Brady is NOT back, how do we fix the Patriots

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IllegalContact

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The interesting thing about tanking, or "blowing it up", etc, is that you don't need cap space to find the next franchise QB. If you find that guy, he's going to be cheap for the first 4 years. You've got that amount of time to surround that young QB with the best possible talent you can to A) Give the best possible evaluation of that QB you can by removing negative variables, and B) if he is THE GUY, you can take maximum advantage of having a young, cheap, GOOD QB.

If Tom isn't back, we don't fix the team by making it crappy. You fix it by investing in a supporting cast for whichever young QB you can get that you think could work out.


BB took the team a step backward from '99 to 2000, and it paid off
 

mgteich

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The interesting thing about tanking, or "blowing it up", etc, is that you don't need cap space to find the next franchise QB. If you find that guy, he's going to be cheap for the first 4 years. You've got that amount of time to surround that young QB with the best possible talent you can to A) Give the best possible evaluation of that QB you can by removing negative variables, and B) if he is THE GUY, you can take maximum advantage of having a young, cheap, GOOD QB.

If Tom isn't back, we don't fix the team by making it crappy. You fix it by investing in a supporting cast for whichever young QB you can get that you think could work out.

You have reduced the argument for tanking to the argument for not signing a veteran QB. I disagree this argument, but disagree. However, the disagreement is not a song one. I could see us depending on Stidham and a draftee, while AT THE SAME time doing our business as usual.
The bottom line is that we should not TRY to turn a 12-4 (could have easily been 13-3) team into a 4-12 team.

I would guess that a veteran QB might cost $10M in cap, or one could get a lesser one for $5M. So, sure, there is an argument that the value of this QB is less than the TE or WR we might sign.
However, in ANY case we need a backup[ quarterback, presumably better than Kessler. In the no-veteran scenario, we would need to draft a QB who would be ready to play if needed. Personally, I would think that the veteran is more valuable than one additional skill player.
 

IllegalContact

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The interesting thing about tanking, or "blowing it up", etc, is that you don't need cap space to find the next franchise QB. If you find that guy, he's going to be cheap for the first 4 years. You've got that amount of time to surround that young QB with the best possible talent you can to A) Give the best possible evaluation of that QB you can by removing negative variables, and B) if he is THE GUY, you can take maximum advantage of having a young, cheap, GOOD QB.

If Tom isn't back, we don't fix the team by making it crappy. You fix it by investing in a supporting cast for whichever young QB you can get that you think could work out.


it's not so much tanking as turning the page........when BB came here, he didn't tank the team as much as used a year to transition from from/to new offensive and defensive schemes......he then realized again in 2002 that he is going to have make the team younger.....especially the defense and he wasn't going to get it done in one offseason
 

scott99

Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract
I don't understand why you don't think that a 4th is reasonable for a backup QB. Yes, 4th rounders have become franchise QB's, but that is rare. There is no reason to believe that Stidham is starting material merely because he was drafted. As an aside, every Bleichick 4th has made the 53 man squad.
I think people put labels on put on players, and some think that the player can't escape that label. Prior to 2018, Stidham was rated by most prognosticators as a 1st round pick. Talent wise, he certainly matches that label more than 4th round pick. Even if we account for why he dropped to the 4th round, he was rated as a 3rd round pick for the 2019 draft, and was a great value pick in the 4th round.

I think it was pretty well documented as to why he dropped. He didn't play as well as the year prior. It's also pretty well documented as to why. His team was just way worse, but some of it falls on him as well. That being said, he may have been the best rookie QB I've seen in the Patriot's offense in preseason since Jimmy G (who he reminds me of), maybe even better. I watched him in college (his last game, a bowl game, he threw 5 TD passes), but watching him in the Pat's offense was more important.

What I noticed was, a pretty good grasp of the offense, a quick release, similar to Jimmy G (maybe not as quick), and a very good arm, can make ALL of the NFL throws. I'm not ready to ride with him just yet, I'd prefer another year or 2 of Brady while Stidham learns, but it's gonna be interesting to see if he makes that 2nd year jump, and has the ability to be a starter IF Brady leaves. Last article I read on Stidham was his teammates were very impressed with his season long improvements.
 

mgteich

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I think people put labels on put on players, and some think that the player can't escape that label. Prior to 2018, Stidham was rated by most prognosticators as a 1st round pick. Talent wise, he certainly matches that label more than 4th round pick. Even if we account for why he dropped to the 4th round, he was rated as a 3rd round pick for the 2019 draft, and was a great value pick in the 4th round.

I think it was pretty well documented as to why he dropped. He didn't play as well as the year prior. It's also pretty well documented as to why. His team was just way worse, but some of it falls on him as well. That being said, he may have been the best rookie QB I've seen in the Patriot's offense in preseason since Jimmy G (who he reminds me of), maybe even better. I watched him in college (his last game, a bowl game, he threw 5 TD passes), but watching him in the Pat's offense was more important.

What I noticed was, a pretty good grasp of the offense, a quick release, similar to Jimmy G (maybe not as quick), and a very good arm, can make ALL of the NFL throws. I'm not ready to ride with him just yet, I'd prefer another year or 2 of Brady while Stidham learns, but it's gonna be interesting to see if he makes that 2nd year jump, and has the ability to be a starter IF Brady leaves. Last article I read on Stidham was his teammates were very impressed with his season long improvements.

The issue that we seem to be discussing is whether to sign ANY veteran if Brady leaves. IMO, even if Bill likes Stidham a lot, he is likely to sign a veteran if Brady leaves. I would argue that he would also be likely to draft a QB, but that is less certain. That indeed does depend on how much he likes Stidham. Even then, I would argue that a low 3rd or a 4th is a low price to pay for competition.
 

ChrisR2223

Pro Bowl Player
The issue that we seem to be discussing is whether to sign ANY veteran if Brady leaves. IMO, even if Bill likes Stidham a lot, he is likely to sign a veteran if Brady leaves. I would argue that he would also be likely to draft a QB, but that is less certain. That indeed does depend on how much he likes Stidham. Even then, I would argue that a low 3rd or a 4th is a low price to pay for competition.
What about signing Mariota
Trading out of the first round and drafting Love or Eason in the second?
They can’t like Kessler that much right?
 

mgteich

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What about signing Mariota
Trading out of the first round and drafting Love or Eason in the second?
They can’t like Kessler that much right?

Mariota is your favorite Ok. Belichick will sign his.

Again, Belichick will likely draft a quarterback. I have no clue when, although I would think that this would happen by the 4th round. Yes, the second would be a fine spot to draft a QB. Trading down is more likely than not.
 

XLIX

Pro Bowl Player
BB took the team a step backward from '99 to 2000, and it paid off
It paid off because he stumbled ass backwards into the greatest QB in the history of the NFL in the 6th round of the 2000 draft. I'm not entirely sure that formula is repeatable.
 

scott99

Experienced Starter w/First Big Contract
Mariota is your favorite Ok. Belichick will sign his.

Again, Belichick will likely draft a quarterback. I have no clue when, although I would think that this would happen by the 4th round. Yes, the second would be a fine spot to draft a QB. Trading down is more likely than not.
I don’t think Love will make it out of the 1st round, so forget the 2nd round. Eason might not make it out of the 1st round either. If you love either QB as a GM, you stay in the 1st round and pick them (or in Love’s case, trade UP, not down).
 
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