Update: Prince Aaron demands Packers fire GM

[RobertWeathers]

Open source software is a perfect example of what communism in fact, is.

In its purest, uninfluenced form, OSS is freedom. Anyone can contribute code and (in theory) the best code contributed is used and accepted.

The governance, licensing, contractural, corporate influence and monetization models for the OSS project are what determine the ideology of the actual project

 

[jah]

And also I have to nitpick with you on this (and not to hijack your discussion with the resident idiot)- the idea of communism as it existed on paper, as a branch of socialism, is actually a classless system in which everyone has common ownership and equal say in how things run. I think over the long run, this system of governance will win out across the globe. It already exist in many instance on micro levels. Open source software is a perfect example of what communism in fact, is.

Communism just got hijacked by the likes of Stalin, Mao, and Castro who were nothing more than dictators and came to have a bad reputation.

I would argue that the revolutions that eventually resulted in a communist government were in fact more about toppling monarchies than about instituting communism. Violent revolutions nearly always result in dictatorships.

No idea why this thread gets more derailed every time I see it but this is maybe the best post about economic systems in Patsfans history.

Just to be clear, many people believe you can bring communism/socialism without a violent revolution. I'd encourage anyone with an actual intent of good faith research to look into market socialism/anarcho-syndicalism, then come back and tell me how the **** that's authoritarian. If it weren't the most free system in terms of personal expression, association, and speech, I would not advocate for it.

 

[Galeb]

No idea why this thread gets more derailed every time I see it but this is maybe the best post about economic systems in Patsfans history.

Just to be clear, many people believe you can bring communism/socialism without a violent revolution. I'd encourage anyone with an actual intent of good faith research to look into market socialism/anarcho-syndicalism, then come back and tell me how the **** that's authoritarian. If it weren't the most free system in terms of personal expression, association, and speech, I would not advocate for it.

We were talking about Communism specifically, not Socialism. Socialism doesn't require violent overthrow. Socialism also isn't necessarily all encompassing, and rarely requires such a drastic consolidation of power. That said, it's still an economic system created before the steam engine was invented. Like other economic systems, there are useful aspects that can be applied to various sectors, but by itself, is ill-equipped to deal with modern civilization.

 

[IllegalContact]

No idea why this thread gets more derailed every time I see it but this is maybe the best post about economic systems in Patsfans history.

Just to be clear, many people believe you can bring communism/socialism without a violent revolution. I'd encourage anyone with an actual intent of good faith research to look into market socialism/anarcho-syndicalism, then come back and tell me how the **** that's authoritarian. If it weren't the most free system in terms of personal expression, association, and speech, I would not advocate for it.

it doesn't matter what form of economics you introduce if the introducers are corrupt.

 

[PP2]

That said, if you read Marx, communism clearly was about class warfare and violent overthrow. It also requires vast consolidation of power, and given the nature of people currently produced by most cultures today, such consolidation has dire consequeneces.

Marxism is an area in which I am a very poor expert. That being said, I do not necessarily think that in his manifesto, he wanted "forcible overthrow" to necessarily mean violence, as much as to disrupt a system in which the need of the many are overruled by the want of the few.

He clearly recognized that the elite would never let go of such an exploitative system without a big struggle, but I don't think he was by any means, advocating for violence. If he had lived long enough to see that violent revolutions, in the long run, made communism impractical and unsustainable, he would probably have revised that statement. Violent revolutions just open the door for dictatorships, whether in the form of communism or democracy.

 

[Galeb]

Marxism is an area in which I am a very poor expert. That being said, I do not necessarily think that in his manifesto, he wanted "forcible overthrow" to necessarily mean violence, as much as to disrupt a system in which the need of the many are overruled by the want of the few.

He clearly recognized that the elite would never let go of such an exploitative system without a big struggle, but I don't think he was by any means, advocating for violence. If he had lived long enough to see that violent revolutions, in the long run, made communism impractical and unsustainable, he would probably have revised that statement. Violent revolutions just open the door for dictatorships, whether in the form of communism or democracy.

I've never heard Marx interpreted this way before, but I find your conclusions insightful, and similar to my own. Would be interested if you have any insights on how to insure reasonably fair distribution without an extreme consolidation power when dealing with large populations.

I don't see any means to do things fairly, until we change our culture and start producing thoughtful people. Until we can learn to work together, I can't envision any political or economic system working fairly and sustainably.

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

Marxism in action...

