Wolf has made worse GM decisions than post Brady BB

[Ian]

Seriously is that the way you want to do this? Misrepresent what I say? That’s disingenuous and if that’s your approach please ignore my posts. It’s insulting and childish.

I'm not at all misrepresenting what you said. That's literally what you said. I asked you specifically the last time we did this if that's truly what you thought (he didn't even try). I even said, I thought you were joking. You told me you weren't. That's when I told you, if that's what he did, he should be fired.

 

[raduray]

Passing on McConkey for Polk is going to go down a one of the stupidest decisions this team has made. It was inexplicable at the time, and now it is a fireable offense

How much of this is on Groh, the director of college scouting??

 

[Ring 6]

I'm not at all misrepresenting what you said. That's literally what you said. I asked you specifically the last time we did this if that's truly what you thought (he didn't even try). I even said, I thought you were joking. You told me you weren't. That's when I told you, if that's what he did, he should be fired.

I said this?

You felt this was a desirable destination, and there was no reason why anyone wouldn't have wanted to come here

Wolf sat on his hands, made all of 9 phone calls in two months, and didn't try to sign anybody good

 

[Ian]

I said this?

You did.

This is literally what you said after I asked you if you were serious:

Yes that is what it looks like. He signed those guys pretty early. We know of no one he pursued and didn’t get except Ridley. You dint think there would be any reports at all?

When I replied, you said this:

Every team has many reports of pursuing players, visits, making offers, interest, etc etc.
you’ve shown me nothing to refute what it clearly looks like, these Re the guys he wanted and the team he wanted to build.

So I didn't misrepresent what you said. You said "we know of no one he pursued, other than Ridley." IE: He didn't pick up the phone for anyone else, other than the guys he signed. I told you if that was the case, he should absolutely be fired.

 

[Ring 6]

I know, you've said that. You felt this was a desirable destination, and there was no reason why anyone wouldn't have wanted to come here and that the Patriots' roster was equal to the places you've mentioned, all of which have a significantly better record than New England, currently.

Wolf sat on his hands, made all of 9 phone calls in two months, and didn't try to sign anybody good. All the guys he signed were his first choice, etc. and that he could have signed anyone he wanted to but chose not to even try. I already told you if that's how it played out, they should absolutely fire him. We don't need to rehash it.

You realize those teams have better records because despite being in the same position as the patriots they actually did sign good players right?

 

[Ian]

You realize those teams have better records because despite being in the same position as the patriots they actually did sign good players right?

The Patriots had Mac Jones, Bailey Zappe, and Jerod Mayo. I'm having a hard time feeling like the two situations between any of those teams and the Patriots - especially the two rosters ahead of free agency - were similar.

 

[Ring 6]

You did.

This is literally what you said after I asked you if you were serious:

When I replied, you said this:

So I didn't misrepresent what you said. You said "we know of no one he pursued, other than Ridley." IE: He didn't pick up the phone for anyone else, other than the guys he signed. I told you if that was the case, he should absolutely be fired.

********.
Show me where I said this was a desirable location and there is no reason anyone wouldn’t have wanted to come here. You can search the whole damn site, so let’s see it.

Then show me where I said he made 9 phone calls.

I said he got every player he was linked to except Ridley. And he signed a player for every open need. YOU concluded that means he made 9 phone calls. I concluded he did what he set out to.

 

[Ring 6]

The Patriots had Mac Jones, Bailey Zappe, and Jerod Mayo. I'm having a hard time feeling like the two situations between any of those teams and the Patriots - especially the two rosters ahead of free agency - were similar.

Washington, Denver, Tennessee.

Tennesse was able to sign a ton of free agents. Why did no one want to come here but Tennessee was a destination.
What did Washington have?

 

[Ian]

********.
Show me where I said this was a desirable location and there is no reason anyone wouldn’t have wanted to come here. You can search the whole damn site, so let’s see it.

Then show me where I said he made 9 phone calls.

I said he got every player he was linked to except Ridley. And he signed a player for every open need. YOU concluded that means he made 9 phone calls. I concluded he did what he set out to.

The 9 is the total of free agents they signed. You said there was no evidence that he inquired about anyone else. What other conclusion am I supposed to draw?

Washington, Denver, Tennessee.

Tennesse was able to sign a ton of free agents. Why did no one want to come here but Tennessee was a destination.
What did Washington have?

Ridley explained why he wanted to go there (Hopkins). As for Washington, I'll do the opposite. Tell me what the Patriots had that would have made them a more attractive destination - all things being equal - to Washington?

Washington, Denver, Tennessee.

