A Disgraceful Display

[patsox23]

were not the same team, in years past, sorry to break the news to ya

Frankiesfly, conspicuously quiet since 10:18 AM. Way to shoot your wad prior to the game with this gem.

 

[patriotspride]

Im just waiting for someone to blame the redsox fans lol.

 

[TheBostonStraggler]

\

That statement was true once upon a time Andy but not anymore. The coaching staff is still good but it remains to be seen whether our current co-ordinators will rise to the heights of Crennel/Weis.

Will the team improve as the season progresses? It's likely. Will they be capable of making a true SB run...I'd feel more confident if the talent level on this team were higher. I think that we generally over rate our players due to past success; you know the whole 3 SB thing. Those victories mean *nothing* this year.

Did you see this team in the first SB victory year? We were not even the most talented team. Even the 3rd SB victory year too. Yes, past victories don't mean anything for next week's game. They can, however, be made use of in comparisons. The Patriots beat teams that are more talented. That is the BB legacy or at least should be. The team as a whole is what does it, from coach to qb to etc etc. A team that has no name guys who know what they are supposed to do and a coaching staff that prepares them to be in position to do it. How is it people can watch the Patriots these last years and fail to miss this? Hey, it isn't always going to work. But until it actually doesn't work, I have every expectation that the Patriots will battle their way to victories more often than not.
Regarding coordinators, it'd be great if we still had Crennel and Weiss. We don't. We still have BB and that is the most important cog in that chain hands down. Further, we have guys who were around the system, around BB, around Crennell/Weiss who are doing the job now. If they weren't up to the task, I don't believe they would be in there doing it now. Geesh! So much lack of faith in BB after how he has made this organization a well oiled machine. You think the SB's, the winning streak, and especially the no back to back losses streak is a fluke? You think it is because of a superior talent level? Or could it be superior preparation, superior planning and superior teamwork?

 

[Joker]

Rewche Caldwell showed up

Dillon bruised

Maroney is the best pick of this draft


But Jarvis Green is the real secret to the Patriots success against pocket passers

 

[fnordcircle]

Basically there's always going to be a segment of Boston sports' fans who aren't in their element until they have something to grouse about. They're happiest when things are going really bad and they can read the Shaugnessey article and shake their collective fists ruefully over how the team is doing so poorly and take it all so very personally. Until they can piss and moan about the Sox blowing a series and the Patriots throwing a costly INT or flubbing a field goal they are in some ways miserable.

Then there are those who are attempting to be realistic and unbiased who are going to say things that some people on this board or any dedicated fanboard don't want to hear. People who are trying to honestly assess the team they love who get put on public trial for it by those who flip out when one out of four analysts on ESPN don't pick the Patriots to win in a blowout.

Some of you have a real hard time distinguishing between the two.

 

[Joker]

I've sat through 2-14 seasons in lightning storms

I've seen the Pats with LB's all pro and the best corners in the league

But I've NEVER seen a Seymour...or a Wilfork...or the most unsung DL man in the league..what's his name??

But the Pats signed Jarvis Green a couple of years ago...right?? He was poised to be a free agent like alll the rest...the Pats got THAT done...yeah...I LOVE the Pats and their philosophy...Deion got WHAT tonight? Jackson is bigger, faster and potentially far scarier than a Branch could ever be. His big question is maturity....heh...well Lawrence Maroney can handle THAT


Brady was awesome last afternoon..and Watson wasn't even a factor...the Milloy/Bledsoe/Branch hangover is OVER

no way the Pats win this game except by a close score....right?


Please...Maroney was the best pick in the draft...and BB is the best coach in the league

 

[DarrylS]

I've sat through 2-14 seasons in lightning storms

I've seen the Pats with LB's all pro and the best corners in the league

But I've NEVER seen a Seymour...or a Wilfork...or the most unsung DL man in the league..what's his name??

But the Pats signed Jarvis Green a couple of years ago...right?? He was poised to be a free agent like alll the rest...the Pats got THAT done...yeah...I LOVE the Pats and their philosophy...Deion got WHAT tonight? Jackson is bigger, faster and potentially far scarier than a Branch could ever be. His big question is maturity....heh...well Lawrence Maroney can handle THAT


Brady was awesome last afternoon..and Watson wasn't even a factor...the Milloy/Bledsoe/Branch hangover is OVER

no way the Pats win this game except by a close score....right?


