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2021 Patriots Season:
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Sep 12th

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BaconGrundleCandy

NFL Expert / Tone Setter
PatsFans.com Supporter
Going to start an all-time draft thread.

Looking for 14 posters that are active and want to participate through and through.

Any player is available and we'll assume that player is at his peak. 53 players + HC, OC, DC. So 56 picks all together. Hence the active request above. I thought about less players decided against it for two reasons.
1)Having only 11 vs 11 starters doesn't give you the full picture. What about injuries, different packages .. Again just doesn't give you the full scope.

2)In this little fantasy game each week will be played in a different era. So ...

Week one - 1991

Week two - 1939

Week three - 1974

Week five - 1998

Week six - 1961

Week seven - 2021

Week eight - 2017

Week nine - 1949

Week ten - 2003

Week eleven - 1985

Week twelve - 1966

... You get the idea. So it would be tough to limit this to only 11 vs 11. I think this is a good way to keep the old timers involved since they set standards, did it at that time and played by those rules. This might be key with certain positions if you think about it.

Each poster is allowed 1 trade for obvious reasons. This will take long enough but since I'm making it I want to make at least one trade while cosplaying GM. Let's keep this very simple. One trade. 1st for a 2nd and 5th. 2nd for 3rd & 4th. Nothing crazy. Once you propose the trade you have 30 mins for someone to answer. Put out an offer and if no one bites make a pick.

Each poster has two hours to make a pick. I don't anticipate it taking that long at all for the first half of this nonsense. This will take place in a few days so everyone will get a chance to make a cheat sheet or priority players. @Ice_Ice_Brady had a good idea of each poster coming up with a list of priority players in case they can't make a pick. **** happens so I get it but again let's try to make this happen in real time. We'll set aside some days/times and try to be efficient with it.

Let's say 50-100 priority players. @Ice_Ice_Brady is making some sheets up I believe to help.

While we post let's keep track of our team. So each poster will have their team copy/paste in each post for obvious reasons.

Let's say 15 picks - 10 picks - 10 picks - two day break - 8 & 8. Again head coaches, OC, DC are up for grabs at any point. Team Bill can make him their 1st round pick if they want.

And we'll have some time to prepare. I actually think this will go fast. Think about it just like a regular roster ... for an all-time schedule. Idk I have a pretty decent feeling in who I would take.

Definitely want to keep the first thread limited to just picks for obvious reasons. Posters that don't want to, can't or just want to watch can like or agree or w/e to show what they think of certain picks.

We'll have a separate thread where people can vote on who's rosters the best/deepest - would be the best in an all-time gauntlet like the one I proposed above. There each poster with a team will give a little description - explanation of how/why they drafted and how they plan on utilizing those players. 34, 43? Under, over? Air it out or ball control? Nothing crazy just a brief description of a few alignments? Just make sure 11 players are out there on each side lol.

Don't over think it's a fantasy football draft with any player you'd like for discussion purposes.

If you'd like to play to foolish game respond to this post for a team. I am willing to compromise and change on some stuff but think it's probably perfect as is lol?

I don't want to @ any one in specific bc anyone is welcome. Honestly have no idea if 10-14 people want in. Just reply if you want in and we'll go from there. Please don't hesitate. Very possible we might have to tinker with a few things but I think it's possible.

@Ice_Ice_Brady you want in, correct?
 

Ice_Ice_Brady

Team Bill's Worst Nightmare
PatsFans.com Supporter
Going to start an all-time draft thread.

Looking for 14 posters that are active and want to participate through and through.

Any player is available and we'll assume that player is at his peak. 53 players + HC, OC, DC. So 56 picks all together. Hence the active request above. I thought about less players decided against it for two reasons.
1)Having only 11 vs 11 starters doesn't give you the full picture. What about injuries, different packages .. Again just doesn't give you the full scope.

2)In this little fantasy game each week will be played in a different era. So ...

Week one - 1991

Week two - 1939

Week three - 1974

Week five - 1998

Week six - 1961

Week seven - 2021

Week eight - 2017

Week nine - 1949

Week ten - 2003

Week eleven - 1985

Week twelve - 1966

... You get the idea. So it would be tough to limit this to only 11 vs 11. I think this is a good way to keep the old timers involved since they set standards, did it at that time and played by those rules. This might be key with certain positions if you think about it.