Tennesse was able to sign a ton of free agents. Why did no one want to come here but Tennessee was a destination.
What did Washington have?

And Denver, obviously Sean Payton - someone Bill had a lot of respect for - obviously played a role for anyone pondering their choices.

 

[Ring 6]

The 9 is the total of free agents they signed. You said there was no evidence that he inquired about anyone else. What other conclusion am I supposed to draw?


Ridley explained why he wanted to go there (Hopkins). As for Washington, I'll do the opposite. Tell me what the Patriots had that would have made them a more attractive destination - all things being equal - to Washington?


And Denver, obviously Sean Payton - someone Bill had a lot of respect for - obviously played a role for anyone pondering their choices.

Is there evidence he tried to sign anyone else?
Did he fill his openings? What tells you he didn’t get every target he had?

Washington had nothing the patriots didn’t, yet they got good players.

You think that Denver and Sean Payton made olayers rule out the patriots? Really?

 

[Ian]

Is there evidence he tried to sign anyone else?
Did he fill his openings? What tells you he didn’t get every target he had?

Again, I'm interpreting that as there's no evidence of him reaching out to anyone else, and that he targeted only the guys they were able to sign. That's a fireable offense. If I were Kraft, I would examine the phone records, and if that's truly the case, he should be fired. I've already told you this.

Washington had nothing the patriots didn’t, yet they got good players.

The Patriots had no tight ends or anyone of note on offense on the roster at the time. I won't go through their pre-free agency roster, but I'd be willing to bet if you compared both situations, including their coaching staff, there were names people recognized compared to here. Unless you hold Mayo and Demarcus Covington in high regard.

You think that Denver and Sean Payton made olayers rule out the patriots? Really?

I can't stand him, but I'm sure he did. You don't think Bill being here didn't make a difference landing free agents after Brady left? Payton at least coached Drew Brees and won a ring. No one outside of New England even knew Mayo's name.

 

[Ras-IR Dowling]

How much of this is on Groh, the director of college scouting??

He led our scouting group down at the senior bowl (where Ladd was voted the wr mvp). Insane to rate Polk higher.

 

[Ring 6]

Again, I'm interpreting that as there's no evidence of him reaching out to anyone else, and that he targeted only the guys they were able to sign. That's a fireable offense. If I were Kraft, I would examine the phone records, and if that's truly the case, he should be fired. I've already told you this.

The Patriots had no tight ends or anyone of note on offense. I won't go through their pre-free agency roster, but I'd be willing to bet if you compared both situations, including their coaching staff, there were names people recognized compared to here. Unless you hold Mayo and Demarcus Covington in high regard.

I can't stand him, but I'm sure he did. You don't think Bill being here didn't make a difference landing free agents after Brady left? Payton at least coached Drew Brees and won a ring. No one outside of New England even knew Mayo's name.

Do you have evidenced that he pursued other players?
So you are saying if the players changed were the guys he wanted, then he should be fired? We agree. Now tell me why he shouldn’t.

If you are telling me Mayo and Covington caused pkayers to shun the Patriots then why aren’t they fired?

NFL players know who Mayo is. Being a former player is supposed to be a selling point.

You still have shown me where I said the patriots were a great destination and there is no reason players wouldn’t want to come here. Are you avoiding that question?

 

[Ian]

Do you have evidenced that he pursued other players?
So you are saying if the players changed were the guys he wanted, then he should be fired? We agree. Now tell me why he shouldn’t.

If that's what happened (he only inquired on the guys he signed), yes, I 100% agree. So no, I would be unable to tell you why he shouldn't.

If you are telling me Mayo and Covington caused pkayers to shun the Patriots then why aren’t they fired?

Their "draw" as coaches wouldn't be their fault. They're judged by the preparation by the players on the field, which has not been good, and I wrote this morning that Covington falls under a name that I would think would be among those evaluated after the season.

NFL players know who Mayo is. Being a former player is supposed to be a selling point.

Mayo wasn't even a star when he was here. He was a solid player, but not noteworthy by any means, and I liked him as a player. He wasn't flashy and just played well. And more people knew who Mike Vrabel was when he was a rookie coach than Mayo.

You still have shown me where I said the patriots were a great destination and there is no reason players wouldn’t want to come here. Are you avoiding that question?

I didn't say you thought the Patriots were a "great" destination. I said you felt this was a "desirable" destination based on the fact you've already said repeatedly that my feeling was incorrect that there was no legitimate reason guys wouldn't want to come here compared to other destinations - i.e., New England was just as desirable as another team.