 

[Clonamery]

Marxism in action...

View attachment 32756

Thank god the Marxist was right there waiting.

 

[RobertWeathers]

Marxism in action...

View attachment 32756

Wow. That flight must have been an Endless Summer Night flight. I'm sure once Marx arrived in Seoul there was his wife Angelina Right Here (there) Waiting for him. All in all that idiot Should Have Known Better to mess with Richard Marx. In the end the flight went on and his outburst Don't Mean Nothing to the passengers.

 

[Ice_Ice_Brady]

If you're nailing Daisy Fuentes, you need not justify your economic philosophy.

 

[Kontradiction]

In the past, automation did contribute to growth, but the number of jobs created was always much smaller than those eliminated. Most of the jobs that were created were as a result of a steady rise in global consumption for decades. As just about every nation's population is aging (less kids per capita) and the last large generation is beginning mass retirement, global consumption has not only stopped growing, it will start retracting. Fortunately for us, the US and Mexico baby boomers actually had a lot of kids relative to most other countries, so we should be much better off over the next couple decades than most of the world.

For decades, the rate of automation was slowed dramatically by shipping manufacturing overseas to stable countries with the lowest wages. This trend is stopping for a couple of reasons; in many manufacturing sectors, automation is about to become cheaper than the cheapest labor and, just as importantly, globalization is dieing and manufacturing is becoming more regional. In the next couple of decades, manufacturing in the US and Mexico will skyrocket.

Automation used to happen slowly, to a couple of sectors at a time. With global consumption shrinking, manufacturing shifting to regional, rather than global, and with automation affecting almost all fields at once instead of a few at a time, the rate of automation is dramatically increasing. Those that clung to the idea that automation creates more jobs than it replaces are in for a rude awakening very soon. The US and Mexico will be somewhat insulated against this over the next decade or two, but gen Z and the following generation will face bigger challenges that we ever did.

I think the younger generations would be wise to swing toward trades. Even if what you think is going to happen eventually happens, there’s an abundance of need for skilled trades which won’t be phased out by automation anytime soon. They’re also offering very attractive packages as their workers enter retirement to appeal to younger demographics. The emphasis on college degrees over recent decades has created a shortage for skilled trades with demand for their services virtually unchanged.

 

[Steve102]

Oh fer chrissakes.

I threw in Black Widow as a bonus. Now stop it.

 

[Kontradiction]

Oh fer chrissakes.

I threw in Black Widow as a bonus. Now stop it.

Olsen is a smoke. She got all of the looks in the family. Her sisters look like Siamese cats.

 

[Kontradiction]

This has to be the wildest thread in PatsFans history. We went from talking about Aaron Rodgers retiring or being traded to his possible homosexuality to the AT&T girls awesome, rocking tits to automation in the workplace to Marxism. What in the actual **** happened here?

 

[PP2]

I've never heard Marx interpreted this way before, but I find your conclusions insightful, and similar to my own. Would be interested if you have any insights on how to insure reasonably fair distribution without an extreme consolidation power when dealing with large populations.

I don't see any means to do things fairly, until we change our culture and start producing thoughtful people. Until we can learn to work together, I can't envision any political or economic system working fairly and sustainably.

IMO, until we stop valuing materialism or wealth over the well-being of people, nothing will really work, communism, democracy, or any other form of governance.

But that is coming sooner than later, probably a few decades or so. Here's a really sensible and good read about that:

 

[Le Numéro Douze]

This has to be the wildest thread in PatsFans history. We went from talking about Aaron Rodgers retiring or being traded to his possible homosexuality to the AT&T girls awesome, rocking tits to automation in the workplace to Marxism. What in the actual **** happened here?

View attachment 32757

Great things happened.

 

[Galeb]

IMO, until we stop valuing materialism or wealth over the well-being of people, nothing will really work.

But that is coming sooner than later, probably a few decades or so. Here's a really sensible and good read about that:

View attachment 32759

Thanks for the recommendation. If I'm interpreting you correctly, we largely agree. Positive change will require a cultural revolution for any proposed governmental or economic system to work equitably and sustainably.

 

[lancerman]

Aaron Rodgers is a big titty communist according to this ride of a thread

 

[Le Numéro Douze]

Aaron Rodgers is a big titty communist according to this ride of a thread

Or is he an homosexual savage capitalist weirdo painter? It is really confusing.

 

[Galeb]

Or is he an homosexual savage capitalist weirdo painter? It is really confusing.