BB THE GOAT

[crawhammer]

Imagine how awful he must have been preparing for the game for belichick to completely lose confidence in him.

Actually I can't imagine it. Because it makes no sense whatsoever. That's not what happened.

We're losing sight of the main issue here. What did Butler do for Belichick to bench him in the most important game of the season?

Butler did something. Most likely pertaining to conduct. Belichick benched him as a result. Butler broke down at kickoff after being told he wasn't going to start or play on defense. Then he had to endure 60 minutes of humiliation standing there on the sideline in uniform while a bunch of scrubs absorbed all of his snaps.

I want to know what it was that Butler did. We'll see what the book says.

 

[Wozzy]

That's a bold claim that it made no difference. Removing your starter had no impact? Really? And since when is keeping a player that sucks in there all year just so he doesn't hurt his free agency opportunities a sound coaching move? What happened to giving your team the best chance to win every week? Look it. I'm all on board that BB is the goat coach but that decision to bench Butler in that Superbowl was wrong. I've tried to give him every benefit the doubt but I haven't seen a convincing argument to change my mind

Butler sucked in 2017, that’s the only compelling argument you need. And he obviously screwed his teammates over leading up to that Super Bowl somehow. He was crying on the sideline before the game started, bawling his eyes out.

If he got benched and had done nothing wrong, he wouldn’t be crying, he’d be pissed off and fuming. He messed up and knew it, also why he never revealed what happened once he left. Any other disgruntled player would have tweeted how he’d been screwed over and threw his coaches under the bus… he didn’t.

The missing players that would have made a difference were Hightower and Alan Branch, the players along the defensive front. The Eagle’s rushed for almost 7 yards per carry, Foles could have sat back in the pocket and cooked a fine meal.

Football is won and lost at the line of scrimmage. They could have played that game a hundred times and would have lost it a hundred times. Injury robbed any chance they had at victory. The Eagles were healthy and had been the best team in the league the entire season.

 

[Ring 6]

Actually I can't imagine it. Because it makes no sense whatsoever. That's not what happened.

We're losing sight of the main issue here. What did Butler do for Belichick to bench him in the most important game of the season?

Butler did something. Most likely pertaining to conduct. Belichick benched him as a result. Butler broke down at kickoff after being told he wasn't going to start or play on defense. Then he had to endure 60 minutes of humiliation standing there on the sideline in uniform while a bunch of scrubs absorbed all of his snaps.

I want to know what it was that Butler did. We'll see what the book says.

Yes Butler in the 2 weeks of preparation leading up to the game demonstrated to his coach that he should be demoted to cb4. It’s that simple. Butler himself admitted it already.
Eric Rowe absorbed his snaps, I’ve demonstrated that to you numerous times. You either have some type of learning disability or are being disingenuous.

 

[Tunescribe]

Butler sucked in 2017, that’s the only compelling argument you need. And he obviously screwed his teammates over leading up to that Super Bowl somehow. He was crying on the sideline before the game started, bawling his eyes out.

If he got benched and had done nothing wrong, he wouldn’t be crying, he’d be pissed off and fuming. He messed up and knew it, also why he never revealed what happened once he left. Any other disgruntled player would have tweeted how he’d been screwed over and threw his coaches under the bus… he didn’t.

The missing players that would have made a difference were Hightower and Alan Branch, the players along the defensive front. The Eagle’s rushed for almost 7 yards per carry, Foles could have sat back in the pocket and cooked a fine meal.

Football is won and lost at the line of scrimmage. They could have played that game a hundred times and would have lost it a hundred times. Injury robbed any chance they had at victory. The Eagles were healthy and had been the best team in the league the entire season.

Agreed, I am so sick of this dead horse being beaten a thousand times over. Anyone who believes playing Butler would have "saved" that Super Bowl is a victim of too many assumptions -- that he was prepared, that he was capable, that he did nothing egregiously wrong and that BB had no justification for benching him. And finally, NO corner could've been relied upon to turn the tide of that game playing zone behind the Patriots' woefully nonexistent pass rush.