Each poster is allowed 1 trade for obvious reasons. This will take long enough but since I'm making it I want to make at least one trade while cosplaying GM. Let's keep this very simple. One trade. 1st for a 2nd and 5th. 2nd for 3rd & 4th. Nothing crazy. Once you propose the trade you have 30 mins for someone to answer. Put out an offer and if no one bites make a pick.

Each poster has two hours to make a pick. I don't anticipate it taking that long at all for the first half of this nonsense. This will take place in a few days so everyone will get a chance to make a cheat sheet or priority players. @Ice_Ice_Brady had a good idea of each poster coming up with a list of priority players in case they can't make a pick. **** happens so I get it but again let's try to make this happen in real time. We'll set aside some days/times and try to be efficient with it.

Let's say 50-100 priority players. @Ice_Ice_Brady is making some sheets up I believe to help.

While we post let's keep track of our team. So each poster will have their team copy/paste in each post for obvious reasons.

Let's say 15 picks - 10 picks - 10 picks - two day break - 8 & 8. Again head coaches, OC, DC are up for grabs at any point. Team Bill can make him their 1st round pick if they want.

And we'll have some time to prepare. I actually think this will go fast. Think about it just like a regular roster ... for an all-time schedule. Idk I have a pretty decent feeling in who I would take.

Definitely want to keep the first thread limited to just picks for obvious reasons. Posters that don't want to, can't or just want to watch can like or agree or w/e to show what they think of certain picks.

We'll have a separate thread where people can vote on who's rosters the best/deepest - would be the best in an all-time gauntlet like the one I proposed above. There each poster with a team will give a little description - explanation of how/why they drafted and how they plan on utilizing those players. 34, 43? Under, over? Air it out or ball control? Nothing crazy just a brief description of a few alignments? Just make sure 11 players are out there on each side lol.

Don't over think it's a fantasy football draft with any player you'd like for discussion purposes.

If you'd like to play to foolish game respond to this post for a team. I am willing to compromise and change on some stuff but think it's probably perfect as is lol?

I don't want to @ any one in specific bc anyone is welcome. Honestly have no idea if 10-14 people want in. Just reply if you want in and we'll go from there. Please don't hesitate. Very possible we might have to tinker with a few things but I think it's possible.

@Ice_Ice_Brady you want in, correct?

This will be great.

Yes. I am working on a general all-time consensus list now for everyone’s reference. I like the idea of having this played in different eras.

A handful of members in this thread would be excellent choices if they’re interested and have the time.
 

Ice_Ice_Brady

Team Bill's Worst Nightmare
PatsFans.com Supporter
Great stuff. It seems most people always call Starr a game manager, beneficiary of his running game, and carried by his coach. I wonder where we've heard all of that before?

When Starr and the Packers won three straight championships, here's where they ranked in Rushing Y/A

1965: 11/14
1966: 13/15
1967: 5/16

You would expect them to be 1st or 2nd each year from the things you hear people say about their offense.

That’s just nuts…research like this is great. I would love to see a deep dive on this.

I have little doubt those Packers were great all-around; I also have little doubt thad Starr choked like a dog in the big games, like many QBs, they would be just another great team but not a historically significant one. That’s how this all works.

The thing with being a “system QB” and relying on the run game…is that it’s always more of a fleeting success that often gets ugly in the playoffs. Ryan Tannehill is an example of a guy whose team can get him so far, but he isn’t outplaying Mahomes on many Sundays. Or a more extreme example with Case Keenum. This stuff lasts about five minutes before defenses ultimately force the QB to beat them.

So the idea that a 5X NFL Champion quarterback is a “system QB” is laughable…the guy who also retired with the high water mark passer rating.

I also haven't taken a look at the stats on this, but I wonder if the Packers preferred to hand the ball off at the goal line more than the average team? Could Starr have had a few 20+ TD seasons?

I think back to seasons like 2012 and 2016 with Brady where it seemed he had 5-10 touchdowns taken away because he gave the ball to the running back at the goal line after passing the offense down the field.

That would also be interesting. His TD% was 4.8. Unitas was 5.6%. Yeah, wondering how many running TDs for the Packers in contrast to the Colts.

Also curious about PPG for those teams.

One thing we see a lot with the best of the best is that, when they are paired with another HOFer, especially an all timer, one or the other seems to take up a fair amount of the oxygen that should have gone to the second member of the duo. And part of why that happens is timing and player/coach movement. So Lombardi tends to overshadow Starr, while Unitas, who was coached by multiple HOFers and won a SB with a relative non-entity of a coach, doesn't have to share the spotlight in the same way. It took Brady getting away from BB to really silence the "system QB" and "product of BB" claims, while Manning, who literally ported his system over to Denver after his Indy days, never had anything near the volume of similar chants. Montana got away from Walsh by taking the Chiefs to the AFCCG when he was obviously just a shell of himself, but Bradshaw will always be minimized by being with the Steelers for all of his time.

