CBA & Player Contracts - Can The Pats Even Sign Brady?

[Ring 6]

But any salary they negotiate with him will be added to this number. Kraft has said they want to keep his salary under 20% of the cap, which means that they don't want to pay Brady more than $26.5 Million. I imagine there will be many teams willing to go much higher than that, which is really the crux of the problem. That $13.5 Million makes it tougher for the Pats to sign him to a cap-friendly deal.

When did Kraft say 20%? And the projected cap is over 200 mill.
13.5 isn’t really relevant. They can get the exact same results by adjusting the contract structure with the extra 6.75 accelerated or not.

 

[Ring 6]

The QB money situation is pretty straightforward. They either sign Brady before his contract voids, and suffer a likely $6.75m cap hit, or they sign Brady or another QB after that contract voids, and suffer a $13.5m cap hit.

This actually gives keeping Brady a bit of a financial edge over going after someone else to be the starting QB, as long as the deal gets done before the deadline. How much of that edge remains would then depend on the contract difference between a Brady extension and a new QB's deal. Unless the expectation is that Brady takes a huge pay cut, it doesn't make any financial sense to let Brady go to free agency and then sign him back.

Ultimately it doesn’t matter cap wise whether it’s before the deadline or after. They would just increase the signing bonus and decrease the salary accordingly to get to where they wanted to be.

Ie
3 years 80 mill

before deadline
15 mill salary 15 mill Sb
20 mill salary year 2
30 mill year 3

cap hits/dead money
26.75
31.75/16.75
35/5

If after deadline
5 mill salary 25 mill Sb first year
23 mill year 2
27 mill year 3
Cap hits/dead money
26.83
31.3/16.66
35.3/8.33

 

[bigballas]

In this case he's leaving as a free agent not like the 3 examples you mentioned.

thats heavily misleading to say he's leaving "as a free agent" on his own accord. he's leaving because the team voided the contract they signed him to. they could have taken the option and paid him $30M in 2020 that they signed him to spread the cap out over 3 years. its pretty standard and makes sense to amortize it as they have

 

[QuantumMechanic]

In this case he's leaving as a free agent not like the 3 examples you mentioned.

Leaving as a free agent because the contract is being cut short of the years the guaranteed money was amortized over.

Again, if this wasn’t the rule the salary cap would be meaningless because if you really wanted a 5 year contract you’d have the player sign a 15 year contract that voids after 5 and spread the guaranteed money over 15 years.

 

[Deus Irae]

Ultimately it doesn’t matter cap wise whether it’s before the deadline or after

Of course it matters.

 

[mgteich]

WHEN they sign him it goes down.
Your argument was if they sign him they don’t have cap room to build a team..

If they sign Brady after the beginning of the 2019 contract year, the cap hit is $13.5M plus the 2020 hit on the new contract. Signing Brady would cost a significant amount compared to not signing him.

If Brady is signed/extended BEFORE the end the 2019 contract year, the cap hit is $6.75M plus the 2020 cap hit of the new contract.

AS AN EXAMPLE
Brady could sign a 3yr/$90M contract including a $6.50M salary and a $21M bonus for a cap hit of $13.50M. There would either be a large option or a voidable contract. The contract would have a provision for no 2021 tag Brady.

If Brady is NOT signed, Brady would still have a cap hit against the 2020 cap of $13.5M.

Brady would get $27.5M guaranteed for 2020. Bonuses could be added for playoffs and SB.

The

 

[mgteich]

The contract automatically voids on the last day off the 2019 contract year. The patriots would have no opportunity to pay him $30M. What you are describing is a contract with an option to extend.

thats heavily misleading to say he's leaving "as a free agent" on his own accord. he's leaving because the team voided the contract they signed him to. they could have taken the option and paid him $30M in 2020 that they signed him to spread the cap out over 3 years. its pretty standard and makes sense to amortize it as they have

 

[mgteich]

Yes, if the patriots are willing to use $20M of their available cap money on Brady in the 2020 cap, this can be worked out. I don't think that this will happen. If the patriots are to have a decent offense, they will need use less than $20M on Brady's 2020 cap hit. And yes, I strongly believe that the cap is NOT the reason that Brady will stay or go.