 

[Steve102]

Jesus.

Malcolm was sick after the AFCCG.
He arrived late because he was in the hospital.
He was still substandard SB week.
DMC and Harmon knew he wasn't starting.
MB wanted to play but the coaching staff didn't feel he was prepared physically.
Malcolm himself admitted he wasn't 100% locked in. Might have still been foggy from his illness. Who knows.

I think we need more analysis. It's not like we had 350+ pages of this crap in the original thread. We 100% need to talk about it more.

 

[Sicilian]

 

[sb1]

Jesus.

 

[StanleyGrogan]

This discussion reminds me of The Springfield Tire Fire from the Simpsons (25 years and still going)

 

[Ring 6]

Agreed, I am so sick of this dead horse being beaten a thousand times over. Anyone who believes playing Butler would have "saved" that Super Bowl is a victim of too many assumptions -- that he was prepared, that he was capable, that he did nothing egregiously wrong and that BB had no justification for benching him. And finally, that ANY corner could've turned the tide playing zone behind the Patriots' woefully nonexistent pass rush.

My new realization is there are just people out there who live to whine and complain. All of there opinions are negative and focussed on blame, criticism, or insult. They contribute nothing positive (whether here, on social media, or real life) but only seek to knock down things they choose to.
In this case we have a thread celebrating the coach of the team we are supposed to feel connected to being considered the greatest of all time, because of what he has accomplished here, and it turns into some people trying to knock him down. Hell, if the 2017 Patriots went 8-8 and missed the playoffs BB would still be the GOAT but people want to blame him for only getting to the SB and losing, partly because one of his players forced his hand with his preparation to leave him in the bench.
It’s just a bizarre way to go through life, but it has become the American way. 90% of discussion in the media and on social media is focussed in negativity. There are 9 “your guy sucks” for every 1 “my guy is great”. It’s sad

 

[RobertWeathers]

I think we need more analysis. It's not like we had 350+ pages of this crap in the original thread. We 100% need to talk about it more.

...and if people think Malcolm's tell-all book will be this insightful revelation they will be disappointed.

 

[archstanton543]

My new realization is there are just people out there who live to whine and complain. All of there opinions are negative and focussed on blame, criticism, or insult. They contribute nothing positive (whether here, on social media, or real life) but only seek to knock down things they choose to.
In this case we have a thread celebrating the coach of the team we are supposed to feel connected to being considered the greatest of all time, because of what he has accomplished here, and it turns into some people trying to knock him down. Hell, if the 2017 Patriots went 8-8 and missed the playoffs BB would still be the GOAT but people want to blame him for only getting to the SB and losing, partly because one of his players forced his hand with his preparation to leave him in the bench.
It’s just a bizarre way to go through life, but it has become the American way. 90% of discussion in the media and on social media is focussed in negativity. There are 9 “your guy sucks” for every 1 “my guy is great”. It’s sad

So, in other words, the negativity in this town sucks...and it stinks.

 

[crawhammer]

Yes Butler in the 2 weeks of preparation leading up to the game demonstrated to his coach that he should be demoted to cb4. It’s that simple. Butler himself admitted it already.

That's simply not true. Butler said immediately after the game that he felt he could have changed the outcome. He would have only said that if he felt he was prepared enough to play and could have made a positive contribution in the game.

There's also no quote from a Patriots coach indicating that Butler was demoted due to poor preparation. That's you making an assumption to bolster your rickety argument.

Eric Rowe absorbed his snaps, I’ve demonstrated that to you numerous times. You either have some type of learning disability or are being disingenuous.

Eric Rowe sucks. The Patriots coaches felt Butler was better than Rowe for the previous 55 games when Butler started as the CB1 or CB2. In that same span of time, Rowe had 12 starts and none of them were in place of Butler. Rowe absorbing Butler's snaps alone is enough to tip the scale in Philly's favor. Then add in the ripple effect, other lesser DBs absorbing more snaps, players out of position, communication being more challenging with an entirely new rotation of DBs, etc... it was chaos and this manifested itself in the box score.

