It All Starts Up Front

[SlowGettingUp]

The Eagle's domination points to a key lesson - it all starts up front. Four DL guys each capable of winning one-on-one, and a massive OL that gives your QB time to throw and allows you to run the ball. Obviously the Eagles didn't run much, but the threat of the run still played a big part in the game.

So my plea - forget the fancy divas for the WR room, and use the draft to strengthen the OL and DL. There are a lot of great edge players in the draft.

So we need two tackles, and if Barmore comes back (and he is apparently in training) then two more on the DL to go with White. So four new players could transform the team - add one mid-level WR and you actually have a team that will win a decent number of games, especially now we have a full suite of competent coaches.

Anyone disagree?

 

[archstanton543]

There's several threads discussing this.

 

[TheRainMaker]

The trenches won this game.

Their OL is massive and powerful. They made Chris Jones twist himself into a pretzel -getting injured in the process and irrelevant for the first time.

Pass rush was relentless and exposed the Chiefs terrible OL.

 

[imahobgoblin]

Joey Thuney helped me out a lot last night. He is a guard starting at left tackle and Sweat exposed him so bad. Sweat consistently beat him to the inside, which is likely indicative of Thuney's arm length (32.5 inches). He could use his body to push Sweat to the outside, but the initial punch wasn't long enough to stop Sweat from the inside. Sweat's arm length is 34 5/8. That two inches made a difference at left tackle last night.

Peter Skoronski was criticized heavily for his arm length at 32.5 inches, and he was moved to guard after failing at left tackle in Tennessee after failing at OT.

If Will Campbell's arm length comes in under 33, the Pats have to be satisfied about drafting a guard in the top 10. Left tackle (and right tackle for that matter) is the emergency need for this team right now. Left guard is not the emergency. We can plug it with Strange, Sow, and Robinson. Owenu will be at right guard. I have no issues with upgrading guards, but not in the first round right now. Maybe Will Campbell can play LT in the NFL, but if there is a question, then don't. He shouldn't be picked with the #4. It would need to be a trade down a few spots before selecting him. I say we pass on him.

Oh ya, and go take a peak at Josh Sweat as a free agent. He will probably he overpriced though.

 

[yukon cornelius]

Joey Thuney helped me out a lot last night. He is a guard starting at left tackle and Sweat exposed him so bad. Sweat consistently beat him to the inside, which is likely indicative of Thuney's arm length (32.5 inches). He could use his body to push Sweat to the outside, but the initial punch wasn't long enough to stop Sweat from the inside. Sweat's arm length is 34 5/8. That two inches made a difference at left tackle last night.

Peter Skoronski was criticized heavily for his arm length at 32.5 inches, and he was moved to guard after failing at left tackle in Tennessee after failing at OT.

If Will Campbell's arm length comes in under 33, the Pats have to be satisfied about drafting a guard in the top 10. Left tackle (and right tackle for that matter) is the emergency need for this team right now. Left guard is not the emergency. We can plug it with Strange, Sow, and Robinson. Owenu will be at right guard. I have no issues with upgrading guards, but not in the first round right now. Maybe Will Campbell can play LT in the NFL, but if there is a question, then don't. He shouldn't be picked with the #4. It would need to be a trade down a few spots before selecting him. I say we pass on him.

Oh ya, and go take a peak at Mark Sweat as a free agent. He will probably he overpriced though.

i'm still saying strange will be at C.......

 

[Pape]

i'm still saying strange will be at C.......

kick andrews to guard? or maybe run strange out for one more year at LG, then kick him to center, after David Andrews retires / doesn't get resigned?

 

[maust]

The Eagle's domination points to a key lesson - it all starts up front. Four DL guys each capable of winning one-on-one, and a massive OL that gives your QB time to throw and allows you to run the ball. Obviously the Eagles didn't run much, but the threat of the run still played a big part in the game.