Please...Maroney was the best pick in the draft...and BB is the best coach in the league

While I haven't sat through lightning storms, I have been a pats fan for a long time.. yesterday is why I always believe in this team, this personnel and this system. They played their asses off and shut down a very good team, one player was not featured and one player did not stand out, a lot of guys pitched in and the game plan played to the weaknesses of the Bengals.

Not sure who did what yesterday but McDaniels, Pees and Belichick deserve a lot of credit. Sims said it best yesterday, and I paraphrase.. " a lot of teams have talent in the NFL, but there is no substitute for great coaching." I believe that this was the equalizer this week, along with the development of many of our players..

 

[AStack75]

It was also a disgraceful display by the media (including the local media). Repeat after me...

I WILL NOT TALK FOR SEVEN STRAIGHT DAY'S ABOUT TOM BRADY'S BODY LANGUAGE
I WILL NOT TALK FOR SEVEN STRAIGHT DAY'S ABOUT TOM BRADY'S BODY LANGUAGE
I WILL NOT TALK FOR SEVEN STRAIGHT DAY'S ABOUT TOM BRADY'S BODY LANGUAGE
I WILL NOT TALK FOR SEVEN STRAIGHT DAY'S ABOUT TOM BRADY'S BODY LANGUAGE
I WILL NOT TALK FOR SEVEN STRAIGHT DAY'S ABOUT TOM BRADY'S BODY LANGUAGE
I WILL NOT TALK FOR SEVEN STRAIGHT DAY'S ABOUT TOM BRADY'S BODY LANGUAGE...

 

[Joker]

Exactly
Maroney showed up big

but so did Jarvis Green...do NOT overlook this

we won against the Bengals with Hank Poteat and Troy Brown playing secondary


but Dillon KILLED them with his runs...I've played ball..when you gear up for a Dillon,you get KILLED by a Maroney

you all saw it

healthy we are looking at vintage NY Giants except DEEPER at key offensive positions

 

[Clonamery]

How do you know it's only week 4. Bill Belichick's teams have a history of striving in the later part of the season. Or don't you know that about his teams.

I was freaking out after game #2 last year when the Pats lost to Carolina 27-17. The passive defense, the lack of a running game, the interception and overthrows - what the heck was wrong with #12, no special teams coverage at all. The end was near for my dear Patriots.

What a schmuck I was...pouted for about 18 hrs...came here and was put into perspective.

 

[teamplay]

Thanks, Andy, for an important post. In the time I've been reading and posting here, I would say that the culture of this board has moved through three stages:

1. Bliss over every win and accomplishment as the team exceeded every expectation (2001 to 2003)

2. Awe over an unprecedented win streak and league dominance (2003 to 2004)

3. Fear and disappointment over every loss and disappointment (2005 to present)

We've been spoiled by excellence: the glass is half-empty now rather than half-full. A sense of entitlement slips into our thoughts.

Let's take a breath, remember that statistically, we should expect to win half our games and the Super Bowl once every 32 years. Appreciate every win and achievement that exceeds that base-line.

...and ESPECIALLY enjoy the journey that Andy describes: a Pats team that fixes problems and consistently gets better as the season wears on.

Here's the scorecard I'm using:

Run defense: very good, moving to scary great.
Pass rush: very good, moving to dominant.
Pass defense: iffy, but traditionally fixable.
Run offense: excellent, and likely to stay so (sans injuries).
Pass blocking: very good (a few dangerous blitz hits on TB), moving to excellent.
Passing: too early to say, but promising due to TB and play-action advantages.
Special teams: good.
Kicking: good despite 3 missed FGs, potential to be very good.

Pretty cool, IMHO; enjoy the journey!

 

[VJCPatriot]

Dunno what to say except it is human nature to worry. Yes I think we have very good talent on this team. But do I get concerned when Brady has a horrible game and looks totally out of sync with his receivers, not to mention the very promising run defense disappears against Denver? Sure. You bet.

Does it mean I've given up on this team and the season? Hardly. Maroney has come on like gangbusters. Chad Jackson has teased us with glimpses of his big play ability. Brady is starting to sync some with Gabriel.

I think things are looking up. And I agree that teams at the end of the season are usually even better than they start. It is going to be very interesting to see how this team develops. Right now it looks like 2,000 yards total rushing is entirely possible with this team.

