Idle thoughts - The "what I saw" edition

[luuked]

The only good offensive drive was when Cam decided to just play the whole offense by himself.

Probably the worst the Pats have looked in two decades, or at least it's up there.

I thought their game against the Titans in the playoffs last year was even worse. Especially on offense.

 

[Calhoun44]

My thoughts on this game:
It sucked.

Not because the Patriots lost.
Not because Cam looked indecisive and "off".
Not because the defense gave up a 3rd and forever play.
But for me it sucked because it was not an escape from the pandemic that the rest of the leagues have been able to provide. The NBA, NHL and MLB never allowed the virus to interfere with the quality of play. The few incidents they had were contained and they rescheduled games and did the right thing. The NFL is fumbling around and the distraction from the real world that sports usually provides me, isn't there in the NFL. I don't know if they will ever get a handle on it unless they change their protocols. It's too bad because we know so much more about the virus when those other leagues started and it seems like a decent plan could have been developed.

Oh well, hopefully Things get figured out, because i really was enjoying the games this year, seeing this team grow and evolve and play great team defense. It's kinda fun when the expectations are a bit lower for a change.

 

[Dragda]

One thing I took away as a positive is jones play in the secondary. They had a game plan of throwing to his cover, but he handled it well all day.

 

[sturmrider]

What goes under a bit is that we were missing two key interior players in Cowart (against the run) and Butler (interior rush) which just made things easier for the Broncos when it came to controlling the trenches and therefore the run.

While the popular thing is to look for WR trades I would be more excited about some transactions at DT.

I agree that we were missing multiple interior players, but to me at this point the idea of a trade for a single player may be the wrong way to go. It presumes the Patriots are one player away. I think they are a little further away from that and should save their draft capital.

I was as disappointed as anyone by their loss Sunday, but I think we have a mid tier team this year and would rather see them go into the draft looking to bolster WR, DL and maybe a flyer on another backup QB. Now having said all that I am enjoying the grit being shown by this team on the field. When down you count them out at your peril. I still believe we are going to have some surprise wins this season and I plan on enjoying those as much as I bemoan the surprise losses.

 

[luuked]

I agree that we were missing multiple interior players, but to me at this point the idea of a trade for a single player may be the wrong way to go. It presumes the Patriots are one player away. I think they are a little further away from that and should save their draft capital.

They are not one player away from a SB but they are one injury at the interior DL away from having a big problem against the run. I am thinking more about depth and not some top of the line player to upgrade on Cowart unless something of value comes along.

I was as disappointed as anyone by their loss Sunday, but I think we have a mid tier team this year and would rather see them go into the draft looking to bolster WR, DL and maybe a flyer on another backup QB. Now having said all that I am enjoying the grit being shown by this team on the field. When down you count them out at your peril. I still believe we are going to have some surprise wins this season and I plan on enjoying those as much as I bemoan the surprise losses.

I haven't seen a team so far this year that we can't beat if we actually can start all our non-injured players. A few bounces here and there and COVID staying away and they could be 5-0. The potential to get into the playoffs is definitely there in a year where there doesn't seem to be a real gap between the top tier and the middle tier of teams.

It took Vrables blatantly cheating (and for some weird reason even being applauded for it) for the Titans to beat the hapless Texans yesterday. We shut down the feared KC offense. The Bears beat the Bucs who then went on to completely whoop the Packers. The Eagles took it to the Ravens.

Again -- and I can't stress this enough -- we are definitely not a top team this year and our margin for error is pretty thin but get into the playoffs and anything can happen in any single game.

 

[PatsFanSince74]

The game said more about the League's imperative to get the season in no matter what the impact on the quality of play on the field than it did about the Patriots' weaknesses, which were definitely on display.
The Pats could still go 10--6 and make the playoffs. A loss to the 'niners next week and I'll be rethinking that, but it's too early to give up.

 

[SEA_Pat]

Agree with many of the points made, particularly the lack of practice and discontinuity.