Etc.... Etc.... Etc....



It's not a 1:1 thing, but it's something that definitely impacts the equations.

All true about the coach/QB narratives. And then there’s a convenient ignorance of other factors, like Unitas having Raymond Berry, Lenny Moore, and John Mackey (three Hall of Famers) or Manning having multiple all-pros and likely two Hall of Fame receivers (Harrison, Wayne.) I understand why the Steelers incredible defense is always factored into Bradshaw’s legacy, but I’ve never understood the idea that Swann and Stallworth were incredibly talented players who made Bradshaw appear great, while Manning and Unitas were one-man shows who could win with anyone out there.
 
Last edited:

Ice_Ice_Brady

Team Bill's Worst Nightmare
PatsFans.com Supporter
I'm just going to merge in @BaconGrundleCandy 's thread here temporarily for any advice/feedback on building a consensus list of all-time great players at any position...after this is done, he'll create his own thread and we'll go back the QB focus.

I can't find a list anywhere online of the top 250/500 NFL players of all-time regardless of position, so I'm just looking at going with each individual one. I'm just going to include players in the NFL100, Hall of Fame, All Decade Teams, and really any player who comes to mind. I would then simply put the list in alphabetical order with perhaps just 1-2 tiers based on those big honors. This is all just consensus, of course, so no one is bound to draft anyone at any point due to their recommended tiers.

I think, if there's going to be ~10 teams, we'll want at least 25 players at each posiiton, meaning for a positon like CB with a CB1/CB2, you'd need to at least double that amount.
 

Ice_Ice_Brady

Team Bill's Worst Nightmare
PatsFans.com Supporter
And soon after that post...I found a good one.

Bryan Frye has a top 1000, and a recent one, but I can't find a master list (the layout here is writeup style.). I could probably copy/paste into Excel and extract the data and then categorize by positions. He has gone down from 1000 to 100...and that wouldn't be a big problem because the top 100 are easier to figure out than the bottom 900.



Very cool stuff here.
 
Last edited:

pazrul72

Rotational Player and Threatening Starter's Job
2019 Weekly Picks Winner
Going to start an all-time draft thread.

Looking for 14 posters that are active and want to participate through and through.

Any player is available and we'll assume that player is at his peak. 53 players + HC, OC, DC. So 56 picks all together. Hence the active request above. I thought about less players decided against it for two reasons.
1)Having only 11 vs 11 starters doesn't give you the full picture. What about injuries, different packages .. Again just doesn't give you the full scope.

2)In this little fantasy game each week will be played in a different era. So ...

Week one - 1991

Week two - 1939

Week three - 1974

Week five - 1998

Week six - 1961

Week seven - 2021

Week eight - 2017

Week nine - 1949

Week ten - 2003

Week eleven - 1985

Week twelve - 1966

... You get the idea. So it would be tough to limit this to only 11 vs 11. I think this is a good way to keep the old timers involved since they set standards, did it at that time and played by those rules. This might be key with certain positions if you think about it.

Each poster is allowed 1 trade for obvious reasons. This will take long enough but since I'm making it I want to make at least one trade while cosplaying GM. Let's keep this very simple. One trade. 1st for a 2nd and 5th. 2nd for 3rd & 4th. Nothing crazy. Once you propose the trade you have 30 mins for someone to answer. Put out an offer and if no one bites make a pick.

Each poster has two hours to make a pick. I don't anticipate it taking that long at all for the first half of this nonsense. This will take place in a few days so everyone will get a chance to make a cheat sheet or priority players. @Ice_Ice_Brady had a good idea of each poster coming up with a list of priority players in case they can't make a pick. **** happens so I get it but again let's try to make this happen in real time. We'll set aside some days/times and try to be efficient with it.

Let's say 50-100 priority players. @Ice_Ice_Brady is making some sheets up I believe to help.

While we post let's keep track of our team. So each poster will have their team copy/paste in each post for obvious reasons.

Let's say 15 picks - 10 picks - 10 picks - two day break - 8 & 8. Again head coaches, OC, DC are up for grabs at any point. Team Bill can make him their 1st round pick if they want.

