Bible/Yaweh attrocitie thread

[3 to be 4]

Please go on...

 

[PatsFanInVa]

Grogan,

I don't understand the assumption that you're "somebody else" here, other than the fact that some here can not believe you've taken a position outside of our existing lines of debate. If you are somebody else, there's a hidden agenda, etc., then more fool me.

Again, there's no reason for you not to trot out the text of the bible, given the recent focus here on these texts. 3toB has virtually invited you to do so.

My own position has been that I do not discuss them, because my relationship to scripture is less clear-cut than, say, yours or 3toB's (or as I like to say, more nuanced.)

"Disputation" is also an invitation to this exact form of excoriation on the very face value of the texts, or an invitation to perversion of said texts, once it is agreed that face-value excoriation is not on the table (in the case of 3toB's treatment of the Hebrew bible). So, you would throw out baby and bathwater, and 3toB would throw out the bathwater and tell me to love the baby more. Neither is ideal from my point of view, but you are at least consistent.

I can not discuss your actions on other forums; second-hand, I don't like what I hear. But all I have seen here with my own eyes, happens to be questioning of the bible and of the "party line" according to 3toB. These threads are also at least back-and-forth exchanges, not just postings of recruitment campaigns such as we have seen recently.

But again, your posts are mixed liberally with anger and ad hom.

I want you to bring your viewpoint to this whole debate. Not because I'm an "unbeliever," but because I am a questioner. And I think you're on the right track, in that you're questioning too. I do not think God wants mindless robots. I also think given your experience, it makes a lot of sense to be angry. Just watch yourself.

Despite protestations to the contrary, it's not believing Christians who have historically been silenced on such subjects, it's their opponents. Don't give anybody here the excuse to do so to you.

PFnV

 

[3 to be 4]

Because, basically Grogan, you are doing what PFIV would like to do, and he wants you to learn to stay juuuust below the line like he does so you can continue to do so.

it is no surprise that he finds me "offensive" for posting positive things about Jesus and you are "on the right track". Just leave out the swearing and you're a genius!!

But i do agree on one thing, this "exchange" is actually very pleasing to me because folks are talking about the Bible and they are talking about Jesus, hopefully even READING the Bible for themselves, instead of watching the nightly news and deciding that Christianity = White, Rich Republicans.

please do check out the Bible, especially the Gospels of Matthew and John

http://bibledev.azaz.com/bibleresources/bible_kjv.php

 

[grogan2767]

First of all if you do read the Bible, start at the beginning, Genesis and read the whole thing through.

3 to 4 does NOT want you to do this. That is why he directs you to the Gospels that will make you think about Jesus. He is doing EXACTLY what I have said.

By the way 3 to 4, I am not afraid of people reading AND studying the Bible. The Bible is the CURE for Christianity.

I would respectfully ask that you no longer acuse me of being someone else. I have not lied once on this board. This is the only username I have ever had. I am a 40 year old grown man with a Fundy wife and fundy little children.

I love them very much and I am a good person. It was VERY painful for me to admit this religion is false. However, false it is. Because it is false, it hurts people very much. You teach people to fear invisible things that don't exist (SATAN?) You, 3 to 4, though it is not your fault, have the potential to HURT PEOPLE, some of them quite badly. There are MANY, MANY former Born Again Christians. (Just as much as a CHirstian as you think you are. It is vapor)

Again, I am trying to help you. Come on out of the Matrix.

http://www.ex-christian.net/

Because, basically Grogan, you are doing what PFIV would like to do, and he wants you to learn to stay juuuust below the line like he does so you can continue to do so.

it is no surprise that he finds me "offensive" for posting positive things about Jesus and you are "on the right track". Just leave out the swearing and you're a genius!!

But i do agree on one thing, this "exchange" is actually very pleasing to me because folks are talking about the Bible and they are talking about Jesus, hopefully even READING the Bible for themselves, instead of watching the nightly news and deciding that Christianity = White, Rich Republicans.

please do check out the Bible, especially the Gospels of Matthew and John

http://bibledev.azaz.com/bibleresources/bible_kjv.php

 

[3 to be 4]

First of all if you do read the Bible, start at the beginning, Genesis and read the whole thing through.

3 to 4 does NOT want you to do this. That is why he directs you to the Gospels that will make you think about Jesus. He is doing EXACTLY what I have said.

By the way 3 to 4, I am not afraid of people reading AND studying the Bible. The Bible is the CURE for Christianity.

I would respectfully ask that you no longer acuse me of being someone else. I have not lied once on this board. This is the only username I have ever had. I am a 40 year old grown man with a Fundy wife and fundy little children.

I love them very much and I am a good person. It was VERY painful for me to admit this religion is false. However, false it is. Because it is false, it hurts people very much. You teach people to fear invisible things that don't exist (SATAN?) You, 3 to 4, though it is not your fault, have the potential to HURT PEOPLE, some of them quite badly. There are MANY, MANY former Born Again Christians. (Just as much as a CHirstian as you think you are. It is vapor)

Again, I am trying to help you. Come on out of the Matrix.

http://www.ex-christian.net/

by all means, read Genesis, read the WHOLE thing, so you get the whole story, not an uncomfortable verses that doesnt suit your stomach. I love the Old Testament, try reading Psalms and Proverbs. its ironic, the "mean" chapters you are cherry picking verses from are mostly from the part of the Bible that make up the Torah. So I guess you wont be going to Temple anytime soon either.

