Broncos/Patriots matchup

[reflexblue]

How to beat Tebow? Simple. Put up 30 points. Force him to play catchup. The Denver offense is actually fairly inefficient. The reason they beat the Steelers is because their defense dominated early and allowed Tebow to build a 20-6 halftime lead. Then they barely held on till overtime which is when the Steelers defense fell apart as D. Thomas completely dominated his defender on the one big play of the night. Nasty stiff arm + jets in his feet = toasty!

Denver has great edge rushers in Von Miller and Dumervill. But they will be mostly neutralized by the Pats tackles. The key is for the offensive line to remain stout up the middle to allow Brady to step up into his throws. Denver and the rest of the NFL still has no clue on how to stop the dual engines of destruction known as Gronk and Hernandez. Welker will be his usual chain-moving self. I like our chances, especially at home. Bring on Tebow! We're gonna put up 30 on you, what have you got?!



The last time the Pats played the Broncos:

Result - Pats 41 Broncos 23
Tom Brady
23/34 320 yards 2 tds 0 int
http://www.patriots.com/games-and-stats/game/2011/regular15/

If you're talking about playoffs, that's ancient history. Today's Broncos team is a completely different animal from the team of several seasons ago. The same is true of the current Pats team. Like I said, put up 30 on the Broncs and force them to play catch up. I don't believe they have the firepower to hang in a shootout.

I forgot to add post season
I think the last time we played denver in the post season TB had his first ugly game and loss in the playoffs. Off the top of my head he was 10-0 going into that game in '05

 

[mgcolby]

Wasn't this the exact same thing we pats fans said about last years jets before they play the pats?

LOL screw the past or you will underestimate a team just like the jets after 45-3

The patriots have started slow in the last 2 playoff games.

What does any of this have to do with what you stated in the post I just responded to? I stated the Broncos defense is below average...you stated that is why you have eyes and went on to talk about their defensive ends and outside pass rush. I acknowledge Ayers, Dumervil and Miller as being very good. But the defense as a whole is not very good and pointed out reasons why.

So again what does anything in this post have to do with the topic?

Yes they have started slow the past two playoff games but for different reasons. 2009 we lost our entire offense in Welker, the team was not very good as a whole and the offense was knocked around by a defense much better than this Broncos defense.

In 2010 the offense was moving the ball well early on until Brady threw a pick and Crumpler dropped a TD. Then Chung muffs the punt fake...the Jets throw every DB on the field they can, Brady starts imagining pressure....The Jets continually benefit from a short field and Sanchez connects on some big plays and they lose.

The Broncos don't have the depth in the secondary to pull off what the Jets did. They had no answer for Hernandez even with Branch out. So I ask how does the Denver defense take away Welker, Gronk, Hernandez and Branch and the reengerized run game with Ridley. When they couldn't stop Welker, Gronk, Hernandez and Ocho and allowed nearly 5.9 ypc to Ridley and Woodhead who averaged 5.7 ypc?

 

[coolguy]

How to beat Tebow? Simple. Put up 30 points. Force him to play catchup. The Denver offense is actually fairly inefficient. The reason they beat the Steelers is because their defense dominated early and allowed Tebow to build a 20-6 halftime lead. Then they barely held on till overtime which is when the Steelers defense fell apart as D. Thomas completely dominated his defender on the one big play of the night. Nasty stiff arm + jets in his feet = toasty!

Denver has great edge rushers in Von Miller and Dumervill. But they will be mostly neutralized by the Pats tackles. The key is for the offensive line to remain stout up the middle to allow Brady to step up into his throws. Denver and the rest of the NFL still has no clue on how to stop the dual engines of destruction known as Gronk and Hernandez. Welker will be his usual chain-moving self. I like our chances, especially at home. Bring on Tebow! We're gonna put up 30 on you, what have you got?!



The last time the Pats played the Broncos:

Result - Pats 41 Broncos 23
Tom Brady
23/34 320 yards 2 tds 0 int
http://www.patriots.com/games-and-stats/game/2011/regular15/

If you're talking about playoffs, that's ancient history. Today's Broncos team is a completely different animal from the team of several seasons ago. The same is true of the current Pats team. Like I said, put up 30 on the Broncs and force them to play catch up. I don't believe they have the firepower to hang in a shootout.

THATS NOT THE FREAKING PROBLEM!!!!!!!!!

The patriots for some reason start soooo slow and out of sync at times.

 

[Metaphors]

LOL that's why you have eyes.. The broncos have a very good defense that love attacking the ball. There's a reason most teams play conservative against them and sling it on the pats. Their pass rushers have emerged as the best young DEs in the nfl.

Umm...what?