Of course it matters.

What matters is that Brady is a free agent, with the patriots saddled with $13.5M of dead m

Ultimately it doesn’t matter cap wise whether it’s before the deadline or after. They would just increase the signing bonus and decrease the salary accordingly to get to where they wanted to be.

Ie
3 years 80 mill

before deadline
15 mill salary 15 mill Sb
20 mill salary year 2
30 mill year 3

cap hits/dead money
26.75
31.75/16.75
35/5

If after deadline
5 mill salary 25 mill Sb first year
23 mill year 2
27 mill year 3
Cap hits/dead money
26.83
31.3/16.66
35.3/8.33

 

[Rob0729]

If they fail to renegotiate a contract before Mar 18th, Brady's cap hit will be $13.5M or so. Not a big deal. And still plenty of room to bring him back.

That cap hit is dead money at that point. If Brady re-signs after he voids his contract, that money won’t be combined to his new new deal. It is he comes back and signs for a decent QB number, his cap hit will likely be over $30 million (could be closer to $40 million if he gets top QB money) when you count his dead money and new deal.

 

[Ring 6]

Of course it matters.

It doesn’t matter at all if they resign him. They can move the money around, as illustrated to get the exact same end result.

 

[Ring 6]

That cap hit is dead money at that point. If Brady re-signs after he voids his contract, that money won’t be combined to his new new deal. It is he comes back and signs for a decent QB number, his cap hit will likely be over $30 million (could be closer to $40 million if he gets top QB money) when you count his dead money and new deal.

No it won’t. I posted an example

 

[Ring 6]

Yes, if the patriots are willing to use $20M of their available cap money on Brady in the 2020 cap, this can be worked out. I don't think that this will happen. If the patriots are to have a decent offense, they will need use less than $20M on Brady's 2020 cap hit. And yes, I strongly believe that the cap is NOT the reason that Brady will stay or go.



What matters is that Brady is a free agent, with the patriots saddled with $13.5M of dead m

If Brady’s cap number is 20 mill and they cut Sanu (6 mill) they will have 44 mill of cap room

 

[Ring 6]

If they sign Brady after the beginning of the 2019 contract year, the cap hit is $13.5M plus the 2020 hit on the new contract. Signing Brady would cost a significant amount compared to not signing him.

If Brady is signed/extended BEFORE the end the 2019 contract year, the cap hit is $6.75M plus the 2020 cap hit of the new contract.

AS AN EXAMPLE
Brady could sign a 3yr/$90M contract including a $6.50M salary and a $21M bonus for a cap hit of $13.50M. There would either be a large option or a voidable contract. The contract would have a provision for no 2021 tag Brady.

If Brady is NOT signed, Brady would still have a cap hit against the 2020 cap of $13.5M.

Brady would get $27.5M guaranteed for 2020. Bonuses could be added for playoffs and SB.

The

It doesn’t matter. They will have the cap hits be similar each year to keep the dead money down
If they absorb the 6.75 into 2020 then they will push 6.75 more into the future than they would have. It’s a wash.
I posted an example

 

[mgteich]

Yup, and we will need 3 WR'S, 2 OL'S, 2 LB'S and safety or two.

That being said, we're are nitpicking. We agree that Brady can be signed and that we will still have contender.

Our differences are that I would push another $5-7M to the future and also that I would wait to cut Sanu until we signed a replacement and another WR addition.
===========
CONCLUSIONS

For the TEAM, it is a no-brainer to sign Brady. It is of little importance to me if we have to absorb an additional $5-10M of cap after he is gone.

