Zach Wilson is a turd, but he is still a cautionary tale. He is the extreme of what can happen when you rush a QB out there too quickly. Bryce Young could be a better comp. Hell, maybe even Trevor Lawrence.

Zach Wilson sucks because Zach Wilson sucks, not because he started early.

 

[VJCPatriot]

The one thing I can point to right now about Mayo is that he will say something and the Patriots will do the opposite thing. I'm not saying he can't be a great coach or a good leader of men. But I do not trust anything he says.

He's been pretty consistent about saying that Maye would not start and Brisset is the starter. That has been the case so far.

I understand some are chomping at the bit to see Maye start but I don't see any benefit right now.

OL is in shambles. We're not suddenly a playoff team by inserting Maye.

Let the kid progress and learn the ropes first.

Kid needs to earn it and be READY before you throw him to the sharks.

 

[Rob0729]

Zach Wilson sucks because Zach Wilson sucks, not because he started early.

He probably would have never been any more than average if he was groomed right. But he should have never started right away. He didn't know how to play the game at the NFL level. It made him an absolute disaster. It ended up he had a low ceiling, but he didn't even reach his floor because he was rushed out there.

 

[Huckleberry1]

I'm now of the position to play Maye simply to stop the whining.

I just want them to stick to their plan for him, whatever that may be. I think they had a plan for him when they drafted him, and my bet is that they want him to really understand the offense, and fix certain mechanical problems. I also believe that they expected the OL to have made progress by now, which they clearly haven’t done.

 

[XLIX]

He probably would have never been any more than average if he was groomed right.

There is absolutely zero evidence that Wilson would have been anything but an atrocious QB no matter when he started playing.

I’ll say it again: Zach Wilson sucks because Zach Wilson sucks, not because he started early.

 

[Force Zero Boomer]

No franchise has done a better job of developing quarterbacks than Green Bay, and that’s where Wolf learned his trade. I trust his instincts on how to develop a young QB more than anyone else with ties to the Patriots, and I sure as hell don’t trust the knee jerk reactions of fans who are so spoiled by winning that anything less than winning a Lombardi makes them cry. I’m perfectly fine with Maye sitting all season if that’s what Wolf thinks is best for his development. Having a franchise QB usually means years of success, and I’m fine waiting for that success, especially when the other model clearly doesn’t work.

After the draft and free agency, it's a struggle for me to trust Wolf. But the rest I agree with. I've been in the 4 QB camp since OTAs.

You’re right, I wouldn’t play him, and they should sign a veteran QB to take the beating if Brissett goes down. I don’t believe in the Jets QB Development model, I think it’s stupid to play a young QB before they are ready, or behind a terrible OL, I think it’s the best way to ruin them. And I don’t give one **** if fans have a temper tantrum when the Patriots don’t play him now. If they play him I will root for him to succeed, and if they don’t I’m completely fine with that as well.

Now you've hit on the part that has completely baffled me since they released Zappe, and the only way I can reconcile the situation is that they are rolling the dice and hoping they don't come up snake eyes. They are betting that JB stays healthy, and if he doesn't, they are betting that the line can protect Drake and the chaos in the backfield won't hinder his development.

It's basically an expected value calculation where they've assigned probabilities to the events and values (negative and positive) to the outcomes. And the EV has come up positive for rolling with him as QB2, according to their model. They might not do a formal calculation like that, but they probably should. It's not difficult, and many of the probabilities they can estimate using historical league data.

I think it's insanity, but they are the experts. There's a disturbing possibility that I haven't thought of until now: maybe they've gotten a good look at Drake and decided he's probably not going to be "the franchise", but a league average QB at best. It's not impossible. If that's true, their strategy makes more sense: let's let him develop, but if he has to go out there and play, so be it. Sink or swim. If he gets hurt, it's not the end of the world.

 

[NFL Mystique]

After the draft and free agency, it's a struggle for me to trust Wolf. But the rest I agree with. I've been in the 4 QB camp since OTAs.

Now you've hit on the part that has completely baffled me since they released Zappe, and the only way I can reconcile the situation is that they are rolling the dice and hoping they don't come up snake eyes. They are betting that JB stays healthy, and if he doesn't, they are betting that the line can protect Drake and the chaos in the backfield won't hinder his development.

