2021 UDFA Signings Thread

[Wozzy]

Yes, a great O-line. Full of UDFAs and people who never played football in college like Stephen Neal. Not to mention Compton, Andruzzi, Connolly, Donald Thomas, Ted Karras, Nate Solder, Trent Brown and a bunch of other guys who made good money by signing contracts elsewhere and then falling on their faces. Oh, we've had a few studs over the years w/ premium draft picks, like Mankins, Vollmer and Thuney, but by and large, when your QB gets the ball out in 1.5 seconds, your O-line will look stellar.

Not to mention that Tampa OL that was a sieve last year and gave up a ton of sacks. Suddenly they're a great OL, I wonder why.

Yet somehow they managed to keep Brady among the least sacked QB's in the NFL and the offense among the best at rushing the ball... the best O-Lines in the NFL, along with some of the best defensive and special team's units... but teams only win because of magical unicorn QB's.

Like in 2016 when Drew Brees led the NFL in passing on the 2nd ranked offense in the entire league, the Saints defense on the other hand was ranked 32nd... dead last. That team went 7-9... Drew Brees didn't do enough, he didn't possess the "clutch gene" that Tom did, Tom would have willed that horrid defense to greatness won the Super Bowl with that roster.

Seriously... cheerleading hero worship isn't a good look for full grown adults. It's hilarious how you Brady zealots insult every great player who has walked through those doors and contributed to championships over the last two decades... but take umbrage at those of us pointing out that football is the ultimate team sport and call us Brady haters.

 

[WinstonSmith]

Yes, a great O-line. Full of UDFAs and people who never played football in college like Stephen Neal. Not to mention Compton, Andruzzi, Connolly, Donald Thomas, Ted Karras, Nate Solder, Trent Brown and a bunch of other guys who made good money by signing contracts elsewhere and then falling on their faces. Oh, we've had a few studs over the years w/ premium draft picks, like Mankins, Vollmer and Thuney, but by and large, when your QB gets the ball out in 1.5 seconds, your O-line will look stellar.

Not to mention that Tampa OL that was a sieve last year and gave up a ton of sacks. Suddenly they're a great OL, I wonder why.

Stephen Neal was a solid player despite his path to the NFL. The Patriots with Tom as the QB usually had at least an above average line. For the 2020 season PFF had the Tampa line ranked 5th overall (solid) and the Pat's 4th overall.

I'm not sure why some have this need to canonize Tom at the expense of other players.

 

[Wozzy]

Stephen Neal was a solid player despite his path to the NFL. The Patriots with Tom as the QB usually had at least an above average line. For the 2020 season PFF had the Tampa line ranked 5th overall (solid) and the Pat's 4th overall.

I'm not sure why some have this need to canonize Tom at the expense of other players.

Before he became UDFA Stephen Neal...

NCAA Division I Wrestling Champion (1998, 1999)
World Champion in freestyle wrestling (1999)

The guy was a world class athlete.

 

[jah]

I said 3 or 4.

But I wonder what you guys are watching. Are you serious? It's hard to take you seriously. Jakobi is going to be a key guy for us.

The teams we play though have bonafide 1s and 2s. Patriots fans are so starved for serious outside threats that we think Jakobi (a guy who is a very good 3rd/possession receiver) is in that range. He's not.

This is crazy.

If Tom Brady were the QB, I wouldn't be saying anything about our WRs since he works well with these types. Brady is gone. We need studs at WR now.

Once the coaches realized he should play more, his statistical pace was that of a very good #2 WR in our offense. I'm open to Bourne being better than him, but as far as I'm concerned the top spot on the depth chart is his to lose (he'll probably lose to Agholor and be #2). In a more WR-heavy offense, I would want a better WR2, but we signed two very good tight ends.

I'm obviously not against going for an upgrade at WR. I'm just always going to defend Meyers (until he proves me wrong) because all he's done is improve, make the most of his opportunities, and put up impressive stats in a ****ty situation. I wouldn't be in such a rush to demote him on the depth chart or put a hard ceiling on his potential. In all probability, he will start to show his ceiling soon, similar to how JC Jackson was exposed late 2020 as a CB2 at best. I just haven't seen that yet from Meyers.

 

[WaterfallJumper]

Can y'all argue in some other thread? Let's keep this one about UDFA.

