Report: Brady tried to push Belichick out for Bill O'Brien

[1960Pats]

you're out in left field with this crap...and you're 100% WRONG about Grier not having total control. Here's some 411 you probably are unaware of...I had a PRESS PASS and wrote blogs and created 2 Patriots websites back in the 90's. I was THERE at Bryant during Carroll's camps and wrote about the declining discipline and disorganized state of the team. Read the Globe or Herald archives to get the RIGHT information about what the GM did and the coach.

This is my favorite Pete Carroll moment...

 

[Huckleberry1]

Who would they rather lose, Mahomes or Reid?

That’s a ridiculous analogy to Brady and Belichick, Brady was going into his 20th season, Mahomes is just starting to enter his prime.

 

[Kasmir]

The '11 Patriots were in the middle of a 3 or 4 year run that is still the greatest offensive explosion in NFL history. This was the Gronk-Hernandez-Welker-Ridley-Vereen era. The offense was like a knife slicing through butter.

Those offenses at the time (2010-2011-2012) ranked in the top 10 of offenses ALL TIME.

Woodhead was much better than Vereen. And played his heart out in the SB loss.

 

[crawhammer]

you're out in left field with this crap...and you're 100% WRONG about Grier not having total control.

You're overstating Grier's control... Grier may have had final say but Wasynczuk and Carroll were involved in the process. You're saying Carroll had literally zero input with personnel decisions... again, that's an overstatement.

I had a PRESS PASS and wrote blogs and created 2 Patriots websites back in the 90's. I was THERE at Bryant during Carroll's camps and wrote about the declining discipline and disorganized state of the team. Read the Globe or Herald archives to get the RIGHT information about what the GM did and the coach.

Carroll was the antithesis of Parcells and part of that was being less demanding and more tolerant... he was aiming for a more amicable relationship with his players. A consequence of that was declining discipline for sure... the disorganized state of team I'll take your word for it. I'll still insist it was the undisciplined play of Bledsoe that led to the downfall of the team on the field. When you throw 17 INTs in 8 games, your team will lose a majority of them, which they did.

I think you're being a little inconsistent in your complete criticism of Carroll, essentially blaming him entirely for the decline of the team, when you and others are pointing out how bad Grier was with the roster construction. Certainly the poor drafts alone were weighing the team down some. And again, the quarterback play was an albatross.

Also, how do you explain the team getting worse with Belichick as the head coach in 2000? 5-11, then 5-13 through the start of the 2001 season until Brady took over as the starting quarterback.

 

[crawhammer]

Woodhead was much better than Vereen. And played his heart out in the SB loss.

Don't overlook Vereen's SB 49... 11 receptions on 12 targets including 5-5 in the 4th quarter.

 

[upstater1]

Woodhead was much better than Vereen. And played his heart out in the SB loss.

We'll have to disagree on that one.

Woodhead never had the day Vereen did in the next Super Bowl. 11 receptions. Don't think we win that Super Bowl without him.

 

[Kasmir]

We'll have to disagree on that one.

Woodhead never had the day Vereen did in the next Super Bowl. 11 receptions. Don't think we win that Super Bowl without him.

What's not disputable is that Woodhead was the primary 3rd down back on those great 2010-2012 offenses

 

[upstater1]

What's not disputable is that Woodhead was the primary 3rd down back on those great 2010-2012 offenses

I mean, yes, I know, Vereen was still in college in 2010. But he was drafted to upgrade the position, and then he got hurt. So he had one year of overlap with Woodhead. Then Woodhead was let go and Vereen took over.

 

[NFL Mystique]

Who would they rather lose, Mahomes or Reid?

Neither.

Gun to head (Always a possibility in KC lol): Lose Reid.

 

[Joker]

You're overstating Grier's control... Grier may have had final say but Wasynczuk and Carroll were involved in the process. You're saying Carroll had literally zero input with personnel decisions... again, that's an overstatement.


Carroll was the antithesis of Parcells and part of that was being less demanding and more tolerant... he was aiming for a more amicable relationship with his players. A consequence of that was declining discipline for sure... the disorganized state of team I'll take your word for it. I'll still insist it was the undisciplined play of Bledsoe that led to the downfall of the team on the field. When you throw 17 INTs in 8 games, your team will lose a majority of them, which they did.