So my plea - forget the fancy divas for the WR room, and use the draft to strengthen the OL and DL. There are a lot of great edge players in the draft.

So we need two tackles, and if Barmore comes back (and he is apparently in training) then two more on the DL to go with White. So four new players could transform the team - add one mid-level WR and you actually have a team that will win a decent number of games, especially now we have a full suite of competent coaches.

Anyone disagree?

Not only does no one disagree with the fundamentals of your post but most everyone here has been saying the same thing in a host of threads

 

[PATSYLICIOUS]

When you have multiple critical needs and more than enough cap space you shouldnt fall in love with one particular area. You take the best players in the key areas of as they are available.

Im not saying wr should be prioritized over OL/DL, but If we have an opportunity to land a great wr we should go for it instead of waiting around for lineman, we’ll get those too when they become available. Right now Tee Higgins would be a fantastic add for us. So would Alaric Jackson and ronnie stanley, if they hit fa we should target both tee and one of the LTs. If the ladder two end up getting extended by their teams should we just forget about tee because we havent fixed the OL yet. No way! We should be targeting them all- OT, EDGE, DL, WR, CB, MLB. There’s no guarantee you strengthen a position simply by targeting it, you have to get the RIGHT players.

 

[imahobgoblin]

i'm still saying strange will be at C.......

Thats a possibility of we cut Andrews. Andrews did say he has full intentions of returning. His dead cap is 4 million and we would save 2. Is cutting him really worth that? Not in my opinion. When healthy, he is still a starter.

 

[yukon cornelius]

kick andrews to guard? or maybe run strange out for one more year at LG, then kick him to center, after David Andrews retires / doesn't get resigned?

i don't think Andrews is ready by the time camp ends; i am not 100% convinced he'll be back at all

 

[XLIX]

The Eagle's domination points to a key lesson - it all starts up front.

It is very easy to talk about how "it all starts up front" when you have a great QB, an all-world RB, and 2 great WR's.

 

[sturmrider]

I am beginning to be very interested in Donovan Jackson who may be available in the second round. He started out playing Left Guard for Ohio State, but when Josh Simmons got injured he was moved to left tackle and was very effective. I believe I read he allowed no sacks and only one pressure in the last half of the season.

He would definitely help the OL and he is 6'4" 320 pounds. This way could take Carter, Graham or Hunter whichever is available in the first round planning on taking him with the second pick and not have to trade up into the first round again trying to get an OT.

 

[yukon cornelius]

Thats a possibility of we cut Andrews. Andrews did say he has full intentions of returning. His dead cap is 4 million and we would save 2. Is cutting him really worth that? Not in my opinion. When healthy, he is still a starter.

i don't think he'll be healthy to start the season, nor am i convinced he's going to get healthy

it was a significant injury to an already repaired shoulder, and they tried a new, experimental surgery

 

[yukon cornelius]

It is very easy to talk about how "it all starts up front" when you have a great QB, an all-world RB, and 2 great WR's.

it's started upfront since the game began, and always will

 

[Patsfan1645]

Thats a possibility of we cut Andrews. Andrews did say he has full intentions of returning. His dead cap is 4 million and we would save 2. Is cutting him really worth that? Not in my opinion. When healthy, he is still a starter.

I'm not as high on Andrews as you are but I hope your right because I like him. I'm concerned about another injury, a year older, a guy who is slightly undersized and in the last couple seasons has been ran over more frequently than I recall early in his career. I would like to see him retire as a Pat on his own terms but if he gets beat out in camp then it is what it is.

 

[imahobgoblin]

I'm not as high on Andrews as you are but I hope your right because I like him. I'm concerned about another injury, a year older, a guy who is slightly undersized and in the last couple seasons has been ran over more frequently than I recall early in his career. I would like to see him retire as a Pat on his own terms but if he gets beat out in camp then it is what it is.

I have no problem with that if he gets beat out. I don't even mind drafting a center, but Andrews deserves a shot.

