The Staff Can Indeed Evaluate Our Wide Receivers

[mgteich]

We have 7 WR's. We only "need" five. How should the staff choose?

I think that the staff has had many, many practices (and the pre-season) to evaluate whether the players can understand the Offense and whether they can recognize and react to defensives. The staff knows whether they can run patterns. They know how well they can get off the LOS and whether they can separate. They can tell a lot in film rooms and in practices.

In addition, this was basically a wide-open competition. All were given their reps in actual games.

No one can look good or have good stats with Brissett at QB. That's a given.
=================
SOME THOUGHTS
1) THORNTON had an experience and a speed advantage. With Bourne out, he had an opportunity to show what he had. He worked hard all off-season to get to the point of being part of the future. He had failed to distinguish himself, pure and simple.

2) OSBORN has done as asked. He is a backup (a #3 or #4) in a guaranteed show-me contract. If he does great, he may be re-signed in 2025. I would note that he continues to get lots of reps, so the team seems to have faith in him.

3) IMO, DOUGLAS hasn't done as well as expected. But he is a talent and is part of the future, even if only as a slot WR. Of course, he will be given the opportunity to be much more.

4) POLK had been the surprising rookie star, a fine pick.

5) BOURNE is signed to a long-term contract and is likely part of the future unless he traded as part of deal for a top WR. BTW, Bourne's contract is all about incentives. He is guaranteed nothing past this year's $5.5M.

6) BOUTTE has been on the bubble, and like Thornton was given a chance when Bourne was put on PUP. He had some maturity issues. However, he has done OK with the reps that he has had. He has shown enough to continue to develop and take to 2025 camp.

7) BAKER has been a disappointment. If he weren't a highly drafted player with a high ceiling, he would be being waived in the next week. As it is, I don't expect him to get many reps this year. He is a hope for the future. He should learn a lot this year and compete in camp next year.

BOTTOM LINE
I would have the best 4 WR's at any given time getting all the reps, with the 5th being inactive. If he is close to the others, I would have Boutte active at least for a few games (over Osborn for example). I would consider trading or waiving Osborn if I had any faith at all in Baker for 2024. In any case, Osborn's compensation is guaranteed.

I consider Baker strictly a developmental 6th WR.

AS AN ASIDE
For picking #3, this draft has been a relative disappointment, especially compared to 2023. Of course, we dd fine with Maye and Polk.

 

[Brick27]

Understand the sentiment on Brissett muddying evaluating these guys, but how does averaging 2 catches for 15 yards a game equate to being a “surprising rookie star”? I think everyone had big hopes for Polk as high 2nd rounder, but we have to wait and see still.

 

[Patriot Missile]

A whopping 61 completions is an absolutely abysmal number to evaluate anything between 7 wrs, 3 tes and 2rbs in 4 games. God awful.

 

[PatsFan2]

We have 7 WR's. We only "need" five. How should the staff choose?

I think that the staff has had many, many practices (and the pre-season) to evaluate whether the players can understand the Offense and whether they can recognize and react to defensives. The staff knows whether they can run patterns. They know how well they can get off the LOS and whether they can separate. They can tell a lot in film rooms and in practices.

In addition, this was basically a wide-open competition. All were given their reps in actual games.

No one can look good or have good stats with Brissett at QB. That's a given.
=================
SOME THOUGHTS
1) THORNTON had an experience and a speed advantage. With Bourne out, he had an opportunity to show what he had. He worked hard all off-season to get to the point of being part of the future. He had failed to distinguish himself, pure and simple.

2) OSBORN has done as asked. He is a backup (a #3 or #4) in a guaranteed show-me contract. If he does great, he may be re-signed in 2025. I would note that he continues to get lots of reps, so the team seems to have faith in him.

3) IMO, DOUGLAS hasn't done as well as expected. But he is a talent and is part of the future, even if only as a slot WR. Of course, he will be given the opportunity to be much more.

4) POLK had been the surprising rookie star, a fine pick.