I think you're being a little inconsistent in your complete criticism of Carroll, essentially blaming him entirely for the decline of the team, when you and others are pointing out how bad Grier was with the roster construction. Certainly the poor drafts alone were weighing the team down some. And again, the quarterback play was an albatross.

Also, how do you explain the team getting worse with Belichick as the head coach in 2000? 5-11, then 5-13 through the start of the 2001 season until Brady took over as the starting quarterback.

you are clinging on to this life ring from the Titanic with this Pete the Cleaner revisionism..and then you go full goose loony with the 5-13 crack. We get it...you're a Pete Carroll afficionado. You are ONE HUNDRED PER CENT WRONG with your "final say" squirm factory. Carroll had ZERO input, Grier was in complete control. Period. No overstatement. I was THERE through the whole process.


Carroll coached the Patriots from 1997-99, catching them at the end of the Parcells tenure, a time that brought respectability to the franchise but also left it saddled with onerous contracts. The Krafts had just paid the highest price ever for an NFL franchise, were anticipating a privately financed stadium, and were concerned about unwise spending.











So they gave the decision-making to Bobby Grier. Not to Carroll.


“It could have been all of the right decisions for another coach; it wasn’t for me,’’ Carroll said. “It didn’t work with the stuff that I needed to do. That’s where it became so clear, with how I needed to do it next time, if I would ever get a chance again.’’

Why Pete Carroll's tenure here led to Patriots’ success

After not allowing his head coach enough power in the Pete Carroll era, Patriots owner Robert Kraft adjusted the team’s structure under Bill Belichick — and the results speak for themselves.

www.boston.com

 

[sb1]

Interesting look at the 2000 season.

The 2000 Patriots Were the Last Bad Patriots Team

www.theringer.com

Clear as day that it was a transition year and they had a lot of young talent ready to take the next step.

 

[crawhammer]

you are clinging on to this life ring from the Titanic with this Pete the Cleaner revisionism..and then you go full goose loony with the 5-13 crack. We get it...you're a Pete Carroll afficionado. You are ONE HUNDRED PER CENT WRONG with your "final say" squirm factory. Carroll had ZERO input, Grier was in complete control. Period. No overstatement. I was THERE through the whole process.

It's not a "crack," it's the team's record with Bledsoe after Carroll. You said Carroll coached the team into the gutter with an 8-8 record. They got worse after Carroll left... that's a fact... 5-11 is worse than 8-8. So Belichick wasn't doing any better with Bledsoe throwing picks all over the place. We were talking about coaching and you sidetracked the conversation by commenting on the poor drafts which you say had absolutely nothing to do with Carroll. So in so far as discussing Carroll the head coach, it's not relevant who was making the personnel decisions.

And by the way, you would have been "THERE" if you were employed by the team and taking part in actual personnel discussions. You can type it all in caps, I don't believe Grier never, not even on a very few occasions, discussed any personnel decisions with the HEAD COACH of the team.

 

[Joker]

C'mon guy...give it up...YOU are constantly defending Pete Carroll, don't know crap about the Pats drafting by Grier and try to add 2 games to the 5-11 first season of BB after taking over this trainwreck. You are the liar. No one who was THERE during Carroll's tenure has ever said the absolute bullshyt YOU are trying to bring up or your OPINION on what you know little about. By THERE I mean I was in the seats for every game of Carroll's tenure. YOU KNOW WHAT I MEANT but you still try to play this mongoloidal one-up game of yours. I'll make it simple...3 consecutive 12 men on the field penalties after halftime during Carroll's third season is NOT A SIDETRACK!!!!! It goes precisely to the point...the one YOU keep running from. I sense you are one of these "always right" internet trolls that keep trying to last word everything. Good for you. Jeezus krist..."BB went 5-13!!! He was worse than Carroll!!!" you're nuts.

 

[The Brandon Five]

You forgot Brady's intentional grounding in the endzone in SB 46, which of course resulted in a turnover. So that's 10.

Montana's TD/INT is infinity.

It was a BS call then and it's a BS call now. I had never seen IG called for a ball thrown 35 yards down the middle of the field. How do the refs know that nobody was supposed to cut to the middle. In this screeshot it sure looks like someone was crossing before the throw.