OAK - Running team
CIN - Dalton 300+ yards in 2nd career game
TEN - Hasselbeck 300+ yards with poor passing team
GB - Rodgers 400+ yards
SD - Rivers 250 yards
MIA - Moore 200 yards and took foot off pedal with 2 score lead
DET - Stafford 250+ yards in blowout
OAK - Palmer 300+ yards in 1st start for Raiders
KC - Cassel sucks and was replaced by Palko (sucks)
NYJ - Sanchez 250+ yards (which is like 500 yards for a normal QB)
SD - Rivers under 200 but SD ran for almost 200 yards
MIN - Ponder almost 400 yards
CHI - Hanie sucks and still would have won but for Barber
NE - Brady 300+ yards
BUF - Fitzpatrick 200 yards in blowout
KC - Recycled Orton throws for 180
PIT - Roethlisberger throws for almost 300 yards on one leg

Denver ranked 5th worst in the NFL with a 93 passer rating against. Even the ridiculed Pats were tied for 12th with the Giants at 86. QBs complete the exact same percentage of passes against both Denver and the Pats. That "attacking" Denver defense had 1 more sack than the Pats and 14 fewer interceptions. Big plays? Denver tied for 2nd worst in the league for giving up pass plays over 40 yards (Pats again tied for 12th).

All that means absolutely nothing because it all comes down to one game. If Denver comes up with an effective gameplan, executes it well and the Pats don't execute to their potential, the Broncos will win. That is exactly what happened yesterday and what happened in the Pats/Jets game last year. But if anyone looks at games played this year and thinks that logically translates into the Broncos winning (or even staying close), then they are fooling themselves.

 

[coolguy]

What does any of this have to do with what you stated in the post I just responded to? I stated the Broncos defense is below average...you stated that is why you have eyes and went on to talk about their defensive ends and outside pass rush. I acknowledge Ayers, Dumervil and Miller as being very good. But the defense as a whole is not very good and pointed out reasons why.

So again what does anything in this post have to do with the topic?

Yes they have started slow the past two playoff games but for different reasons. 2009 we lost our entire offense in Welker, the team was not very good as a whole and the offense was knocked around by a defense much better than this Broncos defense.

In 2010 the offense was moving the ball well early on until Brady threw a pick and Crumpler dropped a TD. Then Chung muffs the punt fake...the Jets throw every DB on the field they can, Brady starts imagining pressure....The Jets continually benefit from a short field and Sanchez connects on some big plays and they lose.

No, most of the pats close games and loses have started with slow openings.
The giants, cowboys, steelers and bronco all started like this and the pats only won down the stretch and the lost were by ONE FREAKING SCORE!!

 

[VJCPatriot]

THATS NOT THE FREAKING PROBLEM!!!!!!!!!

The patriots for some reason start soooo slow and out of sync at times.

What is the problem then in your estimation? If the Patriots put up 30 points at home, which is what they usally do, do you realistically see Denver outscoring them in a shootout? I don't.

The Pats put up 49 on the Bills after having 0 points in the 1st quarter, the Pats offense can blow up at any time. I would like to see them score early and often and put the game out of reach. But that is why they play the game. You never know what's going to happen. But the Pats do have the weapons to torch ANY team in the league.

They already put up 41 points on Denver before. They can do so again. Now am I guaranteeing 41 point output again of course not. But 30+ is reasonable considering the weapons we have and the potency of the offense. Execution and pass protection are the KEYS to the game. And I'll just add this too, whoever wins the turnover battle likely wins the game. That means take care of the football. The Pats are generally very good in this category when they are on their game.

 

[mgcolby]

No, most of the pats close games and loses have started with slow openings.
The giants, cowboys, steelers and bronco all started like this and the pats only won down the stretch and the lost were by ONE FREAKING SCORE!!

The Giants, Cowboys, Steelers, Broncos, Eagles, Dolphins and the Bills....but the slow starts were mostly do to lack of execution by the offense. Once the offense gets its act together the defenses in all but one case didn't have an answer. The Steelers came up with a strip sack. The Giants gave up what should have been a game losing TD for them.

You still didn't answer my question. If they couldn't stop us last time minus Branch at home with one of the loudest home crowds in the NFL, what makes you think they can stop us this time with him in New England? What will they do differently this time?

 

[coolguy]

Umm...what?

OAK - Running team
CIN - Dalton 300+ yards in 2nd career game
TEN - Hasselbeck 300+ yards with poor passing team
GB - Rodgers 400+ yards
SD - Rivers 250 yards
MIA - Moore 200 yards and took foot off pedal with 2 score lead
DET - Stafford 250+ yards in blowout
OAK - Palmer 300+ yards in 1st start for Raiders
KC - Cassel sucks and was replaced by Palko (sucks)
NYJ - Sanchez 250+ yards (which is like 500 yards for a normal QB)
SD - Rivers under 200 but SD ran for almost 200 yards
MIN - Ponder almost 400 yards
CHI - Hanie sucks and still would have won but for Barber
NE - Brady 300+ yards
BUF - Fitzpatrick 200 yards in blowout
KC - Recycled Orton throws for 180
PIT - Roethlisberger throws for almost 300 yards on one leg

Denver ranked 5th worst in the NFL with a 93 passer rating against. Even the ridiculed Pats were tied for 12th with the Giants at 86. QBs complete the exact same percentage of passes against both Denver and the Pats. That "attacking" Denver defense had 1 more sack than the Pats and 14 fewer interceptions. Big plays? Denver tied for 2nd worst in the league for giving up pass plays over 40 yards (Pats again tied for 12th).

