OT: Anthony Bourdain dead of suicide

[Clonamery]

My wife was bipolar. Many of you know that she took her life in 2012. She left a wake of destruction behind her. I don’t blame her any more than if she had cancer, but it’s something that the survivors can never fully recover from.

Two of my three kids have been suffering from suicidality these past few years as well. It is obviously genetic (or a result of being close to me). They have been institutionalized on and off but are fairly stable now. It is the scariest thing. It’s very complex to try to keep them safe and also to try to motivate them live a normal healthy.

The best piece of advice I can give for people in my boat is to be supportive, offer help, be patient, and not feel too bad when you lose your **** now and then.

I am such an idiot that I am optimistic that everything will work out well. But I really think it will.

Sorry to hear about your kids, hope you have some help. If you don't stay positive, who will?

 

[Tunescribe]

“Save a life and save the world.” That **** is true.

“To know even one life has breathed easier because you have lived. This is to have succeeded.”

― Ralph Waldo Emerson

 

[bbobbo]

a friend of mine recently wrote a very good novel about mental illness and its effects on loved ones. she based it on experiences she had with mental illness in her own family. it's a great read, for anyone who's interested:

 

[Patjew]

Thank you for sharing. I am lost for words.

I’m not sure why I did share all of the that, TBH. Somehow we need to make the stigma of mental illness go away. We’re much further along than we were 20 years ago but there is a long way to go.

Kindness, generosity, and being non-judgmental always go a long way. Like many people, I stink at one of those.

 

[Betterthanmost]

I am surprised this thread is still opened or not moved to a different forum, but whoever has made the call to keep it here is doing a good job. Condolence to Mr. Bourdain's family but a palpable feeling of what makes us human has been felt in this thread because of this sad and unfortunate event.
My workplace has a serious program about suicide prevention and train us on signs to watch out for, but I do wonder about a few things such as:
Can you really recover from such thoughts once you ever seriously get there? Once I get to know that you were seriously thinking about suicide, I don't know how I can threat you the same. I may probably treat someone like that with very soft gloves and shy away from ever issuing even constructive criticism. I have so many mind adjustment to do in life about so many issues, at times it is daunting.

 

[Betterthanmost]

I’m not sure why I did share all of the that, TBH. Somehow we need to make the stigma of mental illness go away. We’re much further along than we were 20 years ago but there is a long way to go.

Kindness, generosity, and being non-judgmental always go a long way. Like many people, I stink at one of those.

So even if someone who was previously suicidal is clearly wrong, how do you go about that to point it to them? Or do you just pretend against your own inclination to be judgmental?
There are clips of Bourdain talking about how he was suicidal after his first marriage failed and only stopped his nightly attempt after meeting a woman in London.

 

[Patjew]

So even if someone who was previously suicidal is clearly wrong, how do you go about that to point it to them? Or do you just pretend against your own inclination to be judgmental?
There are clips of Bourdain talking about how he was suicidal after his first marriage failed and only stopped his nightly attempt after meeting a woman in London.

I think it’s like any disease... deal with the symptoms when they’ve reached critical mass and when they are under control, focus on the disease itself. Don’t focus on the person being wrong. They’re no more wrong than someone suffering from Alzheimer’s disease. Talk openly with them about suicide and how damaging it is, but not that they were wrong to feel like they no longer wanted to live. And try somehow, anyhow, to convince them that they won’t always feel so bad.

Look, I’m only 2 out of 3 at this so far. I’m not a doctor. And even the doctors aren’t batting 1000.

I just want to stay 2 out of 3.

 

[Mack Herron]

I think it’s like any disease... deal with the symptoms when they’ve reached critical mass and when they are under control, focus on the disease itself. Don’t focus on the person being wrong. They’re no more wrong than someone suffering from Alzheimer’s disease. Talk openly with them about suicide and how damaging it is, but not that they were wrong to feel like they no longer wanted to live. And try somehow, anyhow, to convince them that they won’t always feel so bad.

Look, I’m only 2 out of 3 at this so far. I’m not a doctor. And even the doctors aren’t batting 1000.

I just want to stay 2 out of 3.

I don't think it is possible to truly put oneself in another's head. I also believe being positive about the future is, at least for now, a necessary ingredient to realizing that future. Appreciate your participation here.

 

[Actual Pats Fan]

Yes, I am assuming the CDC is correct and the stats from The National Suicide Research Foundation, which I posted, are flawed. Not sure what would cause such a difference.

OK- I found it. The stats from The National Suicide Research Foundation were not for the USA but for Ireland.

Google Image search, you have FAILED ME!

Well, that proves it.

You're human.