For Brady, I believe that the situation is different. Brady will and should condor what offense he will be leading. IMO, Brady should wait until we are a week into free agency (at most) and see what the offenses of his options will look like (before the draft, important for MIA). I just don't see Brady signing unless there has been considerable improvements on the OL, at WR, at TE and at FB. And, I suppose, the coaching staff could be relevant. Yes, Andrews and Develin coming back could help (if they are healthy). However, Edelman could have nothing left, and Brady could be facing a much worse offense in NE than elsewhere.

If Brady’s cap number is 20 mill and they cut Sanu (6 mill) they will have 44 mill of cap room

 

[Ring 6]

Yup, and we will need 3 WR'S, 2 OL'S, 2 LB'S and safety or two.

That being said, we're are nitpicking. We agree that Brady can be signed and that we will still have contender.

Our differences are that I would push another $5-7M to the future and also that I would wait to cut Sanu until we signed a replacement and another WR addition.
===========
CONCLUSIONS

For the TEAM, it is a no-brainer to sign Brady. It is of little importance to me if we have to absorb an additional $5-10M of cap after he is gone.

For Brady, I believe that the situation is different. Brady will and should condor what offense he will be leading. IMO, Brady should wait until we are a week into free agency (at most) and see what the offenses of his options will look like (before the draft, important for MIA). I just don't see Brady signing unless there has been considerable improvements on the OL, at WR, at TE and at FB. And, I suppose, the coaching staff could be relevant. Yes, Andrews and Develin coming back could help (if they are healthy). However, Edelman could have nothing left, and Brady could be facing a much worse offense in NE than elsewhere.

After 20 years of seeing the patriots build teams around him and fill needs he will have more confidence in the patriots to do do than anyone else.
I’ll ask again what team could he go to that would provide a better chance to win a SB?
He’s been here 20 years he knows how this team does business and knows the results are better then anyone else. He doesn’t need to see signings and judge whether they know what they are doing.

 

[bigballas]

The contract automatically voids on the last day off the 2019 contract year. The patriots would have no opportunity to pay him $30M. What you are describing is a contract with an option to extend.

Correct, the contract was set to auto void at time of contract rather than give team option. You’re right with that part but that was what the team wanted during the contract hence why Brady demanded no tags.

I’m sure Brady would have been fine w the 30m per year extension , team wanted option so Brady said auto void and no tag.. this wasn’t a Brady option to leave in FA


Anyway, my point was regarding to how salary cap counted. Cannot spread it out then make it disappear

 

[BTTA]

TB12, the business, is Brady's financial priority. There's far more financial value to him in playing another couple of years and extending the brand than there would be in the differences between contracts between teams.

He may care about the contract number because of "respect" but gosh I hope for his sake he's well beyond that as a human being. At this point, why would he care about the Patriots' attitude toward him in that regard? Why would he give them that much power, that much space in his brain?

If he can go to San Diego or Las Vegas and put up huge numbers at his age, in the west coast media market which will go nuts over him, that may have more value to him than winning another SB. That's not speaking to the ego aspect of winning another SB, which may have more emotional appeal to him than driving up the value of his business. We just can't know.

 

[bresna]

When did Kraft say 20%? And the projected cap is over 200 mill.
13.5 isn’t really relevant. They can get the exact same results by adjusting the contract structure with the extra 6.75 accelerated or not.

Quotes from Kraft here:
Curran: For Brady and the Patriots, there's no easy way out

"If we were going to have to pay him elite-quarterback money and have elite-quarterback cap numbers, I just didn't think we would be able to build a team. We don't want to have a team where we're paying 18 to 20 percent to a player on the cap."

 

[Ring 6]

Quotes from Kraft here:
Curran: For Brady and the Patriots, there's no easy way out

"If we were going to have to pay him elite-quarterback money and have elite-quarterback cap numbers, I just didn't think we would be able to build a team. We don't want to have a team where we're paying 18 to 20 percent to a player on the cap."

Well 20% would be over 40,000,000