All that means absolutely nothing because it all comes down to one game. If Denver comes up with an effective gameplan, executes it well and the Pats don't execute to their potential, the Broncos will win. That is exactly what happened yesterday and what happened in the Pats/Jets game last year. But if anyone looks at games played this year and thinks that logically translates into the Broncos winning (or even staying close), then they are fooling themselves.

Every defense has 300+ yard games except for the steelers....OH WAIT!!
The perception Going into the last 3 patriots playoff game
In 2007 the gaints shouldn't be able to keep up or contain the patriots
in 2009 the patriots had the ravens number and shouldn't be able to keep up with the patriots
in 2010 how can the jets keep up and stop the pats after they got destroyed 45-3
Now in the 2011 season the broncos have no chance to keep up with high flying patriots offense. LOL the patriots have lost in the playoffs to the same team they beat in the last 3 postseasons.

 

[coolguy]

What is the problem then in your estimation? If the Patriots put up 30 points at home, which is what they usally do, do you realistically see Denver outscoring them in a shootout? I don't.

The Pats put up 49 on the Bills after having 0 points in the 1st quarter, the Pats offense can blow up at any time. I would like to see them score early and often and put the game out of reach. But that is why they play the game. You never know what's going to happen. But the Pats do have the weapons to torch ANY team in the league.

They already put up 41 points on Denver before. They can do so again. Now am I guaranteeing 41 point output again of course not. But 30+ is reasonable considering the weapons we have and the potency of the offense. Execution and pass protection are the KEYS to the game. And I'll just add this too, whoever wins the turnover battle likely wins the game. That means take care of the football. The Pats are generally very good in this category when they are on their game.

Dude the pats beat the jets 45-3 and manhandled in the next game.


HAHA the pats offense has failed to get hot in the last 3 playoff games
giants 17- pats 14
Raven 33-pats 14
jets 28-pats 21 (not even that close)

Is this a coincidence?

 

[PatsGuy]

Listening to Phil Simms on WFAN. He commented that big passing plays from Tebow have always been to his left. I'm thinking about some and Simms seemed to be correct. In yesterday's game, Ike Taylor was always on the left side and was the one (absent safety help) getting burnt

 

[VJCPatriot]

Dude the pats beat the jets 45-3 and manhandled in the next game.


HAHA the pats offense has failed to get hot in the last 3 playoff games
giants 17- pats 14
Raven 33-pats 14
jets 28-pats 21 (not even that close)

Is this a coincidence?

1. You can't compare this team to teams in previous years because its composition is different. It's like comparing the 2011 Giants to the 2007 Giants. It doesn't work.
2. And I am asking this seriously, are you actually a Pats fan or just trolling for attention?
3. You haven't given much of a rationale except to say that the Pats have gotten off to 'slow starts' offensively. How do you know that will happen again vs Denver in next week's playoff matchup?
4. Quick or slow starts don't guarantee anything. See the Bills game were the Pats were down 0-21 and roared to a 49 point offensive output. Also see the AFCCG game vs the Colts where the Pats roared to a big halftime lead only to let it slip away in the second half. Only a complete 60 minute effort will get a win in the playoffs. Nobody can be underestimated.

 

[SHOWTIME15]

The message board at denverbroncos.com think they matchup well with us!!
The biggest thing coming out of this game is the Pats can't stack the box - Broncos Country Message Boards



We're gonna crush these guys even worse than the first game. There won't be any of those garbage TD drives like their first two TDs. Plus we have Spikes and Fletcher back. Can't wait.

Not saying we're going to win,but these broncos fans think that they owned us until they shot themselves in the foot. Yeah, the patriots defense had nothing to do with forcong all those turnovers. They are less afraid of the pats than they were of the steelers...

 

[coolguy]

1. You can't compare this team to teams in previous years because its composition is different. It's like comparing the 2011 Giants to the 2007 Giants. It doesn't work.
2. And I am asking this seriously, are you actually a Pats fan or just trolling for attention?
3. You haven't given much of a rationale except to say that the Pats have gotten off to 'slow starts' offensively. How do you know that will happen again vs Denver in next week's playoff matchup?
4. Quick or slow starts don't guarantee anything. See the Bills game were the Pats were down 0-21 and roared to a 49 point offensive output. Also see the AFCCG game vs the Colts where the Pats roared to a big halftime lead only to let it slip away in the second half. Only a complete 60 minute effort will get a win in the playoffs. Nobody can be underestimated.

