Reiss on Wolf’s draft philosophy

[upstater1]

Thorton's been open deep so many times, it's sad. I think they've only been able to get 2 real bombs to him, and the number of attempts have been really low due to the fact that the line just hasn't been able to get the QB comfortable enough for a throw at 2.5-3sec post snap. One was an underthrow from Mac that ended up being a pseudo contested drop and another was a perfect throw from Zap in the pouring rain that TT dropped. I'm really hoping TT gets at least one next year.



Backbreaking

But he's also open because you can see defenses have absolutely no respect for Mac. No one guarding the boundary, everyone is up within 20 yards of the LOS. They believed whatever he threw up, they could get to it no matter how much they cheated.

 

[Grogan14]

Yep, but I’m firmly in the take the QB at 3 camp. This morning I decided to look at Malik Nabers footage and actually came away feeling much better about Daniel’s arm strength. I had heard a number of analysts calling it “ average” in the last week or two, but came away from it impressed with watching him put it into tight windows with pace, which he has to be able to do at the next level. I’m still going to look at McCarthy at the combine next week, but as it stands it will take a lot to get me to move off of the QB pick.

One of the things that has pissed me off over these last few weeks has been the trade scenarios that keep being floated. The 49ers gave up 3 first rounders to go from 12-3!for the Dolphins pick, and these ****heads think the Patriots should be happy to get an extra first and second to move down to teams like the Vikings, or to trade for Justin Fields, which is the worst idea out there. Why give up anything for a failed QB who is going to be demanding over 40 million a season a year from now, when you could be doing your offensive rebuild with a QB on a 5 year rookie deal? That makes absolutely no sense, unless you are in the “ go all out to try and win Bob a Lombardi in the next year” camp, which I’m completely out on.

At this point I’m ready to start looking at the second half of the first round, and 2nd and 3rd rounds. Because I really believe they can come out of this with their starting QB if the future, a starting OT, and a major contributor at WR for the next few seasons at a minimum.

The knock on Daniels (besides his frame) is that he does not have good intermediate MOF accuracy, even though he throws a great deep ball. MOF intermediate accuracy is probably more important in today's game than deep ball accuracy because it is a bigger part of most teams' offense. He also does not have a quick release.
This is why I am not sold on Daniels at 3 as well as the leadership and toughness question. Not loving that he won't throw at the combine, he skipped the LSU bowl game, and I thought he was not particularly articulate or inspirational at the Heisman ceremony. I would like Pats to pick a tough guy with leadership skills.

For all these reasons, if Maye is not there at 3 for QB's I would prefer JJ McCarthy...not at 3 but definitely at 6 if we can trade back with Giants.

 

[1960Pats]

They are already giving him some passes. I don’t think I saw a negative word about him making his brother the Strength and Conditioning Coach.

The NYFL coaching ranks are loaded with relatives and friends. That's why they call it the good old boys network and that hasn't changed in a century. Belichick was no different.

 

[1960Pats]

Brady got several contracts early. Gronk and Hernandez each got one early. I think Seymour did too. I even think Moss got a new deal after 07. Just to name a few off the top of my head. When the players are good enough and willing to do it it's great.

Three of the five players you gave as examples were let go or traded.

 

[Real fan 02]

Director of scouting.

Director of college scouting..

 

[Huckleberry1]

The knock on Daniels (besides his frame) is that he does not have good intermediate MOF accuracy, even though he throws a great deep ball. MOF intermediate accuracy is probably more important in today's game than deep ball accuracy because it is a bigger part of most teams' offense. He also does not have a quick release.
This is why I am not sold on Daniels at 3 as well as the leadership and toughness question. Not loving that he won't throw at the combine, he skipped the LSU bowl game, and I thought he was not particularly articulate or inspirational at the Heisman ceremony. I would like Pats to pick a tough guy with leadership skills.

For all these reasons, if Maye is not there at 3 for QB's I would prefer JJ McCarthy...not at 3 but definitely at 6 if we can trade back with Giants.