You've reiterated that again tonight. You've also said that Sean Payton vs Jerod Mayo should have held little weight, and that the Patriots should have had the same opportunities Denver did. I don't agree with that. I also don't agree that the Patriots were a comparable destination to Washington. It is what it is.

 

[Ring 6]

If that's what happened (he only inquired on the guys he signed), yes, I 100% agree. So no, I would be unable to tell you why he shouldn't.

Their "draw" as coaches wouldn't be their fault. They're judged by the preparation by the players on the field, which has not been good, and I wrote this morning that Covington falls under a name that I would think would be among those evaluated after the season.

Mayo wasn't even a star when he was here. He was a solid player, but not noteworthy by any means, and I liked him as a player. He wasn't flashy and just played well. And more people knew who Mike Vrabel was when he was a rookie coach than Mayo.

I didn't say you thought the Patriots were a "great" destination. I said you felt this was a "desirable" destination based on the fact you've already said repeatedly that my feeling was incorrect that there was no legitimate reason guys wouldn't want to come here compared to other destinations - i.e., New England was just as desirable as another team.

You've reiterated that again tonight. You've also said that Sean Payton vs Jerod Mayo should have held little weight, and that the Patriots should have had the same opportunities Denver did. I don't agree with that. I also don't agree that the Patriots were a comparable destination to Washington. It is what it is.

You are wrong about Mayos rep. He was a first round pick and a probity player.

ok so show me where I says the patriots were a “desirable” destination because that’s a lie too. If you want to lie what point is there in trying to have a discussion.

You didn’t say you implied that I meant that maybe thats what it thought. You said I said it. Please quote the post.

Exactly how was Washington a better destination? They were 4-13 and fired their coach and hired a retread. They had no more talent on the roster.

 

[WhatJustHappened]

Does anyone think that MAYBE the POOR last 2 years of Polls from the players (How good the facility/employees) had anything to do with players not coming?
The lack of proven QB/FO/Coach would obviously affect ME as well...I won't go where management is poor.

Just a Thought.

 

[Boomer B]

Once again Andy tries to derail a thread.

 

[Ian]

You are wrong about Mayos rep. He was a first round pick and a probity player.

ok so show me where I says the patriots were a “desirable” destination because that’s a lie too. If you want to lie what point is there in trying to have a discussion.

Ok, you replied earlier that I said you felt they were a “great” destination. I didn’t say that. It’s a lie, so if you’re going to lie, there’s no point in having a discussion.

You didn’t say you implied that I meant that maybe thats what it thought. You said I said it. Please quote the post.

Exactly how was Washington a better destination? They were 4-13 and fired their coach and hired a retread. They had no more talent on the roster.

Again, you believe Washington had no more talent on the roster, and that Dan Quinn is just a retread. Compared to Mayo, and the mess the Patriots were at the time, I feel differently. Which is fine. As I’ve said, it is what it is.

 

[maust]

Even worse than BB the GM
Unacceptable and he does not deserve another year. Team will not have a successful rebuild with this kind of decision making

Draft picks:

Drake Maye- A
Jaa"Lynn Polk- C- (passed on Mcconkey)
Caeden Wallace C-
Javon Baker D
Layden Robinson C
Joe Milton C
Marcellus Dial C-
Jaheim Bell C-

Free Agents:

Jacoby Brissett- C+
KJ Osborn D
Sione Takitaki- C-
Austin Hooper B
Antonio Gibson C-
Chukwuma Okorafor F
Armon Watts F
Nick Leverett F
Jaylin Hawkins C-

 

[Real fan 02]

I'll also throw in the fact that you can only pick the best of the worst groceries available with Mac Jones and Bailey Zappe as your QB, a no-name coach, and no skill players (we had no tight ends signed in March and a worse WR group than we have now...if that's even possible). So nobody wanted to come here. No amount of money was enough for that. I'm not making excuses, it's just reality. And if you read what I wrote today, I'm also not exactly giving the coaches a pass for what's going on here.

But free agent-wise, I really believe that will be different next March. I'd judge Wolf based on what he does next March forward. But they had no chance this past offseason from a free agent standpoint. And obviously, the results are what they are.

And it's a little early to judge the draft. Those always take a couple of years before you really have a sense of guys, especially later-round players. Polk is still figuring it out and I feel like he'll at least be more valuable than Thortnon, Wallace is hurt but he could be a future starter at RT if they take a LT next year. Bell might also pan out, and Robinson just needs to get stronger. So who knows.

I never really look for rookies to be spectacular in year one at the WR position. That's just something I've become accustomed too being a patriots fan. Of this FAs listed KJ won't be here, I don't know on Hawkins, and my guy gibby has been being mis-used for the most part.