I wonder how we'll split up kicking duties in the preseason. I imagine Folk will get a few chances to stay sharp, but I'd like to see the other two take the majority of the kicks. It's one of the more intriguing long-term battles on the roster for me.

 

[ashley]

Hey guys,

Let's please get back on topic here. Thank you.

Ash

 

[Clonamery]

Hey guys,

Let's please get back on topic here. Thank you.

Ash

Um, yeah. 3 kickers, ah, uh, none have a tattoo that's, you know, interesting, that we can see anyway. Guess Folk is the front runner. But he's limited in leg strength though he's a regular guy that Folk. The other 2, I forget their names, probably like BB has, too. No Ernie Adams to remind him who the rookies are anymore.

Wish they'd sign another UDFA just to light a fire in this thread.

 

[upstater1]

Yet somehow they managed to keep Brady among the least sacked QB's in the NFL and the offense among the best at rushing the ball... the best O-Lines in the NFL, along with some of the best defensive and special team's units... but teams only win because of magical unicorn QB's.

Like in 2016 when Drew Brees led the NFL in passing on the 2nd ranked offense in the entire league, the Saints defense on the other hand was ranked 32nd... dead last. That team went 7-9... Drew Brees didn't do enough, he didn't possess the "clutch gene" that Tom did, Tom would have willed that horrid defense to greatness won the Super Bowl with that roster.

Seriously... cheerleading hero worship isn't a good look for full grown adults. It's hilarious how you Brady zealots insult every great player who has walked through those doors and contributed to championships over the last two decades... but take umbrage at those of us pointing out that football is the ultimate team sport and call us Brady haters.

I'm basing this on facts.

Donald Thomas keeps Brady clean in New England. Signs big contract with the Colts. Gets cut.
Russ Hochstein. universally denigrated. Keeps Brady clean. Signs contract elsewhere. Cut.
It's happened over and over and over.

Scarnecchia had a huge hand in this.

But--Brady goes to Tampa where the OL is much criticized, and suddenly they're excellent in pass protection (though not very good run blocking because they dont have a Scarnecchia).

It amazes me how you consistently underrate Brady.

When Bosa was going after him in the 2018 playoffs, he had to stop and compliment Brady for never giving him a chance. Brady gets the ball out faster than any QB in the NFL and perhaps in NFL history. Bosa is on the sideline marveling about Brady's ability to nullify the pass rush. He's not talking about the great O-Line. Bosa knows he's being nullified by Brady, and he admires it. The Patriots did not devote significant resources to the OL until the last several years beginning with the drafting of Thuney and Mason. Before that, they had 1 blue chipper, at best 2, and 3 unheralded guys holding down the fort. A good thing to do when your QB is Tom Brady.

 

[upstater1]

Once the coaches realized he should play more, his statistical pace was that of a very good #2 WR in our offense. I'm open to Bourne being better than him, but as far as I'm concerned the top spot on the depth chart is his to lose (he'll probably lose to Agholor and be #2). In a more WR-heavy offense, I would want a better WR2, but we signed two very good tight ends.

I'm obviously not against going for an upgrade at WR. I'm just always going to defend Meyers (until he proves me wrong) because all he's done is improve, make the most of his opportunities, and put up impressive stats in a ****ty situation. I wouldn't be in such a rush to demote him on the depth chart or put a hard ceiling on his potential. In all probability, he will start to show his ceiling soon, similar to how JC Jackson was exposed late 2020 as a CB2 at best. I just haven't seen that yet from Meyers.

By putting him at the #3 slot, it's more about his style of play. Not an outside guy or classic #2.

 

[upstater1]

Stephen Neal was a solid player despite his path to the NFL. The Patriots with Tom as the QB usually had at least an above average line. For the 2020 season PFF had the Tampa line ranked 5th overall (solid) and the Pat's 4th overall.

I'm not sure why some have this need to canonize Tom at the expense of other players.

Because those same players on these above average OLs go elsewhere and flame out. It's happened over and over and over. They made their rep playing in front of Brady. Solder, Trent Brown, Donald Thomas, Hochstein, I can name so many of these guys. They leave and suddenly they are not so hot. Donald Thomas should really shovel some cash over to Brady's favorite charity.

It's the same with Tampa. They ranked 5th overall WITH Brady. Before he got there they were much criticized. Look at the numbers.