Dude i had my heart broken these last 5 patriot seasons. I'm pessimistic about their chances because of how they failed to play like themselves

Their seems to be a blueprint on how to shutout the pats that's only being used in the postseason.

 

[Metaphors]

Every defense has 300+ yard games except for the steelers....OH WAIT!!

Tebow completed 10 passes. Every one was against either a cover 0 or a play where Troy Polamaladingdong freelanced himself into oblivion. I'm going to venture that neither of those situations happens even once on Saturday.

The perception Going into the last 3 patriots playoff game
In 2007 the gaints shouldn't be able to keep up or contain the patriots
in 2009 the patriots had the ravens number and shouldn't be able to keep up with the patriots
in 2010 how can the jets keep up and stop the pats after they got destroyed 45-3
Now in the 2011 season the broncos have no chance to keep up with high flying patriots offense. LOL the patriots have lost in the playoffs to the same team they beat in the last 3 postseasons.

Pats squeaked by Giants after losing most of that game. Pats squeaked by Ravens when receiver dropped an easy pass on 4th down in the red zone. Jets actually beat the Pats earlier that year and the year before.

Denver doesn't have that kind of success to fall back on. The Patriots had 8 drives that started in their own end. 4 TDs, no 3-n-outs and 7/8 made it at least to midfield. How is Denver going to install an answer for that in 5 days?

What about Denver running all over the Pats in the 1st quarter? Pats have already adjusted to that and had success. What do the Broncos do now to counter? I can't think of anything (particularly with Decker out) but again they only have 5 days to put something in place.

 

[Kontradiction]

I think Anderson and Brace would disagree with your assessment.

Anderson's was forced. The bobbled punt and snap, especially the one that set us up with terrific field position, were not.

 

[pdangle]

Win or lose next week and beyond, all I can say is "Thank you" Denver.

PIT was -8.0 point favorite at DEN, and would have been about -14.0 (3.0 points home field x 2) favorite at home in PIT. However, that was before the game outcome. After DEN beat the spread (the expected baseline so to speak) mathematically they become a bit stronger, so i'll just drop it down to -13.0 for simple sake of argument.

DEN is +13.0 underdog at NE, and as I have suggested above, they would be about the same point underdog if they were playing in PIT this week (after a similar win, injuries, back-to-back opponent and all other motivational factors aside). We can assume then that the world's collective betting intelligence clocked NE and PIT at about the same strength. So with the usual home point advantage, we could have expected NE to be around a 3.0 point favorite vs PIT this week had it happened, which, of course, it did not, much to the everlasting shame and chagrin (knock wood) of Squeeler Nation.

The expected straight win percentage and simple chance of advancing from games with either of those two point spreads is

 -3.0 = -140 =~ 58%
-13.0 = -550 =~ 85%

So again DEN, "Thank You". Also if I may, I'd like to give a "Shout Out" to PIT while I have the floor.

As this is now the active Den thread, I moved my response here from another thread, forgive the dupe if you run across it, b-b-bbut I'm a bad typist.

 

[Kontradiction]

Are you expecting the Broncos to run for 170 yards in the first quarter again? Because that's the only reason the Patriots had any difficulty in that first Broncos game.

Nope. If you can remember, I actually posted that this was the defense's best game after the first quarter. I don't expect us to get gashed that badly again. If you combine that with our offense actually coming out hot (instead of ridiculously cold then getting hot in the second quarter), and this game shouldn't be in doubt for us. With that said, I also don't expect the Broncos to shoot themselves in the foot numerous times like they did in the last game.

 

[Metaphors]

Anderson's was forced. The bobbled punt and snap, especially the one that set us up with terrific field position, were not.

The muffed punt was a bonehead play but the Ball fumble was a sweet play by Brace to discard his blocker and poke the ball out before the runner was down. Not sure how you can consider that "unforced".

 

[SVN]

I think the defense bills played on first quarter of the last game is what we will see.. double gronk and hernandez and put bailey on welker. Most concerned about our oline which maybe without mankins to hold up. Past playoff losses they have been the culprit.

 

[mgcolby]

I think the defense bills played on first quarter of the last game is what we will see.. double gronk and hernandez and put bailey on welker. Most concerned about our oline which maybe without mankins to hold up. Past playoff losses they have been the culprit.

If they do that Branch's numbers will be in the vicinity of 10/120/1 and in addition if they go that route then Ridley will probably have a big day.

Going empty would put a lot of pressure on that setup as well. Branch/Welker/Gronk/Hernandez/Ocho or underwood would make it tough for them to bracket any of the receivers.