He won the Johnny Unitas Award this season, which is a leadership Award. And while I’m still open minded on the debate between Daniels and Maye I’m not going to take anything you have to say about him seriously, because it’s as biased as it gets. The fact that you are knocking how “ articulate” he is, and suggesting he isn’t tough demonstrates a personal bias against him that makes your take irrelevant. JJ McCarthy looks like a sophomore in high school next to Daniels, but he’s “ articulate” so let’s use the pick on him. Seriously Sam, that’s some really weak **** you are trotting out. What’s next, are you going to have them take Lamar Jackson's 2 MVP Awards back because he wasn’t articulate enough at the awards ceremony?

 

[Huckleberry1]

The knock on Daniels (besides his frame) is that he does not have good intermediate MOF accuracy, even though he throws a great deep ball. MOF intermediate accuracy is probably more important in today's game than deep ball accuracy because it is a bigger part of most teams' offense. He also does not have a quick release.
This is why I am not sold on Daniels at 3 as well as the leadership and toughness question. Not loving that he won't throw at the combine, he skipped the LSU bowl game, and I thought he was not particularly articulate or inspirational at the Heisman ceremony. I would like Pats to pick a tough guy with leadership skills.

For all these reasons, if Maye is not there at 3 for QB's I would prefer JJ McCarthy...not at 3 but definitely at 6 if we can trade back with Giants.

Show us the scouting reports that say that Daniels isn’t tough Sam? My belief is that you are now just making **** up. But we will see if you can prove I’m wrong about that?

 

[Huckleberry1]

I am not referring to any of Wolf's mistakes. But it would have been really easy for Reiss to ask in the interviews about success like Jennings PLUS an example of a mistake. I do know for sure that Wolf makes drafting mistakes. It would be nice to know tendencies, approach, drafting philosophy, etc.

Everyone makes drafting mistakes, that’s just a part of the job. The real questions are about how many they make, and how costly they were? And while I still think Belichick can coach at a really high level they were right to move on from him because of his personnel decisions. I really like Wolf taking over, and I think he will do a really good job, but we will all have a much better idea about this 3 years from now.

 

[One-If-By-Sea]

Everyone makes drafting mistakes, that’s just a part of the job. The real questions are about how many they make, and how costly they were? And while I still think Belichick can coach at a really high level they were right to move on from him because of his personnel decisions. I really like Wolf taking over, and I think he will do a really good job, but we will all have a much better idea about this 3 years from now.

Why do you really like Wolf? He has been doing the same job with not great results, although I think the 2023 draft was good.

For example Thornton and Strong do not seem like BB picks - those 2 guys are not BB types at all. It must have been Wolf, or his team, who picked them.

 

[Huckleberry1]

Why do you really like Wolf? He has been doing the same job with not great results, although I think the 2023 draft was good.

For example Thornton and Strong do not seem like BB picks - those 2 guys are not BB types at all. It must have been Wolf, or his team, who picked them.

For the same reason. I liked Steven Belichik, his father was one of the best personnel guys in NFL history, and his son was brought up around that, and got into the business at a really young age with really good influences around him. I think he’s got a ton of good experience behind him, and I think he will do a good job for them.
as far as choices go the only we one we are aware of is Christian Barmore, as Belichick gave Wolf direct credit for making that deal for them. And just because Thornton and Strong are fast but that doesn’t mean mean Wolf made those picks, but if you can show me something factual that supports that I’ll take it into account. And if I’m correct the Reiss article suggested that the model Wolf espouses about explosive players. Which is different from speed. And as far as picks go Belichick overruled his personnel people for as long as he was here, so I don’t buy the “ it had to be Wolf and his team” theory, especially since Groh was higher up in the organization than Wolf was at that time. But that’s all history, the only thing that matters now is what he does going forward, and in a few years we will have a pretty good idea of how good he is doing at his job. As long as he is choosing players for their skills in articulation the Patriots should be well spoken, even if they still suck at football.