It's basically an expected value calculation where they've assigned probabilities to the events and values (negative and positive) to the outcomes. And the EV has come up positive for rolling with him as QB2, according to their model. They might not do a formal calculation like that, but they probably should. It's not difficult, and many of the probabilities they can estimate using historical league data.

I think it's insanity, but they are the experts. There's a disturbing possibility that I haven't thought of until now: maybe they've gotten a good look at Drake and decided he's probably not going to be "the franchise", but a league average QB at best. It's not impossible. If that's true, their strategy makes more sense: let's let him develop, but if he has to go out there and play, so be it. Sink or swim. If he gets hurt, it's not the end of the world.

My imo is they think he can be a franchise QB. But they are terrified of him behind the OL. They probably also saw the Young situation in Carolina too. Didn't want to repeat that mistake. Though, I think Maye has way more talent and intellect than Young.

 

[condon84]

What's interesting is that for those who complain about our OL, Jacoby has the 5th best time to throw for QBs so far this season while Jayden has the 4th worst time to throw -

NGS | NFL Next Gen Stats

NFL’s Next Gen Stats captures real time location data, speed and acceleration for every player, every play on every inch of the field. Discover Next Gen Stats News, Charts, and Statistics.

nextgenstats.nfl.com

 

[Force Zero Boomer]

My imo is they think he can be a franchise QB. But they are terrified of him behind the OL. They probably also saw the Young situation in Carolina too. Didn't want to repeat that mistake. Though, I think Maye has way more talent and intellect than Young.

Okay, but if they are terrified of him being behind that OL, why is he QB2? That OL will get JB injured at some point this season, if the poor play persists. Then Maye jogs in from the sideline.

 

[Force Zero Boomer]

What's interesting is that for those who complain about our OL, Jacoby has the 5th best time to throw for QBs so far this season while Jayden has the 4th worst time to throw -

NGS | NFL Next Gen Stats

NFL’s Next Gen Stats captures real time location data, speed and acceleration for every player, every play on every inch of the field. Discover Next Gen Stats News, Charts, and Statistics.

nextgenstats.nfl.com

That’s because he’s scrambling around, running for his life. He hast to hold the ball and run.

 

[condon84]

That’s because he’s scrambling around, running for his life. He hast to hold the ball and run.

Okay here's more data. Look under the Pressure columns under PKT Time which is defined "Average time in seconds between snap and throwing the ball or pressure". If you look at that list, the best time for QBs who have thrown for more than 5 passes is 2.7 which is Purdy. Then there's 5 QBs who have 2.6, another 5 QBs who have 2.5, and then there's 8 QBs who have 2.4 including Jacoby. This suggest that our OL isn't as bad as some of you guys like to paint. The guy has about the average time QBs have to throw in the NFL.

2024 Advanced Quarterback Stats | NFL Metrics | FantasyPros

View 2024 Advanced Quarterback Stats including Air Yards, Deep Ball Passing, Pocket Time, and more. See how QBs perform across the NFL's key metrics.

www.fantasypros.com

EDIT: Pro-Football reference has the same data and NE is above average under PKT of 2.4 -

2024 NFL Advanced Stats | Pro-Football-Reference.com

2024 NFL Advanced Stats

www.pro-football-reference.com

Seems to me that our OL isn't as bad if you look at the data. Aside from the Jets game, my eye test has told me Jacoby has adequate time to throw by NFL standards. It's either our receivers suck and nobody is open, or Jacoby can't find anyone open because he can't process the defense fast enough. Maybe a little of both but it's time we find out what Maye can do.

 

[XLIX]

What's interesting is that for those who complain about our OL, Jacoby has the 5th best time to throw for QBs so far this season while Jayden has the 4th worst time to throw -

NGS | NFL Next Gen Stats

NFL’s Next Gen Stats captures real time location data, speed and acceleration for every player, every play on every inch of the field. Discover Next Gen Stats News, Charts, and Statistics.

nextgenstats.nfl.com

+1 +1 +1 It is hilarious the number of people in this forum who think top draft pick QBs always inherit great offensive lines.

If you are a top 5 draft pick and a QB, there is a great chance you're going to a horrible team with a horrible offensive line. And yet the overwhelming majority of such players play year 1.

