Celtics 2024-2025 Discussion

[Lansdowne]

There’s a good chance one or both of Jrue Holiday and Kristaps Porzingis are gone after this Celtics season concludes, since it’s going to be financially not sustainable to keep everyone. I read five players on the team are set to make $28+ million each next season which is an NBA record. New ownership is not going to want to absorb all that luxury tax. So with that in mind, there should be some urgency for this iteration of the Celtics to complete the mission and be our first back-to-back champions since the late ‘60s. Because this will likely be the last chance with this group. With some good fortune health-wise I think they can pull it off.

 

[Zuma]

There’s a good chance one or both of Jrue Holiday and Kristaps Porzingis are gone after this Celtics season concludes, since it’s going to be financially not sustainable to keep everyone. I read five players on the team are set to make $28+ million each next season which is an NBA record. New ownership is not going to want to absorb all that luxury tax. So with that in mind, there should be some urgency for this iteration of the Celtics to complete the mission and be our first back-to-back champions since the late ‘60s. Because this will likely be the last chance with this group. With some good fortune health-wise I think they can pull it off.

You're probably right. I don't know the numbers but if two have to go...I would feel better if it's Holiday and Horford.

 

[ViperGTS]

Brunson is absolutely their alpha dog. KAT is a sidekick…it’s in his blood. Anunoby is easily their second best player and maybe as good as Brunson. He’s a hell of a defender and steps into his role offensively.

I don't know to me Brunson is a bit overrated because he plays in NY. Get a sticky guard on him and you can neutralize him a decent amount. Those small guys, it usually catches up to them.

For reference if Tatum was playing in NY he would finish number 2 in the MVP voting almost every year the past 3. Might have even won one.

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

I don't know to me Brunson is a bit overrated because he plays in NY. Get a sticky guard on him and you can neutralize him a decent amount. Those small guys, it usually catches up to them.

For reference if Tatum was playing in NY he would finish number 2 in the MVP voting almost every year the past 3. Might have even won one.

He is overrated, but he’s definitely the team’s leader and it all goes through him. He’s a heck of a playmaker and scorer but not a great defender. He’s also the most annoying foul baiting flopper in the NBA, bar none. Worse than Luka, LeBron, Dame, anyone. Constantly initiating contact, whining, and faking.

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

You're probably right. I don't know the numbers but if two have to go...I would feel better if it's Holiday and Horford.

I think Horford will retire unless it’s a 3 peat attempt.

 

[RobertWeathers]

There’s a good chance one or both of Jrue Holiday and Kristaps Porzingis are gone after this Celtics season concludes, since it’s going to be financially not sustainable to keep everyone. I read five players on the team are set to make $28+ million each next season which is an NBA record. New ownership is not going to want to absorb all that luxury tax. So with that in mind, there should be some urgency for this iteration of the Celtics to complete the mission and be our first back-to-back champions since the late ‘60s. Because this will likely be the last chance with this group. With some good fortune health-wise I think they can pull it off.

I think it'll come down Brad's evaluation of the roster and what Chisholm and the ownership group can get away with and not be perceived as cheap or dismantling a championship core in order to trim the luxury tax. Ownership PR is important.

Keep in mind their latest round of investment for the purchase of the team was oversubscribed. That means they have more money than they asked for. In theory they could cover the 2nd apron/~$230m in luxury tax....but they won't use it for that.

If they go back-to-back, If Brad can justify it , I can absolutely see them running it back with the starting five. However, I think Hauser and Big Al will not be back next year. Thats ~$20m and saves them a ton in luxury tax and I think they can find players who can do their job for less money.

Now, if they lose, and Jrue looks like the 34 y/o player he is, then Brad will move him as well.

I don't see them moving KP - yet. Hes on an expiring contract, still in his prime, and unlocks JT and JB. Maybe if their extension talks go south or they are not a contender next year, then I can see them moving him at the trade deadline.

Got to win it this year.....

 

[One-If-By-Sea]

I think it'll come down Brad's evaluation of the roster and what Chisholm and the ownership group can get away with and not be perceived as cheap or dismantling a championship core in order to trim the luxury tax. Ownership PR is important.

Keep in mind their latest round of investment for the purchase of the team was oversubscribed. That means they have more money than they asked for. In theory they could cover the 2nd apron/~$230m in luxury tax....but they won't use it for that.