 

[One-If-By-Sea]

For the same reason. I liked Steven Belichik, his father was one of the best personnel guys in NFL history, and his son was brought up around that, and got into the business at a really young age with really good influences around him. I think he’s got a ton of good experience behind him, and I think he will do a good job for them.
as far as choices go the only we one we are aware of is Christian Barmore, as Belichick gave Wolf direct credit for making that deal for them. And just because Thornton and Strong are fast but that doesn’t mean mean Wolf made those picks, but if you can show me something factual that supports that I’ll take it into account. And if I’m correct the Reiss article suggested that the model Wolf espouses about explosive players. Which is different from speed. And as far as picks go Belichick overruled his personnel people for as long as he was here, so I don’t buy the “ it had to be Wolf and his team” theory, especially since Groh was higher up in the organization than Wolf was at that time. But that’s all history, the only thing that matters now is what he does going forward, and in a few years we will have a pretty good idea of how good he is doing at his job. As long as he is choosing players for their skills in articulation the Patriots should be well spoken, even if they still suck at football.

There is no real way to know. We will see.

BTW, explosive means scoring high on the high jump, long jump, 3cone, and the 40 yard dash. Speed is part of being explosive.

 

[archstanton543]

For the same reason. I liked Steven Belichik, his father was one of the best personnel guys in NFL history, and his son was brought up around that, and got into the business at a really young age with really good influences around him. I think he’s got a ton of good experience behind him, and I think he will do a good job for them.
as far as choices go the only we one we are aware of is Christian Barmore, as Belichick gave Wolf direct credit for making that deal for them. And just because Thornton and Strong are fast but that doesn’t mean mean Wolf made those picks, but if you can show me something factual that supports that I’ll take it into account. And if I’m correct the Reiss article suggested that the model Wolf espouses about explosive players. Which is different from speed. And as far as picks go Belichick overruled his personnel people for as long as he was here, so I don’t buy the “ it had to be Wolf and his team” theory, especially since Groh was higher up in the organization than Wolf was at that time. But that’s all history, the only thing that matters now is what he does going forward, and in a few years we will have a pretty good idea of how good he is doing at his job. As long as he is choosing players for their skills in articulation the Patriots should be well spoken, even if they still suck at football.

I don't know about Wolf's philosophy but Groh's is "You want to get faster," Groh explained. "Just like if you want to get tougher, you'd better get tough guys. You want to get faster, you'd better get fast guys.". (about Thornton from SI)

 

[Huckleberry1]

There is no real way to know. We will see.

BTW, explosive means scoring high on the high jump, long jump, 3cone, and the 40 yard dash. Speed is part of being explosive.

I realize it’s part of it, I was saying it’s not all of it. But we agree that it will take a few years to really evaluate him.

 

[Huckleberry1]

I don't know about Wolf's philosophy but Groh's is "You want to get faster," Groh explained. "Just like if you want to get tougher, you'd better get tough guys. You want to get faster, you'd better get fast guys.". (about Thornton from SI)

And I think that’s relevant as well. They seem to have started that process, but it will take several more years to get faster overall. That Buffalo playoff game a couple of years ago made them look like the slowest team in football.

 

[signbabybrady]

Three of the five players you gave as examples were let go or traded.

That was one of the reason I chose the players I did. Giving those second contracts early didn't mean no more contract issues.

 

[archstanton543]

And I think that’s relevant as well. They seem to have started that process, but it will take several more years to get faster overall. That Buffalo playoff game a couple of years ago made them look like the slowest team in football.

Fast doesn't always equal good. If fast was the only thing, Bethel Johnson would be a Hall of Famer.

 

[Wozzy]

The knock on Daniels (besides his frame) is that he does not have good intermediate MOF accuracy, even though he throws a great deep ball. MOF intermediate accuracy is probably more important in today's game than deep ball accuracy because it is a bigger part of most teams' offense. He also does not have a quick release.
This is why I am not sold on Daniels at 3 as well as the leadership and toughness question. Not loving that he won't throw at the combine, he skipped the LSU bowl game, and I thought he was not particularly articulate or inspirational at the Heisman ceremony. I would like Pats to pick a tough guy with leadership skills.