And we'll have some time to prepare. I actually think this will go fast. Think about it just like a regular roster ... for an all-time schedule. Idk I have a pretty decent feeling in who I would take.

Definitely want to keep the first thread limited to just picks for obvious reasons. Posters that don't want to, can't or just want to watch can like or agree or w/e to show what they think of certain picks.

We'll have a separate thread where people can vote on who's rosters the best/deepest - would be the best in an all-time gauntlet like the one I proposed above. There each poster with a team will give a little description - explanation of how/why they drafted and how they plan on utilizing those players. 34, 43? Under, over? Air it out or ball control? Nothing crazy just a brief description of a few alignments? Just make sure 11 players are out there on each side lol.

Don't over think it's a fantasy football draft with any player you'd like for discussion purposes.

If you'd like to play to foolish game respond to this post for a team. I am willing to compromise and change on some stuff but think it's probably perfect as is lol?

I don't want to @ any one in specific bc anyone is welcome. Honestly have no idea if 10-14 people want in. Just reply if you want in and we'll go from there. Please don't hesitate. Very possible we might have to tinker with a few things but I think it's possible.

@Ice_Ice_Brady you want in, correct?
I want in. That sounds fun and could be very interesting
 

BaconGrundleCandy

NFL Expert / Tone Setter
PatsFans.com Supporter
I'm just going to merge in @BaconGrundleCandy 's thread here temporarily for any advice/feedback on building a consensus list of all-time great players at any position...after this is done, he'll create his own thread and we'll go back the QB focus.

I can't find a list anywhere online of the top 250/500 NFL players of all-time regardless of position, so I'm just looking at going with each individual one. I'm just going to include players in the NFL100, Hall of Fame, All Decade Teams, and really any player who comes to mind. I would then simply put the list in alphabetical order with perhaps just 1-2 tiers based on those big honors. This is all just consensus, of course, so no one is bound to draft anyone at any point due to their recommended tiers.

I think, if there's going to be ~10 teams, we'll want at least 25 players at each posiiton, meaning for a positon like CB with a CB1/CB2, you'd need to at least double that amount.
Yea I wouldn't go too crazy. Hopefully posters put something together themselves as well. I'll have a top 50-75 even though I plan on participating fully.

Need a few more brave souls though ...
 

BaconGrundleCandy

NFL Expert / Tone Setter
PatsFans.com Supporter
I want in. That sounds fun and could be very interesting
Sweet. Pretty much just as the post describes. Hopefully once we get 10-15 posters we can pick a start date next week.
Maybe make up a top 50-100 list of different players from different eras that you'd want. That's pretty much all you'll need I imagine.
 
Last edited:

Ice_Ice_Brady

Team Bill's Worst Nightmare
PatsFans.com Supporter
Sweet. Pretty much just as the post describes. Hopefully once we get 10-15 posters we can pick a start date next week.
Maybe make up a top 50-100 list of different players from different eras that you'd want. That's pretty much all you'll need I imagine.

Not many know about it yet. If you don’t mind, I can think of people to @ to call this to their attention.
 

Ice_Ice_Brady

Team Bill's Worst Nightmare
PatsFans.com Supporter
Going to start an all-time draft thread.

Looking for 14 posters that are active and want to participate through and through.

Any player is available and we'll assume that player is at his peak. 53 players + HC, OC, DC. So 56 picks all together. Hence the active request above. I thought about less players decided against it for two reasons.
1)Having only 11 vs 11 starters doesn't give you the full picture. What about injuries, different packages .. Again just doesn't give you the full scope.

2)In this little fantasy game each week will be played in a different era. So ...

Week one - 1991

Week two - 1939

Week three - 1974

Week five - 1998

Week six - 1961

Week seven - 2021

Week eight - 2017

Week nine - 1949

Week ten - 2003

Week eleven - 1985

Week twelve - 1966

... You get the idea. So it would be tough to limit this to only 11 vs 11. I think this is a good way to keep the old timers involved since they set standards, did it at that time and played by those rules. This might be key with certain positions if you think about it.

Each poster is allowed 1 trade for obvious reasons. This will take long enough but since I'm making it I want to make at least one trade while cosplaying GM. Let's keep this very simple. One trade. 1st for a 2nd and 5th. 2nd for 3rd & 4th. Nothing crazy. Once you propose the trade you have 30 mins for someone to answer. Put out an offer and if no one bites make a pick.