 

[yukon cornelius]

I have no problem with that if he gets beat out. I don't even mind drafting a center, but Andrews deserves a shot.

likewise i am AOK if andrews comes back and it bumps strange back to guard

i am one who thinks when healthy strange is a solid starting guard......not top 5, but top 10

andrews already destroyed and repaired both shoulders......now this one it sounds like rather than tearing the rotator cuff from the bone, he tore it "mid meat" using his words......he either ruptured the tendons, tore the tendons from the muscles, or it was a mid muscular tear........they were going to put a sheath around it and hope it healed (sounds like it involved the tendons if that is the case, mid-muscular tears usually just get sutures and heal up fairly well

 

[BTTA]

Joey Thuney helped me out a lot last night. He is a guard starting at left tackle and Sweat exposed him so bad. Sweat consistently beat him to the inside, which is likely indicative of Thuney's arm length (32.5 inches). He could use his body to push Sweat to the outside, but the initial punch wasn't long enough to stop Sweat from the inside. Sweat's arm length is 34 5/8. That two inches made a difference at left tackle last night.

Peter Skoronski was criticized heavily for his arm length at 32.5 inches, and he was moved to guard after failing at left tackle in Tennessee after failing at OT.

If Will Campbell's arm length comes in under 33, the Pats have to be satisfied about drafting a guard in the top 10. Left tackle (and right tackle for that matter) is the emergency need for this team right now. Left guard is not the emergency. We can plug it with Strange, Sow, and Robinson. Owenu will be at right guard. I have no issues with upgrading guards, but not in the first round right now. Maybe Will Campbell can play LT in the NFL, but if there is a question, then don't. He shouldn't be picked with the #4. It would need to be a trade down a few spots before selecting him. I say we pass on him.

Oh ya, and go take a peak at Mark Sweat as a free agent. He will probably he overpriced though.

Trying to decide between your opinion, and Scar's, who said arm length really isn't an issue.

 

[JohnJH]

Joey Thuney helped me out a lot last night. He is a guard starting at left tackle and Sweat exposed him so bad. Sweat consistently beat him to the inside, which is likely indicative of Thuney's arm length (32.5 inches). He could use his body to push Sweat to the outside, but the initial punch wasn't long enough to stop Sweat from the inside. Sweat's arm length is 34 5/8. That two inches made a difference at left tackle last night.

Peter Skoronski was criticized heavily for his arm length at 32.5 inches, and he was moved to guard after failing at left tackle in Tennessee after failing at OT.

If Will Campbell's arm length comes in under 33, the Pats have to be satisfied about drafting a guard in the top 10. Left tackle (and right tackle for that matter) is the emergency need for this team right now. Left guard is not the emergency. We can plug it with Strange, Sow, and Robinson. Owenu will be at right guard. I have no issues with upgrading guards, but not in the first round right now. Maybe Will Campbell can play LT in the NFL, but if there is a question, then don't. He shouldn't be picked with the #4. It would need to be a trade down a few spots before selecting him. I say we pass on him.

Oh ya, and go take a peak at Mark Sweat as a free agent. He will probably he overpriced though.

That's why as much as we all know that the OL MUST be PROPERLY addressed, I don't want them using the #4 overall pick on a guy who although played LT in college (even for a major SEC Program), will probably have to play guard. You use #4 overall picks for plug and play LT's, not OG's.

 

[jdlboot14]

What's interesting is that the Pats have tried hard to rebuild their OL the last 3 years. It just hasn't worked out... yet.
But, look at what we have as potential:
Strange may still turn into a legit starter (either C or LG)
Robinson looks to be a solid option at G
Onwenu should return to form at RG with better coaching (like all these guys)
Wallace should be ready at RT
J. Andrews, Sow, B. Brown - are potential IOL backups. And that's assuming D. Andrews isn't back.

What we need is a blue chip LT, and a solid vet RT option.