For all these reasons, if Maye is not there at 3 for QB's I would prefer JJ McCarthy...not at 3 but definitely at 6 if we can trade back with Giants.

My concern with Daniels is similar to what I saw with Mac and didn't account enough for. He played with one of the best offensive lines and group of weapons in all of college football. His guys were wide open and he had all day to sit back there and decide. Despite that, many of his passes weren't crisp or uber accurate, there were some floaters and balls that his receivers had to come back for.

This is one of the hardest things figure out in QB evaluation for the college guys... how much of his success was the result of the team around him, and will he be able to play in completely different conditions at the next level.

I watch Drake Maye and see a guy who had to make chicken salad out of chicken sht. He was always under pressure, including interior pressure. He had at least one really good receiver, but not a lot beyond him. I think Daniels is the biggest "boom or bust" QB in the draft for that reason, and I'm not sure #3 is where he should be drafted. The thought that he might due to "inclusion" scares the bejeezus out of me.

There's nothing more debilitating than missing on a QB in the first round, it got BB fired, it sets your franchise back years unless you miraculously find another QB later in the draft. If they don't trust Daniels, trade back, take an offensive tackle and take McCarthy/Penix/Nix later and possibly take another QB like Michael Pratt, Milton or Rattler later to cover your butt and improve your overall QB room.

 

[One-If-By-Sea]

I realize it’s part of it, I was saying it’s not all of it. But we agree that it will take a few years to really evaluate him.

I am not as optimistic as you. The Bears, Vikings, Colts, and 49ers all interviewed Wolf and passed. Maybe he will work out, but clearly not a hot prospect.

Bears interview Wolf for GM position

The Bears on Tuesday interviewed Eliot Wolf for their general manager position. Wolf has spent the past 18 seasons working in NFL personnel departments, including the first 14 in several different capacities with the Packers.

www.chicagobears.com

Vikings Conclude Initial Interview with Eliot Wolf for GM Opening

Minnesota Vikings Latest News

www.vikings.com

The Numbers Behind GM Candidate Eliot Wolf

The Colts are set to interview six candidates for the team's vacant general manager position and this time we take a look at Packers Director of Football Operations Eliot Wolf.

www.colts.com

49ers interview Packers’ Eliot Wolf for GM job

SANTA CLARA — The San Francisco 49ers are interviewing Green Bay Packers director of football operations Eliot Wolf for their general manager vacancy.

www.smdailyjournal.com

 

[TomPatriot]

Why do you really like Wolf? He has been doing the same job with not great results, although I think the 2023 draft was good.

For example Thornton and Strong do not seem like BB picks - those 2 guys are not BB types at all. It must have been Wolf, or his team, who picked them.

Wait. Wasn’t Eliot Wolf a “consultant“ until after the 2022 draft? If so, that would make 2023 his first draft.

 

[Huckleberry1]

I am not as optimistic as you. The Bears, Vikings, Colts, and 49ers all interviewed Wolf and passed. Maybe he will work out, but clearly not a hot prospect.

Bears interview Wolf for GM position

The Bears on Tuesday interviewed Eliot Wolf for their general manager position. Wolf has spent the past 18 seasons working in NFL personnel departments, including the first 14 in several different capacities with the Packers.

www.chicagobears.com

Vikings Conclude Initial Interview with Eliot Wolf for GM Opening

Minnesota Vikings Latest News

www.vikings.com

The Numbers Behind GM Candidate Eliot Wolf

The Colts are set to interview six candidates for the team's vacant general manager position and this time we take a look at Packers Director of Football Operations Eliot Wolf.

www.colts.com

49ers interview Packers’ Eliot Wolf for GM job

SANTA CLARA — The San Francisco 49ers are interviewing Green Bay Packers director of football operations Eliot Wolf for their general manager vacancy.

www.smdailyjournal.com

That’s fine, I have very little to actually go on but I’m hopeful he wil do a good job for them. Same goes for Mayo. I’m happy the Kraft’s took some chances. But only time will tell whether they made the right choices or not.