 

[hornetfb85]

Back on track guys, let’s breakdown our recent UDFA signings...
Well that’s about all I got, anyone have anything to add????

 

[Sicilian]

I, for one, am hopeful that our kicker can kick field goals. There is a direct correlation between kicking a football through the uprights and occurrences of a score going up by at least 1 point (sometimes even 3). When a kicker fails to kick the ball through the upright, it very rarely results in any points (statistically approaching 0). This kid will have to come in and kick the ball through the uprights to have a chance to make the team.

Stay tuned, I'm producing a 47 minute Youtube video to breakdown the paragraph above for clarity.

 

[DaBruinz]

I guess I'm wrong and you're right even though 99.999999999% of anaylysts have made the point about the lack of quality with Patriots WRs.

I mean, you're talking about Jakobi and Gunner to me to prove I'm wrong! Think about that.

I like Jakobi as a 3rd or 4th. But I did notice that in a year in which the Patriots were woeful at WR in 2019, Belichick did not play Jakobi vry much at all. These are not the stellar WRs we're going to need in the future without Brady.

Your argument loses validity when you insist on talking about how much a UDFA receiver played his ROOKIE YEAR.

This sort of ridiculous argument was made by people who shat on Edelman for years before he became of the the best WR that ever put on a Pats uniform.

After Meyers healed from his injury, he was a top 25 WR last year.

I've loved Gunner since he was signed. His work ethic is nearly identical to Edelman.

We aren't going to need "stellar" WRs. We are going to need receivers (WR/TE/RB) who can get open and catch the ball when it's thrown to them. And, the Patriots receivers were in the top 5 in terms of being open last year with an average of 3.7 yards.. It's why so many of us pointed out that the issue was NEWTON and not the receivers.

 

[DaBruinz]

I'm basing this on facts.

Donald Thomas keeps Brady clean in New England. Signs big contract with the Colts. Gets cut.
Russ Hochstein. universally denigrated. Keeps Brady clean. Signs contract elsewhere. Cut.
It's happened over and over and over.

No. You're purposely ignoring FACTS to suit your lame argument. Such as the fact that Thomas got INJURED and wasn't cut until his 3rd year with the Colts because of a torn quad that never healed properly./.

Russ Hochstein played 3 season in Denver, missing all of 2 games. Then he signed with KC for 11 games.

If you're going to pull this out as an "example" of someone failing elsewhere, then you're being Deus and there is no point talking to you.

 

[Jim Beankie]

I, for one, am hopeful that our kicker can kick field goals. There is a direct correlation between kicking a football through the uprights and occurrences of a score going up by at least 1 point (sometimes even 3). When a kicker fails to kick the ball through the upright, it very rarely results in any points (statistically approaching 0). This kid will have to come in and kick the ball through the uprights to have a chance to make the team.

Stay tuned, I'm producing a 47 minute Youtube video to breakdown the paragraph above for clarity.

 

[Wozzy]

I'm basing this on facts.

Donald Thomas keeps Brady clean in New England. Signs big contract with the Colts. Gets cut.
Russ Hochstein. universally denigrated. Keeps Brady clean. Signs contract elsewhere. Cut.
It's happened over and over and over.

Scarnecchia had a huge hand in this.

But--Brady goes to Tampa where the OL is much criticized, and suddenly they're excellent in pass protection (though not very good run blocking because they dont have a Scarnecchia).

It amazes me how you consistently underrate Brady.

When Bosa was going after him in the 2018 playoffs, he had to stop and compliment Brady for never giving him a chance. Brady gets the ball out faster than any QB in the NFL and perhaps in NFL history. Bosa is on the sideline marveling about Brady's ability to nullify the pass rush. He's not talking about the great O-Line. Bosa knows he's being nullified by Brady, and he admires it. The Patriots did not devote significant resources to the OL until the last several years beginning with the drafting of Thuney and Mason. Before that, they had 1 blue chipper, at best 2, and 3 unheralded guys holding down the fort. A good thing to do when your QB is Tom Brady.

Brady went to Tampa, they draft a lineman first overall then sign multiple free agents to shore up the depth. So a team that led the NFL in passing yards the season prior with Jameis crab legs Winston does well again the following season with a much better QB who doesn’t lead the NFL in turnovers the way Jameis did... uncanny.