5) BOURNE is signed to a long-term contract and is likely part of the future unless he traded as part of deal for a top WR. BTW, Bourne's contract is all about incentives. He is guaranteed nothing past this year's $5.5M.

6) BOUTTE has been on the bubble, and like Thornton was given a chance when Bourne was put on PUP. He had some maturity issues. However, he has done OK with the reps that he has had. He has shown enough to continue to develop and take to 2025 camp.

7) BAKER has been a disappointment. If he weren't a highly drafted player with a high ceiling, he would be being waived in the next week. As it is, I don't expect him to get many reps this year. He is a hope for the future. He should learn a lot this year and compete in camp next year.

BOTTOM LINE
I would have the best 4 WR's at any given time getting all the reps, with the 5th being inactive. If he is close to the others, I would have Boutte active at least for a few games (over Osborn for example). I would consider trading or waiving Osborn if I had any faith at all in Baker for 2024. In any case, Osborn's compensation is guaranteed.

I consider Baker strictly a developmental 6th WR.

AS AN ASIDE
For picking #3, this draft has been a relative disappointment, especially compared to 2023. Of course, we dd fine with Maye and Polk.

You can't be serious for one how can a Rookie be a disappointment??

 

[DarrylS]

Not quite sure how any WR can be evaluated with such terrible offensive play. Combine a terrible O line with the very pedestrian work of Brissett leads to the most boring football ever.
As a forever fan find I these games extremely boring and predictable.

 

[Triumph]

Part of the process of evaluation is completing the reception.

How do you do that when you dont throw the ball to the open receiving option? Pop and Polk are open because they ran great routes all game to no avail.

 

[Clonamery]

We have 7 WR's. We only "need" five. How should the staff choose?

I think that the staff has had many, many practices (and the pre-season) to evaluate whether the players can understand the Offense and whether they can recognize and react to defensives. The staff knows whether they can run patterns. They know how well they can get off the LOS and whether they can separate. They can tell a lot in film rooms and in practices.

In addition, this was basically a wide-open competition. All were given their reps in actual games.

No one can look good or have good stats with Brissett at QB. That's a given.
=================
SOME THOUGHTS
1) THORNTON had an experience and a speed advantage. With Bourne out, he had an opportunity to show what he had. He worked hard all off-season to get to the point of being part of the future. He had failed to distinguish himself, pure and simple.

2) OSBORN has done as asked. He is a backup (a #3 or #4) in a guaranteed show-me contract. If he does great, he may be re-signed in 2025. I would note that he continues to get lots of reps, so the team seems to have faith in him.

3) IMO, DOUGLAS hasn't done as well as expected. But he is a talent and is part of the future, even if only as a slot WR. Of course, he will be given the opportunity to be much more.

4) POLK had been the surprising rookie star, a fine pick.

5) BOURNE is signed to a long-term contract and is likely part of the future unless he traded as part of deal for a top WR. BTW, Bourne's contract is all about incentives. He is guaranteed nothing past this year's $5.5M.

6) BOUTTE has been on the bubble, and like Thornton was given a chance when Bourne was put on PUP. He had some maturity issues. However, he has done OK with the reps that he has had. He has shown enough to continue to develop and take to 2025 camp.

7) BAKER has been a disappointment. If he weren't a highly drafted player with a high ceiling, he would be being waived in the next week. As it is, I don't expect him to get many reps this year. He is a hope for the future. He should learn a lot this year and compete in camp next year.

BOTTOM LINE
I would have the best 4 WR's at any given time getting all the reps, with the 5th being inactive. If he is close to the others, I would have Boutte active at least for a few games (over Osborn for example). I would consider trading or waiving Osborn if I had any faith at all in Baker for 2024. In any case, Osborn's compensation is guaranteed.

I consider Baker strictly a developmental 6th WR.

AS AN ASIDE
For picking #3, this draft has been a relative disappointment, especially compared to 2023. Of course, we dd fine with Maye and Polk.

Are you on the "Staff?"

 

[Toofy]

Btw juju whom we cut just posted 130+ yards and 2 TD in MNF.

We are great purveyors of talent.