What I saw in the game beyond the obvious mistakes was that once we lost Elemunuor, Denver started dialing up blitz after blitz to test the OL who had never played together. It worked really well at first, then they started to contain it okay. But Cam got spooked initially and never settled, and Josh never changed the game plan so we had only two receivers out there running medium routes because the backs and TEs had to pick up blitzers. There was no time for those routes to develop and Cam didn't have anywhere to run or options to throw to. Despite it all, they were well on their way to pulling this game out of their azzez when Thuney I think blew the block when Sweet Feet had a long way to run and that was that. Missed opportunity.

D played well, kudos to Jonathan Jones who was tested often and did pretty damn well. Bentley showed what I was hoping to see for a while. Losing Butler really messed up the run D. Impressed with Lock's willingness to throw the ball downfield, would like to see us doing that more. Fangio seems a good coach. Their number 55 was impressive, as was their coaching and athleticism to jump up and block so many passes.

 

[BelizePats]

What goes under a bit is that we were missing two key interior players in Cowart (against the run) and Butler (interior rush) which just made things easier for the Broncos when it came to controlling the trenches and therefore the run.

While the popular thing is to look for WR trades I would be more excited about some transactions at DT.

I think a few of us have been wanting the DT situation to be addressed in the last couple of years. This is such a strange year and the thought of trading for WR help concerns me, given the potential cost and the likelihood that the addition of one player is not going to put this team over the top. Can a receiver even come in mid season and be effective, given the complexities of our offense? After the Sanu trade last year, maybe I'm just a little gun shy but I'm a big believer in building through the draft and would hate to see a future high draft pick spent on WR help this season.

 

[IllegalContact]

what you saw was a team that was missing pieces and unprepared to play the game

between practicing twice in 2 weeks, and playing every OL out of position, the result is to be expected.

I don't understand why they didn't just play LT - Wynn, LG - Onwenu, C - Thuney, RG - Elumenor, RT - Herron (or the other way around) .... at least you could have done something with the left side

 

[Hyped]

Right now, the teams ahead of us in the AFC:

AFC North: Steelers 5-0
AFC South: Titans 5-0
AFC West: Chiefs 4-1
AFC East: Bills 4-1
Wildcard #1: Ravens 4-1
Wildcard #2: Browns 4-2
Wildcard #3: Colts 4-2
Raiders 3-2
Dolphins 3-3
Broncos 2-3

We have already beaten the Raiders and Dolphins. We can expect the Broncos to sink eventually. We can pretty much forget about the BYE...that would require at MINIMUM a 12-4 record...meaning a 10-1 finish for us...and we already lost to K.C. So, for me...it's about winning the division and grabbing a HOME game for wild card weekend.


Right now...we absolutely need to go 2-1 in the next 3. Beat the Niners at home, lose in Buffalo, and beat the Jets on the road. That gets us to 4-4....of course I prefer 5-3. But 4-4 is where we absolutely must be at the halfway point. We must win at home vs. the Niners...and hope we win in Buffalo.

At 4-4...we open the second half with:

BAL (SNF)
@HOU
ARI
@LAC
@LAR (TNF)

I think we can go 3-2 through this stretch (loss to Baltimore, split @HOU/ARI, sweep both L.A. games in 4 days).

That leaves us at 7-6 with a final 3 of: @Mia, BUF, NYJ...I think we win the final 3 for a 10-6 record.

I will entertain a 11-5 record if we win the next 3 to finish 5-3 before the second half.

I think the three key junctures in the season will be the next 2 games (SF and @BUF), the L.A. double dip (remember this is a "bubble" type of environment for the team with 10 days off before the final 3 AFC East games), and the final 3 games.

 

[sb1]

Right now, the teams ahead of us in the AFC:

AFC North: Steelers 5-0
AFC South: Titans 5-0
AFC West: Chiefs 4-1
AFC East: Bills 4-1
Wildcard #1: Ravens 4-1
Wildcard #2: Browns 4-2
Wildcard #3: Colts 4-2
Raiders 3-2
Dolphins 3-3
Broncos 2-3

We have already beaten the Raiders and Dolphins. We can expect the Broncos to sink eventually. We can pretty much forget about the BYE...that would require at MINIMUM a 12-4 record...meaning a 10-1 finish for us...and we already lost to K.C. So, for me...it's about winning the division and grabbing a HOME game for wild card weekend.