If they go back-to-back, If Brad can justify it , I can absolutely see them running it back with the starting five. However, I think Hauser and Big Al will not be back next year. Thats ~$20m and saves them a ton in luxury tax and I think they can find players who can do their job for less money.

Now, if they lose, and Jrue looks like the 34 y/o player he is, then Brad will move him as well.

I don't see them moving KP - yet. Hes on an expiring contract, still in his prime, and unlocks JT and JB. Maybe if their extension talks go south or they are not a contender next year, then I can see them moving him at the trade deadline.

Got to win it this year.....

It is not simply luxury tax. Other rules kick in which were added to avoid a rich owner from dominating with a stacked roster. If the Celts hit the 2nd apron for a 3rd time:

- First-round picks seven years out cannot be traded
- Teams will no longer be able to use the taxpayer mid-level exception (Vet Mins ONLY)
- If a team remains in the second apron three out of five seasons, their first-round pick will automatically move to the end of the round
- Outgoing salaries cannot be aggregated or combined in trades
- Cannot acquire a player in return in an outgoing sign-and-trade
- Teams can’t use trade exceptions created from a prior year
- Teams can no longer use cash in trades

 

[rochrist]

There’s a good chance one or both of Jrue Holiday and Kristaps Porzingis are gone after this Celtics season concludes, since it’s going to be financially not sustainable to keep everyone. I read five players on the team are set to make $28+ million each next season which is an NBA record. New ownership is not going to want to absorb all that luxury tax. So with that in mind, there should be some urgency for this iteration of the Celtics to complete the mission and be our first back-to-back champions since the late ‘60s. Because this will likely be the last chance with this group. With some good fortune health-wise I think they can pull it off.

My guess is Jrue and Hauser. Jrue because of his age, and Hauser because they've already got his replacement on the roster and looks as though he could be an upgrade. That cuts 38 million I believe.

 

[RobertWeathers]

It is not simply luxury tax. Other rules kick in which were added to avoid a rich owner from dominating with a stacked roster. If the Celts hit the 2nd apron for a 3rd time:

- First-round picks seven years out cannot be traded
- Teams will no longer be able to use the taxpayer mid-level exception (Vet Mins ONLY)
- If a team remains in the second apron three out of five seasons, their first-round pick will automatically move to the end of the round
- Outgoing salaries cannot be aggregated or combined in trades
- Cannot acquire a player in return in an outgoing sign-and-trade
- Teams can’t use trade exceptions created from a prior year
- Teams can no longer use cash in trades

Correct.

Being the Dodgers every year becomes a competitive disadvantage.

 

[bresna]

My guess is Jrue and Hauser. Jrue because of his age, and Hauser because they've already got his replacement on the roster and looks as though he could be an upgrade. That cuts 38 million I believe.

You've got me a bit confused here... you talking Scheierman replacing Hauser? That's not a zero-sum move. First off, Hasuer is 6'8" and plays mostly at forward while Scheierman is 6'6" and mostly plays guard. On top of that, Hauser's shooting percentage is miles ahead of Scheierman's (both 2's & 3's). Lastly, Hauser's D has come a long way from his early years. I don't think either one is indispensable, but I'd rather have Hauser out there than Scheierman at this point.

 

[RobertWeathers]

You've got me a bit confused here... you talking Scheierman replacing Hauser? That's not a zero-sum move. First off, Hasuer is 6'8" and plays mostly at forward while Scheierman is 6'6" and mostly plays guard. On top of that, Hauser's shooting percentage is miles ahead of Scheierman's (both 2's & 3's). Lastly, Hauser's D has come a long way from his early years. I don't think either one is indispensable, but I'd rather have Hauser out there than Scheierman at this point.

Agree he isn't a replacement, but Hauser's 2025-2026 $10 million salary would effectively cost Boston $90 million when factoring in the luxury tax.

 

[1960Pats]

Great post.

For NYK, I think their guy is Brunson. Add Ant from MN to your "in" list.

That's a great way to look at things.

I've been putting together a list of the current top players, at least for their regular season careers. On my list Brunson is at 38 and Towns is at 3.

The Celtics have 6 players at 13, 15, 19, T30 and 44. That's some serious depth that doesn't even count Pritchard.