Each poster has two hours to make a pick. I don't anticipate it taking that long at all for the first half of this nonsense. This will take place in a few days so everyone will get a chance to make a cheat sheet or priority players. @Ice_Ice_Brady had a good idea of each poster coming up with a list of priority players in case they can't make a pick. **** happens so I get it but again let's try to make this happen in real time. We'll set aside some days/times and try to be efficient with it.

Let's say 50-100 priority players. @Ice_Ice_Brady is making some sheets up I believe to help.

While we post let's keep track of our team. So each poster will have their team copy/paste in each post for obvious reasons.

Let's say 15 picks - 10 picks - 10 picks - two day break - 8 & 8. Again head coaches, OC, DC are up for grabs at any point. Team Bill can make him their 1st round pick if they want.

And we'll have some time to prepare. I actually think this will go fast. Think about it just like a regular roster ... for an all-time schedule. Idk I have a pretty decent feeling in who I would take.

Definitely want to keep the first thread limited to just picks for obvious reasons. Posters that don't want to, can't or just want to watch can like or agree or w/e to show what they think of certain picks.

We'll have a separate thread where people can vote on who's rosters the best/deepest - would be the best in an all-time gauntlet like the one I proposed above. There each poster with a team will give a little description - explanation of how/why they drafted and how they plan on utilizing those players. 34, 43? Under, over? Air it out or ball control? Nothing crazy just a brief description of a few alignments? Just make sure 11 players are out there on each side lol.

Don't over think it's a fantasy football draft with any player you'd like for discussion purposes.

If you'd like to play to foolish game respond to this post for a team. I am willing to compromise and change on some stuff but think it's probably perfect as is lol?

I don't want to @ any one in specific bc anyone is welcome. Honestly have no idea if 10-14 people want in. Just reply if you want in and we'll go from there. Please don't hesitate. Very possible we might have to tinker with a few things but I think it's possible.

@Ice_Ice_Brady you want in, correct?

Here are some members who may have some interest in the All-Time Team draft (quoted above) because they've shown a lot of interest in football history and/or Xs and Os. Sorry if I'm excluding anyone.

I don't get too involved with the draft stuff, but there are bunch of guys on there who would probably be interested too.

If anyone is interested, please respond and let BGC know.

@Tony2046
@Deus Irae
@KontradictioN
@RobertWeathers
@BobDigital
@Ivan
@chris_in_sunnyvale
@Nehalem
@jmt57
@sean10mm
@Bleedthrough
@PP2
@patfanken
@venecol
@Joker
@1960Pats
@Actual Pats Fan
 

BaconGrundleCandy

NFL Expert / Tone Setter
PatsFans.com Supporter
Here are some members who may have some interest in the All-Time Team draft (quoted above) because they've shown a lot of interest in football history and/or Xs and Os. Sorry if I'm excluding anyone.

I don't get too involved with the draft stuff, but there are bunch of guys on there who would probably be interested too.

If anyone is interested, please respond and let BGC know.

@Tony2046
@Deus Irae
@KontradictioN
@RobertWeathers
@BobDigital
@Ivan
@chris_in_sunnyvale
@Nehalem
@jmt57
@sean10mm
@Bleedthrough
@PP2
@patfanken
@venecol
@Joker
@1960Pats
@Actual Pats Fan
My team would look better than all of the above. C'mon we need 6-7 more posters.
 

BobDigital

Pro Bowl Player
Here are some members who may have some interest in the All-Time Team draft (quoted above) because they've shown a lot of interest in football history and/or Xs and Os. Sorry if I'm excluding anyone.

I don't get too involved with the draft stuff, but there are bunch of guys on there who would probably be interested too.

If anyone is interested, please respond and let BGC know.

@Tony2046
@Deus Irae
@KontradictioN
@RobertWeathers
@BobDigital
@Ivan
@chris_in_sunnyvale
@Nehalem
@jmt57
@sean10mm
@Bleedthrough
@PP2
@patfanken
@venecol
@Joker
@1960Pats
@Actual Pats Fan
Id usually be all about it, but my schedule is weird right now. So I'll have to bow out :(
 

malik

On the Roster
So I mean the obvious problem is Eli Manning being ranked as HOF worthy at 30.

I wonder if the problem is that Eli Manning has a great post season record because he missed the post season so many times?
8-4 playoff records
2 SBs
4 one and dones
8 missed playoffs.

Maybe there should be a penalty for missing the playoffs? I mean the expectation should be that a HOF QB makes the playoffs.

So maybe every year you don't make the playoffs should count as going 0-1.

win % is how you’d factor in whether or not they made the playoffs.
 

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