Right now...we absolutely need to go 2-1 in the next 3. Beat the Niners at home, lose in Buffalo, and beat the Jets on the road. That gets us to 4-4....of course I prefer 5-3. But 4-4 is where we absolutely must be at the halfway point. We must win at home vs. the Niners...and hope we win in Buffalo.

At 4-4...we open the second half with:

BAL (SNF)
@HOU
ARI
@LAC
@LAR (TNF)

I think we can go 3-2 through this stretch (loss to Baltimore, split @HOU/ARI, sweep both L.A. games in 4 days).

That leaves us at 7-6 with a final 3 of: @Mia, BUF, NYJ...I think we win the final 3 for a 10-6 record.

I will entertain a 11-5 record if we win the next 3 to finish 5-3 before the second half.

I think the three key junctures in the season will be the next 2 games (SF and @BUF), the L.A. double dip (remember this is a "bubble" type of environment for the team with 10 days off before the final 3 AFC East games), and the final 3 games.

Sweeping the California trip is a tough ask.

Yeah they'll make things very difficult if they go less than 2-1 in their next 3. 2-1 should be doable.

 

[borg]

While the popular thing is to look for WR trades I would be more excited about some transactions at DT.

Pats have scored 10 and 12 pts in last two games so why not bolster the D.

 

[BradytoMosstoGronk]

Right now, the teams ahead of us in the AFC:

AFC North: Steelers 5-0
AFC South: Titans 5-0
AFC West: Chiefs 4-1
AFC East: Bills 4-1
Wildcard #1: Ravens 4-1
Wildcard #2: Browns 4-2
Wildcard #3: Colts 4-2
Raiders 3-2
Dolphins 3-3
Broncos 2-3

We have already beaten the Raiders and Dolphins. We can expect the Broncos to sink eventually. We can pretty much forget about the BYE...that would require at MINIMUM a 12-4 record...meaning a 10-1 finish for us...and we already lost to K.C. So, for me...it's about winning the division and grabbing a HOME game for wild card weekend.


Right now...we absolutely need to go 2-1 in the next 3. Beat the Niners at home, lose in Buffalo, and beat the Jets on the road. That gets us to 4-4....of course I prefer 5-3. But 4-4 is where we absolutely must be at the halfway point. We must win at home vs. the Niners...and hope we win in Buffalo.

At 4-4...we open the second half with:

BAL (SNF)
@HOU
ARI
@LAC
@LAR (TNF)

I think we can go 3-2 through this stretch (loss to Baltimore, split @HOU/ARI, sweep both L.A. games in 4 days).

That leaves us at 7-6 with a final 3 of: @Mia, BUF, NYJ...I think we win the final 3 for a 10-6 record.

I will entertain a 11-5 record if we win the next 3 to finish 5-3 before the second half.

I think the three key junctures in the season will be the next 2 games (SF and @BUF), the L.A. double dip (remember this is a "bubble" type of environment for the team with 10 days off before the final 3 AFC East games), and the final 3 games.

Seems wildly optimistic to entertain 11 or 10 wins at this point. Prior to losing people and the two Injuries yesterday, I could be on board, and I thought 10 was very doable. I think 9 is a struggle at this point. SF just beat a good rams team, Buffalo will be tough, the jets SHOULD be a gimme. The 5 after, maybe Houston is a likely win but none of those others are. The bottom line is outside the Jets all of these games will be difficult. This team has one discernable strength in its secondary, but how many games will that win alone? 9 wins is optimistic, worst case i think we struggle and get 7.

 

[DaBruinz]

I said to a friend that in a way the Pats caught a break when Elumaneur went down, because that moved Wynn back to LT where he played pretty well, but he sucked as a RG. After he allowed a deflection that killed a drive or caused the pick (I forget which) I started to looked closely at his play, and it wasn't good. I think it was because he was setting his feet as if he were on the end of the line rather than in the middle of things. For someone who constantly plays on the outside, things move a lot quicker on the inside. A lot more things coming at you, and it showed in his play. I'm sure he was very happy to get sent back to LT where he seemed to do much better.