 

[Ross12]

Btw juju whom we cut just posted 130+ yards and 2 TD in MNF.

We are great purveyors of talent.

A few factors on that.

It’s an offense he’s familiar with, playing for offensive guru Andy Reid, catching passes from Patrick Mahomes.

Does New England have anything approaching an Andy Reid or a Patrick Mahomes currently on the field? No.

Also consider the fact that they didn’t cut him because he was horrible, they cut him because he was not outperforming the other few veterans they had and his relative cost and injury risk was much higher. So they were right to move on. There’s no reason to think Kendrick Bourne couldn’t do just as well in KC’s offense.

 

[PatsFan2]

A few factors on that.

It’s an offense he’s familiar with, playing for offensive guru Andy Reid, catching passes from Patrick Mahomes.

Does New England have anything approaching an Andy Reid or a Patrick Mahomes currently on the field? No.

Also consider the fact that they didn’t cut him because he was horrible, they cut him because he was not outperforming the other few veterans they had and his relative cost and injury risk was much higher. So they were right to move on. There’s no reason to think Kendrick Bourne couldn’t do just as well in KC’s offense.

Glad we ate that contract Mmmmmm.

 

[Toofy]

A few factors on that.

It’s an offense he’s familiar with, playing for offensive guru Andy Reid, catching passes from Patrick Mahomes.

Does New England have anything approaching an Andy Reid or a Patrick Mahomes currently on the field? No.

Also consider the fact that they didn’t cut him because he was horrible, they cut him because he was not outperforming the other few veterans they had and his relative cost and injury risk was much higher. So they were right to move on. There’s no reason to think Kendrick Bourne couldn’t do just as well in KC’s offense.

Agree. My point is the evaluation of wr talent is very subjective considering the trifecta of mess we have - poor Oline , poor offensive play calling and abysmal quarterbacking.


So we cannot really say anything about any of our wide receivers.

They might appear world beaters elsewhere .

That's one of the reasons I want them to really test out Thornton with maye before making any release or cut decision. They don't make that many speedsters like Thornton. What if he blooms late?

 

[Ring 6]

We have 7 WR's. We only "need" five. How should the staff choose?

I think that the staff has had many, many practices (and the pre-season) to evaluate whether the players can understand the Offense and whether they can recognize and react to defensives. The staff knows whether they can run patterns. They know how well they can get off the LOS and whether they can separate. They can tell a lot in film rooms and in practices.

In addition, this was basically a wide-open competition. All were given their reps in actual games.

No one can look good or have good stats with Brissett at QB. That's a given.
=================
SOME THOUGHTS
1) THORNTON had an experience and a speed advantage. With Bourne out, he had an opportunity to show what he had. He worked hard all off-season to get to the point of being part of the future. He had failed to distinguish himself, pure and simple.

2) OSBORN has done as asked. He is a backup (a #3 or #4) in a guaranteed show-me contract. If he does great, he may be re-signed in 2025. I would note that he continues to get lots of reps, so the team seems to have faith in him.

3) IMO, DOUGLAS hasn't done as well as expected. But he is a talent and is part of the future, even if only as a slot WR. Of course, he will be given the opportunity to be much more.

4) POLK had been the surprising rookie star, a fine pick.

5) BOURNE is signed to a long-term contract and is likely part of the future unless he traded as part of deal for a top WR. BTW, Bourne's contract is all about incentives. He is guaranteed nothing past this year's $5.5M.

6) BOUTTE has been on the bubble, and like Thornton was given a chance when Bourne was put on PUP. He had some maturity issues. However, he has done OK with the reps that he has had. He has shown enough to continue to develop and take to 2025 camp.

7) BAKER has been a disappointment. If he weren't a highly drafted player with a high ceiling, he would be being waived in the next week. As it is, I don't expect him to get many reps this year. He is a hope for the future. He should learn a lot this year and compete in camp next year.

BOTTOM LINE
I would have the best 4 WR's at any given time getting all the reps, with the 5th being inactive. If he is close to the others, I would have Boutte active at least for a few games (over Osborn for example). I would consider trading or waiving Osborn if I had any faith at all in Baker for 2024. In any case, Osborn's compensation is guaranteed.