And that's a GOOD thing. Good running teams win in the playoffs traditionally. Just look what the Steelers managed to do riding the BUS on his last season before retirement! Look what Dillon's first season did to rejuvenate the Pats offense. I think Maroney will have the same effect and also save wear and tear on Dillon down the road. Having both healthy will be essential come playoff time.

Having stated the positives let me sum up by saying I think that people have a right to worry and a right to complain. I doubt that makes them any less faithful fans. If anything it shows they care that much to know that a backup DB like Gay is out for the season and that Geno was replaced by a 2nd string guy like Artrell Hawkins.

 

[PATSNUTme]

Im just waiting for someone to blame the redsox fans lol.

It's those friggin Red Sox fans who have come here since they crashed and burned.

BTW, I heard that there is no more room on the bandwagon and there is a waiting list.

 

[patpatriot]

Did you see this team in the first SB victory year? We were not even the most talented team.

In 2001 the Pats Defense and Special teams were superior to St Louis in terms of talent (though the scheme was also a big part of it). Not to mention the enormous horseshoe they had up their *ss (see the not playing Denver in the 2001 playoffs thread).

Even the 3rd SB victory year too. Yes, past victories don't mean anything for next week's game.

Sometimes they can actually be a problem was my point. It leads you to think that Bru for instance isthe same player in terms of talent that he was in 2001 which he clearly isn't.

They can, however, be made use of in comparisons. The Patriots beat teams that are more talented. That is the BB legacy or at least should be. The team as a whole is what does it, from coach to qb to etc etc. A team that has no name guys who know what they are supposed to do and a coaching staff that prepares them to be in position to do it. How is it people can watch the Patriots these last years and fail to miss this? Hey, it isn't always going to work. But until it actually doesn't work, I have every expectation that the Patriots will battle their way to victories more often than not.

The Pats teams circa 2001-2004 were filled with very talented football players. Not "name brand" guys for the most part but good to very good players in terms of talent. Yes the "system" was a big part of it but go review Willie Mac's rant on that subject.

Regarding coordinators, it'd be great if we still had Crennel and Weiss. We don't. We still have BB and that is the most important cog in that chain hands down. Further, we have guys who were around the system, around BB, around Crennell/Weiss who are doing the job now. If they weren't up to the task, I don't believe they would be in there doing it now.

Ever consider that maybe those guys were just the best guys available and not the best guys?

Geesh! So much lack of faith in BB after how he has made this organization a well oiled machine. You think the SB's, the winning streak, and especially the no back to back losses streak is a fluke? You think it is because of a superior talent level? Or could it be superior preparation, superior planning and superior teamwork?

I have plenty of faith in BB. I just know that he can't turn water into wine *every* Sunday. One of the great myths surrounding this team is that they were a bunch of average Joes who were coached up to SB level performance. It's not true. Even this year their starting 22 players are very talented (for the most part... I'm losing faith in Wilson for instance). The true strength of the team used to be in the other 31 players who were also very solid. I don't think that is true in many cases anymore (exempting OL DL and perhaps RB and QB).

 

[Seymour93]

I'm stretching here but, being a fan of a very successful sports team in a way is like a drug addiction. When they don't win on the weekends, it's almost like for a drug addict when the town is dry- the fans b*tch, moan, and are generally in a pissy mood that their team didn't do the norm - win.

No fan base is immune to becoming spoiled. You think we're bad? If the Yankees were to miss the playoffs, you know Joe Torre would be fired the day after the season ends. Look at ice hockey here and soccer in continental Europe, they both go through coaches by the month it seems.

If we lose to Miami this week, the temporary high from the Bengals game will be completely gone and once again there will be more than just a few questioning the team, coaches, and FO. It's the ups and downs of the sports' world that keeps us coming back for more.

 

[BayAreaPatsFan]

I'm with you. It was tough reading the forum after the Denver loss. Brady should be benched, Belichick screwd up, etc etc. Its amazing how Patsfan has been so spoiled by those three SB wins. I remember clear as day, the Chuck Fairbanks, Ron Meyer years, the beat downs by Dan Marino's Dolphins and the hug lopsided losses to Denver, those were tough years. And here we were at 2-1 and Patsfan was calling out Belichick, saying Brady should be benched, it was sickening. I am the opposite, the Patriots could go 6 and 10 this year, but you still can't wipe the smile off of me every time I think about those 3 SB wins.