 

[crawhammer]

C'mon guy...give it up...YOU are constantly defending Pete Carroll, don't know crap about the Pats drafting by Grier and try to add 2 games to the 5-11 first season of BB after taking over this trainwreck. You are the liar. No one who was THERE during Carroll's tenure has ever said the absolute bullshyt YOU are trying to bring up or your OPINION on what you know little about. By THERE I mean I was in the seats for every game of Carroll's tenure. YOU KNOW WHAT I MEANT but you still try to play this mongoloidal one-up game of yours. I'll make it simple...3 consecutive 12 men on the field penalties after halftime during Carroll's third season is NOT A SIDETRACK!!!!! It goes precisely to the point...the one YOU keep running from. I sense you are one of these "always right" internet trolls that keep trying to last word everything. Good for you. Jeezus krist..."BB went 5-13!!! He was worse than Carroll!!!" you're nuts.

I was in the seats for every game of Carroll's tenure too... so what?! Because we planted our butts down on cold metal benches doesn't also mean we know everything about the team's inner workings. You don't get that from reading the Globe or Herald or perusing blogs either. I don't even know what you're ranting about at this point? Calling me a liar... WTF are you talking about? I'm citing the actual record of the team... 8-8 in 1999... 5-11 in 2000... 5-13 under Belichick with Bledsoe... those are irrefutable records. The team gradually declined under Carroll before dipping even further under Belichick... the common denominator was the quarterback. Bledsoe was absolutely killing the team... he threw 17 INTs in the second half of the '99 season... I don't care who the head coach is, with numbers like that, you're not winning games.

You want to talk about penalties?

1999 Patriots 95 penalties for 812 yards
2000 Patriots 99 penalties for 815 yards

Is that a lie? Or were the penalties essentially the same under Carroll and Belichick?

You want to beat the sh*t out of Carroll, then have at it, but neither he or Belichick were going anywhere with Bledsoe at quarterback.

 

[SHOWTIME15]

It was a BS call then and it's a BS call now. I had never seen IG called for a ball thrown 35 yards down the middle of the field. How do the refs know that nobody was supposed to cut to the middle. In this screeshot it sure looks like someone was crossing before the throw.

Textbook definition of IG. Quarterback was in the pocket and under pressure. The closest receiver was 30 yards away from where the ball landed. That mistake cost the pats the SB.

 

[The Brandon Five]

Textbook definition of IG. Quarterback was in the pocket and under pressure. The closest receiver was 30 yards away from where the ball landed. That mistake cost the pats the SB.

Can't find the endzone video, but there you can see that someone stopped running.

 

[Kasmir]

I mean, yes, I know, Vereen was still in college in 2010. But he was drafted to upgrade the position, and then he got hurt. So he had one year of overlap with Woodhead. Then Woodhead was let go and Vereen took over.

Woodhead was not "let go". He received offers from both the Chargers and the Pats, and only decided to go to the Chargers because "God told [him] to"

 

[PatsWSB47]

Textbook definition of IG. Quarterback was in the pocket and under pressure. The closest receiver was 30 yards away from where the ball landed. That mistake cost the pats the SB.

Well you never disappoint. Another gem from your negative, blame a Brady play from your I hate Brady scrapbook. If it wasn't a bulsh1t call then it wasnt the game decider. It was in the first quarter with lots of game left. And not too long after that a Giants fumble was wiped out because the Pats had 12 men on the field. Leave it to you to cherry pick a single out a play in the 1st quarter. How'd you miss that fun fact? You could have stopped at, "no it was really was intentional grounding" and that's a valid opinion. But no you have to feed your obsessive compulsion and blame the whole game on it. Jeezus, blaming Brady is like life oxygen to you.

 

[The Brandon Five]

Textbook definition of IG. Quarterback was in the pocket and under pressure. The closest receiver was 30 yards away from where the ball landed. That mistake cost the pats the SB.

That playcall was on O'Brien, not TB12. Putting the QB in the endzone against the best pass rush in the league was asinine.

Tom went on to put on a spectacular performance in the game until Tuck wrecked Tom's shoulder.