Have a great day

 

[grogan2767]

Wrong again dude.

1SA 15:3, 7-8 "This is what the Lord says: Now go and smite Amalek, and utterly destroy all that they have; do not spare them, but kill both man and woman, infant and suckling, ox and sheep, camel and donkey ....' And Saul ... utterly destroyed all the people with the edge of the sword."

I Samuel is not is the Torah.

I have a challenge for you dude? You say you are such a CHristian. Why don't you actually address any of this stuff?

WHY is OK for God to have the Israelites kill babies with the sword? I could live with "He is God, He can do whatever He wants, ONLY if you don't claim omnibenevolence as well. He can't be omnibenevolent AND give the Isrealites laws that included burning a person alive to death (Leviticus 20) Do you have any idea how horrible a thing it is to burn someone alive? We would not have done that to Hitler! Yet he orders them to do it to certain people guilty of certain sexual sins. They didn't murder or even hurt anyone, etc.

Again. TRY to defend your God! I guarantee you can't, and that is why you are not trying!

by all means, read Genesis, read the WHOLE thing, so you get the whole story, not an uncomfortable verses that doesnt suit your stomach. I love the Old Testament, try reading Psalms and Proverbs. its ironic, the "mean" chapters you are cherry picking verses from are mostly from the part of the Bible that make up the Torah. So I guess you wont be going to Temple anytime soon either.

Have a great day

 

[grogan2767]

JG 21:10-12 "... Go and smite the inhabitants of Jabesh-gilead with the edge of the sword and; also the women and little ones.... every male and every woman that has lain with a male you shall utterly destroy."

Yaweh lets them keep the cirgin girls as plunder though.

Wrong again dude.

1SA 15:3, 7-8 "This is what the Lord says: Now go and smite Amalek, and utterly destroy all that they have; do not spare them, but kill both man and woman, infant and suckling, ox and sheep, camel and donkey ....' And Saul ... utterly destroyed all the people with the edge of the sword."

I Samuel is not is the Torah.

I have a challenge for you dude? You say you are such a CHristian. Why don't you actually address any of this stuff?

WHY is OK for God to have the Israelites kill babies with the sword? I could live with "He is God, He can do whatever He wants, ONLY if you don't claim omnibenevolence as well. He can't be omnibenevolent AND give the Isrealites laws that included burning a person alive to death (Leviticus 20) Do you have any idea how horrible a thing it is to burn someone alive? We would not have done that to Hitler! Yet he orders them to do it to certain people guilty of certain sexual sins. They didn't murder or even hurt anyone, etc.

Again. TRY to defend your God! I guarantee you can't, and that is why you are not trying!

 

[3 to be 4]

Hey, Grogan, this is us

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C8lr1trSxgg

lets try to lighten it up. have a great Saturday

 

[3 to be 4]

i guess you tube removed it. too bad, it was funny.

 

[grogan2767]

I can be light if you want to. You started all the religious stuff. Just so you know preaching the Gospel on a sports site is NOT light.

And, you called me a Jew Hater, which I am not, and I NEVER said that once on this site anywhere. You don't have my trust. You can disagree with someone and still trust them. You lied about me. Even that Jewish person from VA defended me against your anti-semetic claims. All I did was post scriptures right out of the Bible, and THEY offended you!

Go Pats!

Hey, Grogan, this is us

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C8lr1trSxgg

lets try to lighten it up. have a great Saturday

 

[3 to be 4]

I can be light if you want to. You started all the religious stuff. Just so you know preaching the Gospel on a sports site is NOT light.

And, you called me a Jew Hater, which I am not, and I NEVER said that once on this site anywhere. You don't have my trust. You can disagree with someone and still trust them. You lied about me. Even that Jewish person from VA defended me against your anti-semetic claims. All I did was post scriptures right out of the Bible, and THEY offended you!

Go Pats!

haha, "that Jewish person from Va"

you lie when you keep saying those verses offend me, and you know you are lying. You admitted that you knew you were using Hebrew verses to show that the God in those Hebrew scriptures was a "baby killer" and you said that anyone who believes in that God is a "stupid S.O.B"
hmm, if thats the God of Hebrew Scripture you are sure calling Jews "stupid S.O.B's"

and in case you havent figured it out, i dont put too much stock in what, as YOU call him "That Jewish person from Va" says. He "hijacked", as he likes to say, my threads, called me anti-semitic, told me i wasnt a Jew, ridicules pretty much all scripture, including Hebrew Scripture, talks more like an athiest, and when you were bashing the God of Abraham, Moses, David, and Daniel, he sat silent about that and rooted you on because he hates the idea of Christ so much that was more important to him than speaking up for his own God.

He aint no Jew im going to listen to. I didnt lie about either one of you guys, and i didnt invite either one of you to ridicule Christians, Christianity, ************, or myself, but you both chose to. And when you got it back, neither one of you could take it.

I will always stand up for God. And in this case it was more than about Jesus. This was about the Father. And still being Jewish, one that accepts that ************ is the Messiah, It is my obligation to not remain silent when God is being trashed and ridiculed.

I may have "started" all the religious stuff. Why couldnt you have made a postive contribution about what you believe as a counter? I always respect that. What i do not respect is people who barge into other people threads and disrupt with negativity.
Did i barge into your athiest thread? Did i disrupt "That Jewish person from VA" thread "Jews for Judaism"?
No. Why is it always open season on Christians?