I consider Baker strictly a developmental 6th WR.

AS AN ASIDE
For picking #3, this draft has been a relative disappointment, especially compared to 2023. Of course, we dd fine with Maye and Polk.

Osborne before being made inactive Sunday had played the most snaps of any WR (43 per have) and was averaging 7.75 receiving yards per game. You think that is doing what is asked of a number 1 WR?

Polk was 74 receiving yards in 5 games. How is that a “.rookie star”?

 

[PatsFan2]

Understand the sentiment on Brissett muddying evaluating these guys, but how does averaging 2 catches for 15 yards a game equate to being a “surprising rookie star”? I think everyone had big hopes for Polk as high 2nd rounder, but we have to wait and see still.

On Tape they can see that Polk was open but one read 5yds Brissett can't. It's noted that Polk run intermediate to deep routes Brissett only throws check downs.

 

[PatsFan2]

Osborne before being made inactive Sunday had played the most snaps of any WR (43 per have) and was averaging 7.75 receiving yards per game. You think that is doing what is asked of a number 1 WR?

Polk was 74 receiving yards in 5 games. How is that a “.rookie star”?

Polk would put at least 60 yards a game with a real QB AJ: that I can assure you. And I'm not even counting what 7/11 Pop Douglas would do: Polk is a great complimentary wide receiver.

 

[Ross12]

Agree. My point is the evaluation of wr talent is very subjective considering the trifecta of mess we have - poor Oline , poor offensive play calling and abysmal quarterbacking.


So we cannot really say anything about any of our wide receivers.

They might appear world beaters elsewhere .

That's one of the reasons I want them to really test out Thornton with maye before making any release or cut decision. They don't make that many speedsters like Thornton. What if he blooms late?

Yeah, with Brissett throwing and AVP’s current play calling, no WR is going to look good. Once a QB gets in there who can throw an accurate pass and also isn’t afraid to throw the ball, we may see a little improvement.

Agreed with Thornton… poor guy is a speedster but has not yet played with a single QB who both has A) arm strength and B) accuracy. Brissett has A but not B; Jones and Zappe had B but not A.

 

[Ring 6]

Polk would put at least 60 yards a game with a real QB AJ: that I can assure you. And I'm not even counting what 7/11 Pop Douglas would do: Polk is a great complimentary wide receiver.

If that were true they would be producing something. 74 yards in 5 games isn’t all the QB.
When Brissett was the QB in Cleveland and started 11 games Amari Cooper had 1130 rec yard and Donovan freaking Peoples-Jones had 838.

 

[Ring 6]

Yeah, with Brissett throwing and AVP’s current play calling, no WR is going to look good. Once a QB gets in there who can throw an accurate pass and also isn’t afraid to throw the ball, we may see a little improvement.

Agreed with Thornton… poor guy is a speedster but has not yet played with a single QB who both has A) arm strength and B) accuracy. Brissett has A but not B; Jones and Zappe had B but not A.

When Brissett was the QB in Cleveland and started 11 games Amari Cooper had 1130 rec yard and Donovan freaking Peoples-Jones had 838.

Yes Brissett sucks but a starting WR putting up <15 yards a game has his own blame in that

 

[Ring 6]

On Tape they can see that Polk was open but one read 5yds Brissett can't. It's noted that Polk run intermediate to deep routes Brissett only throws check downs.

How often is he open? Is he open on time, in the window?
Are you actually studying all22? We had people on her showing freeze frames to say look he’s open. That’s not how it works.
Every receiver doesn’t get the ball every time they are “open”. Every receiver in the league can find plays they were “open”. It’s the frequency and the question of were they truly open in the context of the play.
He got 6 targets last week and caught 1.

I’m not necessarily down on him but a WR starting and producing <2 catches and <15 yards simply isn’t a guy going great and it’s all the QBs fault.

 

[Steve102]

This thread oughta be fun.

 

[Clonamery]

This thread oughta be fun.

The Peppers thread had some really funny posts, laugh out loud ones.