How does Brady make the Patriot’s defense and Special teams a top unit for two decades, how does he do it in Tampa... this ought to be fun?

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

Yet somehow they managed to keep Brady among the least sacked QB's in the NFL and the offense among the best at rushing the ball... the best O-Lines in the NFL, along with some of the best defensive and special team's units... but teams only win because of magical unicorn QB's.

Like in 2016 when Drew Brees led the NFL in passing on the 2nd ranked offense in the entire league, the Saints defense on the other hand was ranked 32nd... dead last. That team went 7-9... Drew Brees didn't do enough, he didn't possess the "clutch gene" that Tom did, Tom would have willed that horrid defense to greatness won the Super Bowl with that roster.

The classic Wozzy argument. Choose an outlier, pretend its the norm, and make a terrible and dishonest argument. Ignore a mountain of common sense and evidence that makes you look foolish: in this case that the postseason seeds are now essentially a quarterback hierarchy.

The events of 2020-21 have broken you, son. I remember last year how full of hope and optimism you were that finally your far fetched arguments would be vindicated with your IBWT mantra. Must have been really hard to watch what happened. Good luck getting your life back on track...I can tell you’ve been through a lot.

 

[Wozzy]

The classic Wozzy argument. Choose an outlier, pretend its the norm, and make a terrible and dishonest argument. Ignore a mountain of common sense and evidence that makes you look foolish: in this case that the postseason seeds are now essentially a quarterback hierarchy.

The events of 2020-21 have broken you, son. I remember last year how full of hope and optimism you were that finally your far fetched arguments would be vindicated with your IBWT mantra. Must have been really hard to watch what happened. Good luck getting your life back on track...I can tell you’ve been through a lot.

WTF are you going on about?

I said 2020 was a reloading year and they were fixing their salary cap before a single game had been played... nice try.

And the Patriots offensive line, defense and special teams being among the best units in the league for two decades isn’t opinion... and when they weren’t it was due to injury.

 

[hornetfb85]

Guys Guys Guys...back on track here...so how bout that UDFA kick...

 

[upstater1]

Brady went to Tampa, they draft a lineman first overall then sign multiple free agents to shore up the depth. So a team that led the NFL in passing yards the season prior with Jameis crab legs Winston does well again the following season with a much better QB who doesn’t lead the NFL in turnovers the way Jameis did... uncanny.

How does Brady make the Patriot’s defense and Special teams a top unit for two decades, how does he do it in Tampa... this ought to be fun?

How many articles do you want me to give you that had the 2019-20 Bucs O-line as inconsistent and less than average? Marpet was the one who was pretty good in prior years. Donovan Smith was a disaster. In a post-season assessment, many thought that Cappa was on his way out the door because of his poor season. Especially against the pass rush, these guys were swivels. Lots of sacks. And maybe Wirfs was the difference in improving the OL since he's really good, but what accounts for the improvement in Smith and Cappa?

"Here is the Bucs report assessment: "Donovan Smith was the 2nd most penalized linemen on the team and if not for declined penalties, like Dotson he would have been one of the most penalized linemen in the league. It’s unfortunate that Smith had an underwhelming season because when the team resigned him to a 3-year deal this past off-season, they did so hoping he would be one of the better players at his position. He is guaranteed $14.5 million dollars in 2020, so barring any trade we will see him back in a Bucs jersey next season and it will be make or break for him. If he has another lackluster year, the team can release him in the off-season without owing any guaranteed money. I also don’t see Cappa as a long term answer at right guard. So in addition to looking for a new right tackle, I think the team should look for a new guard. And because Cappa doesn’t have a big contract, they should keep him to bolster depth on the line."

How many articles do you want me to give you on Tampa's bad play before Brady got there?

Here's a couple more:

Bucs' offensive line among NFL's best in pass protection in 2020

Brady was pressured on less than a quarter of his dropbacks in 2020.

bucswire.usatoday.com

Why the Buccaneer offensive line can be dominant in 2020

The Tampa Bay Buccaneers have played with a lackluster offensive line for the past few years, but that could change during this upcoming season.

thepewterplank.com

Tampa Bay Buccaneers offensive line rated as top-5 in NFL

The Tampa Bay Buccaneers offensive line has made massive strides over their previous seasons, and 2020 has seen a new high for the unit.

thepewterplank.com