The top ranked player left is Kawhi Leonard and he was tied with Kevin Durant.

 

[RobertWeathers]

That's a great way to look at things.

I've been putting together a list of the current top players, at least for their regular season careers. On my list Brunson is at 38 and Towns is at 3.

The Celtics have 6 players at 13, 15, 19, T30 and 44. That's some serious depth that doesn't even count Pritchard.

The top ranked player left is Kawhi Leonard and he was tied with Kevin Durant.

Whos 13 for the Celtics? JT? Hes top 5 easy.

 

[rochrist]

You've got me a bit confused here... you talking Scheierman replacing Hauser? That's not a zero-sum move. First off, Hasuer is 6'8" and plays mostly at forward while Scheierman is 6'6" and mostly plays guard. On top of that, Hauser's shooting percentage is miles ahead of Scheierman's (both 2's & 3's). Lastly, Hauser's D has come a long way from his early years. I don't think either one is indispensable, but I'd rather have Hauser out there than Scheierman at this point.

Scheierman made a huge amount of progress during the season and gives every indication of being a top flight shooter, plus he's a far better passer and facilitator already. Defense is something of a question mark, but Hauser is nothing special in that regard.

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

Scheierman made a huge amount of progress during the season and gives every indication of being a top flight shooter, plus he's a far better passer and facilitator already. Defense is something of a question mark, but Hauser is nothing special in that regard.

Hauser is one of the team’s best defenders if you go by effort, fundamentals, positioning…but one of their worst by actual results. Just not quick enough.

 

[bresna]

Scheierman made a huge amount of progress during the season and gives every indication of being a top flight shooter, plus he's a far better passer and facilitator already. Defense is something of a question mark, but Hauser is nothing special in that regard.

Hauser is actually a very good defender these days. He's actually shut down some big-time offensive players this year. He sometimes relies too much on getting help underneath, but when that has happened, some other Celtic player usually comes over to offer some sort of apology. When someone drives to the hoop, the C's D looks like a big is supposed to rotate down to help & when that doesn't happen, it usually results in an easy layup. I don't think those are all on Hauser but rather the team D.

Scheierman's shots are predicated on the other team not being aware of his abilities yet. Hauser used to get wide open looks at the hoop during his first years too. If Scheierman's shots start falling (in his rookie season, not so much), the other teams will start to put a man on him.

 

[ViperGTS]

Hauser is actually a very good defender these days. He's actually shut down some big-time offensive players this year. He sometimes relies too much on getting help underneath, but when that has happened, some other Celtic player usually comes over to offer some sort of apology. When someone drives to the hoop, the C's D looks like a big is supposed to rotate down to help & when that doesn't happen, it usually results in an easy layup. I don't think those are all on Hauser but rather the team D.

Scheierman's shots are predicated on the other team not being aware of his abilities yet. Hauser used to get wide open looks at the hoop during his first years too. If Scheierman's shots start falling (in his rookie season, not so much), the other teams will start to put a man on him.

Baylor is much, much better at passing that Hauser. I dub him Luka light. He really has insane court vision and I think that will show more and more as time goes on.

 

[aluminum seats]

've been putting together a list of the current top players, at least for their regular season careers. On my list Brunson is at 38 and Towns is at 3

Towns is 3? Start a new list

 

[bresna]

Baylor is much, much better at passing that Hauser. I dub him Luka light. He really has insane court vision and I think that will show more and more as time goes on.

How are we supposed to judge Scheierman's passing ability when almost all of his playing time this year has been against the other team's bench warmers? Yes, he has made some crazy good passes. Yes, he has made some great shots. But he has not done that in clutch game situations. Most of his playing time has been during borderline preseason play.

Hauser has made some big-time shots, including in their last game against Orlando. Whether or not that translates to the C's keeping him at $10 Million next year is the question.

In the end, I do think this is it for this team. Win or lose, something has to change. I'm guessing Jrue & KP as the most likely candidates to leave. Big Al doesn't have a contract and is likely to retire. Kornet is a UDFA and will probably get some $$ on the open market. Next year is next year, but it's looking to be complicated, especially if they can't get another Center if both KP & Kornet leave.

 

[RobertWeathers]

Towns is 3? Start a new list

Very good scorer, rebounder. Post and perimeter D is not his strong suit.

KP is going to eat him alive.