Wynn was at LG, not RG. And they moved him inside because of his calf injury. Having to move him back outside exacerbated the situation. We'll agree to disagree that Wynn did better back at LT since he gave up 2 sacks and another PB while there.

 

[Boomer B]

I recommend listening to this Zolack segment who gives some good insight into what’s going on with the team. He touches on Harry, the WRs and our lack of speed and production. Cam’s throwing motion which will lead to more tipped balls.

One of the things he touches on is something I’ve been thinking. It’s a copycat league. Teams do not respect our WRs and TEs. They’re gonna stack the box and blitz the hell out of Cam because they don’t think or WRs can beat them.

Pats Lose to Broncos, Boston Sports Fan Nightmare, X’s and Zo’s (Hour 1)

https://omny.fm/shows/zolak-bertrand-1/pats-lose-to-broncos-boston-sports-fan-nightmare-x (0:00) The Patriots suffered one of their uglier losses in a long

985thesportshub.com

 

[DaBruinz]

Pats have scored 10 and 12 pts in last two games so why not bolster the D.

This is a textbook example of stats without context. And it's disappointing from someone who is typically a good poster.


The Pats offense scored 10 points with it's back-up QB while missing it's starting QB, starting Center, Right Guard and starting RT.
The Pats offense scored 12 points with 2 practices in 14 days, of which their starting QB only took part in 1, they were without their starting Center, Back-up Center, and starting RG. Their backl-up Center and starting RG, they lost within 48 hours of game time so the O-line had ZERO practice together. And the one thing knowledgeable football people agree on is that the O-line needs continuity to function well.

 

[Biffins]

Rather than go through the normal prodigious detailed review of today's game, time constraints and the fact that I'd rather sleep than bore you with my musings, I thought I'd just offer some disjointed thoughts about this terribly disappointing game.

1. The offense sucked over all. It constantly kicked itself in the ass with some mind numbingly dumb plays that killed drive or created turnovers that constantly put the defense into bad positions. . 4 turnovers are one thing, but there were also FOUR fumbles, of which we recovered 3 just added to one stalled drive after another. And what made it even more frustrating was the fact that almost every drive featured a number of good plays that often moved the ball down the field only to see the drive get sidelined.

2. Think about this. You'd think on a day when the offense could only generate 12 points, Jake Baily would have to punt more than 3 times, and one of those was from Denver's 38. (and it was a good one)

3. Cam Ran the ball well and threw the ball terribly, at least in my impression. I don't think I saw a throw he made where he dropped back and set an threw the ball in rhythm. he looked completely out of sorts. His field vision seemed to have taken a step back this week.

4. As a former football coach I think what you saw on offense was the difference between one team that had the better part of 2 weeks of practices and one teams that had only one with Cam. I know there will be those among you who would say say, "well the Titans played great without practicing much when they went through their Covid maladies." Well their situation was a bit different. They had 3 practices and didn't have to deal with the same situation the Pats had on the OL. IMHO there were just too many changes to overcome all the adversity.

Football teams have to practices to be able to execute a game plan, ESPECIALLY teams like the Pats who happen to run a very complex offense where timing is so critical to its success. To expect the offense to look much better than it did was going to be wishfull thinking.

5. Even Joe Thuney killed a scoring drive with a bad snap. And when Joe Thuney makes a mistake its news.

I said to a friend that in a way the Pats caught a break when Elumaneur went down, because that moved Wynn back to LT where he played pretty well, but he sucked as a RG. After he allowed a deflection that killed a drive or caused the pick (I forget which) I started to looked closely at his play, and it wasn't good. I think it was because he was setting his feet as if he were on the end of the line rather than in the middle of things. For someone who constantly plays on the outside, things move a lot quicker on the inside. A lot more things coming at you, and it showed in his play. I'm sure he was very happy to get sent back to LT where he seemed to do much better.

The one bright side to all this was Frodholt finally got into a game and I thought played pretty well. I'm thinking it was the first time he got in a game, am I right about this.

Bottom line, the Pats have often had to make some changes to their OL moving a couple of players around and have generally had good success. Of course those were on weeks when they actually got together to practice those changes. At any rate, I don't want to see Wynn at G any time soon. You can't win them all.