 

[Wozzy]

Seems to me that our OL isn't as bad if you look at the data.

Proving "data" can be totally useless in relation to using your eyes or perusing the box score.

They played a bad defense in week one = 1 sack
They played a good defense in week two = 3 sacks
They played a great defense in week three = 7 sacks

They suck...

 

[TheRainMaker]

Proving "data" can be totally useless in relation to using your eyes or perusing the box score.

They played a bad defense in week one = 1 sack
They played a good defense in week two = 3 sacks
They played a great defense in week three = 7 sacks

They suck...

I don't think the Jets defense is "great". However, that game allowing 7 sacks is just one example as of what happens when the game gets further out of hand. The Pats will be forced to pass which exposes how bad the OL is.

 

[Wozzy]

I don't think the Jets defense is "great". However, that game allowing 7 sacks is just one example as of what happens when the game gets further out of hand. The Pats will be forced to pass which exposes how bad the OL is.

Time will determine how great the Jests defense is this season, I get that its hard for a Patriots fans to admit they are good at anything.

They held Rhamondre and Gibson to 53 yards rushing and forced them to pass... they currently have the third most sacks and highest sack percentage in the entire NFL. They're pretty damn good.

 

[TheRainMaker]

Time will determine how great the Jests defense is this season, I get that its hard for a Patriots fans to admit they are good at anything.

They held Rhamondre and Gibson to 53 yards rushing and forced them to pass... they currently have the third most sacks and highest sack percentage in the entire NFL. They're pretty damn good.

They played a bad Pats offense. They got thrashed against SF and struggled against Tennessee. I still need to see how they do against other teams. Darnold going against his former team is a great matchup. I'd love to see him light up his former team. Looking at the rest of the schedule, the Bills and the Seahawks are their toughest tests. Maybe the Texans if they knock off the rust.

 

[The Gr8est]

No. Brandon Moore. Needed therapy after it.

His game worn pants should be the the NFL HOF, along with Mark Sanchez’s helmet and the football.

 

[rochrist]

I don't think the Jets defense is "great". However, that game allowing 7 sacks is just one example as of what happens when the game gets further out of hand. The Pats will be forced to pass which exposes how bad the OL is.

It's also an example of what happens when an OL that's already light in quality depth is reduced to using third stringers.

 

[sb1]

Time will determine how great the Jests defense is this season, I get that its hard for a Patriots fans to admit they are good at anything.

They held Rhamondre and Gibson to 53 yards rushing and forced them to pass...

The Jets didn't hold those guys to anything. They ran only 11 times in total for a 4.7 average. Not that impressed by that. The Pats just didn't run the ball. Likely because the defense that you were talking up all offseason couldn't stop a nosebleed, they couldn't get off the field and they fell behind.

they currently have the third most sacks and highest sack percentage in the entire NFL. They're pretty damn good.

Remains to be seen. The Pats are not a good team. Let's see how they are when they play a good team.

 

[yukon cornelius]

Okay here's more data. Look under the Pressure columns under PKT Time which is defined "Average time in seconds between snap and throwing the ball or pressure". If you look at that list, the best time for QBs who have thrown for more than 5 passes is 2.7 which is Purdy. Then there's 5 QBs who have 2.6, another 5 QBs who have 2.5, and then there's 8 QBs who have 2.4 including Jacoby. This suggest that our OL isn't as bad as some of you guys like to paint. The guy has about the average time QBs have to throw in the NFL.

2024 Advanced Quarterback Stats | NFL Metrics | FantasyPros

View 2024 Advanced Quarterback Stats including Air Yards, Deep Ball Passing, Pocket Time, and more. See how QBs perform across the NFL's key metrics.

www.fantasypros.com

EDIT: Pro-Football reference has the same data and NE is above average under PKT of 2.4 -

2024 NFL Advanced Stats | Pro-Football-Reference.com

2024 NFL Advanced Stats

www.pro-football-reference.com

Seems to me that our OL isn't as bad if you look at the data. Aside from the Jets game, my eye test has told me Jacoby has adequate time to throw by NFL standards. It's either our receivers suck and nobody is open, or Jacoby can't find anyone open because he can't process the defense fast enough. Maybe a little of both but it's time we find out what Maye can do.

average times, but Brissett takes above average time to make his reads/make a decision/release the ball