The coaching decision to have Butler on the sideline cost the team the Super Bowl. The unanswered question is what did Butler do for Belichick to feel the benching was warranted. Butler will undoubtedly give his side of the story in his book, and I guarantee if he says anything along the lines of he was ready to play, and could have made a difference, but he was benched for a non-football related reason, then the IBWTers will say it was justified or not the whole story.

It’s just a bizarre way to go through life, but it has become the American way. 90% of discussion in the media and on social media is focussed in negativity. There are 9 “your guy sucks” for every 1 “my guy is great”. It’s sad

This is total garbage too. Who here is "going through life with 90% focus on negativity"?

We're talking football here, this isn't life altering conversation. And we're talking about one game. Not anyone's entire career. The argument isn't Belichick's a total loser because he completely ****ed up a Super Bowl (although that's pretty bad).

 

[crawhammer]

So, in other words, the negativity in this town sucks...and it stinks.

It's one game we're mainly talking about at this point.

The negativity that sucks is arguing the dynasty 1.0 should be tossed out because of Spygate and "cheating." That's negative. Questioning a coaching decision that very likely altered the outcome of a Super Bowl is legitimate and not born out of negativity.

 

[Ring 6]

So, in other words, the negativity in this town sucks...and it stinks.

Not just “this town” it’s epidemic in our culture

 

[Ring 6]

It's one game we're mainly talking about at this point.

The negativity that sucks is arguing the dynasty 1.0 should be tossed out because of Spygate and "cheating." That's negative. Questioning a coaching decision that very likely altered the outcome of a Super Bowl is legitimate and not born out of negativity.

You have made 100s of posts criticizing something based upon what you think the reason is, trying to diminish the coach of “your team” who delivered 6 rings, 5 years later. You are literally obsessed with pinning blame and trashing the coach. It’s sad.

 

[crawhammer]

You have made 100s of posts criticizing something based upon what you think the reason is, trying to diminish the coach of “your team” who delivered 6 rings, 5 years later. You are literally obsessed with pinning blame and trashing the coach. It’s sad.

Top 4 NFL Head Coaches of the Super Bowl Era (not necessarily in order)

Bill Belichick

The resumé is undeniable. Namely 9 Conference Championships and 6 Super Bowl rings... both are the most ever. His knowledge of the game and his awareness from the sideline are impressive. His two greatest achievements as a head coach are SB 36 and SB 53. The obvious knock on Belichick is his lack of success as a head coach without Brady. The SB 52 debacle is his low point. Belichick will likely catch Shula for all-time combined wins but I he may not catch Shula in regular season wins. But he will surpass Dan Reeves in regular season losses.

 

[RobertWeathers]

The actor, Jim Hoosier aka "Liam" (on the right) passed away a few months ago. Was from West Arundel, ME.

 

[Ring 6]

Then admit he is the GOAT. Putting him in equal footing with Shula, Gibbs and forchissakes Parcells is insulting.

 

[RobertWeathers]

Then admit he is the GOAT. Putting him in equal footing with Shula, Gibbs and forchissakes Parcells is insulting.

That ain't happening because he doesn't think he is. He's said in prior posts you can drop 1/2 the coaches in the league into Foxboro and win Super Bowls with Brady.

His position he is amongst GOATs is a sham and goes to author this mendacious GOAT list claiming it to be evidence of his belief BB is among the GOATS but instead spends 3/4 of the paragraph citing BB's perceived holes in his resume and 100+ more posts reducing, discrediting and fault-finding his life's work.

​

 

[Ring 6]

That ain't happening because he doesn't think he is. He's said in prior posts you can drop 1/2 the coaches in the league into Foxboro and win Super Bowls with Brady.

His position he is amongst GOATs is a sham and goes to author this mendacious GOAT list claiming it to be evidence of his belief BB is among the GOATS but instead spends 3/4 of the paragraph citing BB's perceived holes in his resume and 100+ more posts reducing, discrediting and fault-finding his life's work.

​

That was point, his argument is ridiculous.
Why didn’t he point out Parcells record without LT? Or Shulas WITH Marino?