6. Here are the things that pissed me off. (feel free to add your own)

a.ve been supportive of Bills trials when it come to finding impact WR's. But he HAS had success in finding TE's. So If I had Josh in a closed room with me, I'd have to ask. How come Denver could come into my stadium and make a TE who was active for the first time this season, in his first NFL game a major factor in their offensive plans (6 targets), while I don't think ANY TE of ours has had 6 targets for the last 2 years!!!!!!

Each week I see TE's that I've never heard of of who are just JAGS make plays for their team, while we seem to seem to just concede the TE routes to the defense with guys I believe are just as good as many of the guys who are making plays. Izzo had 3 catches for almost 40 yds. It was unfortunate that he fumbled one of them, but he was at least open AND caught the ball. And when are we going to see Asiassi get some targets. Wasn't he drafted as the "pass catching" TE. Well Josh we are five games into the season and this kid hasn't gotten a TARGET yet.

b it was also very frustrating to see the OTHER team's 6'4 WR making plays down field (84 yds), while our 6'4 WR was only targeted 2 and was thrown balls he had no chance to catch. Even if he hasn't lived up to his 1st round status, he's still a 6'4 inch target who has 4.5 speed and has proven he can catch the ball. Send him down the field and throw it to him damned it. If he's having trouble getting into his routes, then move him inside or use motion or bunches to free him up. This is beginning to piss me off.

c. I thought the defense played fairly well today. Only 3 drives deep into their territory, which is not horrid when your offense created 4 turnovers. However there is NO excuse for "the best secondary in the league" to give up a 36 yd play on third and 26. And I wouldn't want to be in the room when THAT play comes up with Bill doing the breakdown.

9. But overall, I thought the D did fairly well. However Cowarts absence was felt as was the loss of Butler during the game. Those loses were clearly evident in the run game. On the other hand, I thought Bentley had his best game since his rookie year. Still can't cover for sh!t, but he was very strong in the run game with 12 tackles.

10. Although the secondary gave up some plays, overall I thought the coverage was good, especially the man coverage. Those 2 picks by Jones and Jackson were awesome.

11. This team needs PRACTICE. They have the Niners coming off a very good win this week so their confidence will be high for the Jimmy G reunion game, It will be a good test. Pardon me, but I'll put aside my obituary of this season until I see what they do next week.

so you’re saying if we had a QB who could throw and a TE who was effective, we’d do great..........

 

[PP2]

I recommend listening to this Zolack segment who gives some good insight into what’s going on with the team. He touches on Harry, the WRs and our lack of speed and production. Cam’s throwing motion which will lead to more tipped balls.

One of the things he touches on is something I’ve been thinking. It’s a copycat league. Teams do not respect our WRs and TEs. They’re gonna stack the box and blitz the hell out of Cam because they don’t think or WRs can beat them.

Pats Lose to Broncos, Boston Sports Fan Nightmare, X’s and Zo’s (Hour 1)

https://omny.fm/shows/zolak-bertrand-1/pats-lose-to-broncos-boston-sports-fan-nightmare-x (0:00) The Patriots suffered one of their uglier losses in a long

985thesportshub.com

Speaking of copycatting-

One thing Denver did very successfully yesterday was to run a lot of scrape exchanges to neutralize our RPO, where the LB's scrape and crash down. We're going to have to adapt to that because you can bet SF is going be doing that all day long.

 

[BelizePats]

I recommend listening to this Zolack segment who gives some good insight into what’s going on with the team. He touches on Harry, the WRs and our lack of speed and production. Cam’s throwing motion which will lead to more tipped balls.

One of the things he touches on is something I’ve been thinking. It’s a copycat league. Teams do not respect our WRs and TEs. They’re gonna stack the box and blitz the hell out of Cam because they don’t think or WRs can beat them.

Pats Lose to Broncos, Boston Sports Fan Nightmare, X’s and Zo’s (Hour 1)

https://omny.fm/shows/zolak-bertrand-1/pats-lose-to-broncos-boston-sports-fan-nightmare-x (0:00) The Patriots suffered one of their uglier losses in a long

985thesportshub.com

This is great. As an out of market fan, I really appreciate this.

 

[sambam94]

no playmakers on offense..no wonder they stink