 

[Actual Pats Fan]

I suffered from depression sometime when I was 12 and I am 29 now. In last year it JUST dawned on me that my depression was caused by years of child abuse. Child abuse takes forms of physical\verbal abuse and neglect. My situation was all of above. Since then, I read a lot about child abuse. Why takes so long for me to realize it? Because the abused often feel a tremendous shame about the abusing acts and the fact that he/she let it happen to themselves.

By the time I was four I was in way, way deep. What was I supposed to do, run away from home? I was sick all the time.

Then, I was 10 and in fifth grade and it's like, "OK, now go out and have fun!! Forget about the past [the last decade, the entirety of my life]!! Go out, date girls, have fun, do what you want with your life!!"

Unfortunately, when I finally did take off when I was 17 I learned the hard way that even when you accomplish everything you wanted and expected and you've made your life what you want and need it to be, that childhood ain't going anywhere and you need to deal with it, because procrastinating will just negatively affect whatever you're doing now.

In my case, I have to take it one day at a time. Nothing gets done overnight.

You have to have faith. Which can be very hard, sometimes.

 

[catent]

At any rate, I've appreciated reading this thread and hearing others share their respective experiences. As someone who developed depression literally overnight in Ferburary 2014 following a one-off incident using Vyvanse (a drug similar to adderall; amphetamine, essentially) I can relate to this all (painfully) well. My mood disorder was not preceded by any emotional trauma, and as far as I can tell the issue is entirely neurochemical in nature.

Since then I've struggled with a chronically low and unstable mood, and cravings for any substance to improve my subjective state, which has led to a relatively mild issue with addictive-like tendencies, although nothing that has ever gotten terribly out-of-hand. It was as if a neurological switch was flipped.

I'm reaching a point where I'm exploring options such as transcranial magnetic stimulation, while attempting to engage in behaviors and practices that will optimize my neurological state. Additionally, I'm constantly hoping that a significant breakthrough will occur in our understanding of how the brain functions, thus paving the way for more holistic, individualized treatments that extend beyond the limited and often ineffectual medications that exist today.

It seems to me that I don't lack one particular neurotransmitter, but rather that my brain is not operating in an ideal, optimized way holistically. If I correct one symptom, I develop others. I feel I need to press the 'reset' button for my brain, for lack of a better phrase.

Here's hoping the future holds better prospects for all of us suffering in a similar situation. Knowing that there are people who deeply care for me, and understanding that what I'm experiencing now may not persist permanently gives me hope and helps keep me going.

 

[Actual Pats Fan]

Whenever things like this happen to people I like or care about, I feel like I've been cheated or something has been stolen from me. And it's occurred a lot lately. I also believe suicide is an impulsive act and the victims often are isolated.

Suicide is a psychological disorder, a chemical imbalance in the brain.

It's easy to see people who had horrible things happen to them commit it and understand, and at the same time be mystified when others commit it who apparently have no reason at all.

It can strike anybody. Our culture and society today is way behind in diagnosing and treating it effectively to achieve prevention.

I know, CTE is well publicized, but suicidal urges remain treatable. I knew something was really, really wrong when Junior Seau drove his SUV off a cliff, and dismissed the incident later with a shrug.

It was a warning sign. A huge one. Junior was in desperate need of serious, round the clock attention, compassion, treatment and care. He got zero of that. The social pressures which influence a person to denial are insurmountable, alone.

We need to encourage young people to get into the caregiver industry.

 

[Joker]

when I get depressed and don't think I can take it anymore I just put on "The Sound Of Music" and listen to Julie Andrews sing "The hills come alive...with the sound of musak" and I realize how fortunate, how utterly lucky I was that my mom and aunts never succeeded in dragging me to that dyamed piece of dreck when I was young.

When the family would ask me "why? why don't you like it, Joe?" I'd just pull out Axis:Bold As Love and play "If Six Was Nine"...

White-collared conservatives flashing down the street
Pointing their plastic finger at me
They're hoping soon, my kind will drop and die
But I'm going to wave my freak flag high
Wave on, wave on


The ultimate result? They tolerate my eccentricities. I stay optimistic. Win/win.

 

[Tunescribe]

when I get depressed and don't think I can take it anymore I just put on "The Sound Of Music" and listen to Julie Andrews sing "The hills come alive...with the sound of musak" and I realize how fortunate, how utterly lucky I was that my mom and aunts never succeeded in dragging me to that dyamed piece of dreck when I was young.

Interesting. Unfortunately, I was unable to avoid that traumatic cinematic experience myself. Maybe that's why I'm depressed.

 

[Actual Pats Fan]

when I get depressed and don't think I can take it anymore I just put on "The Sound Of Music" and listen to Julie Andrews sing "The hills come alive...with the sound of musak" and I realize how fortunate, how utterly lucky I was that my mom and aunts never succeeded in dragging me to that dyamed piece of dreck when I was young.

When the family would ask me "why? why don't you like it, Joe?" I'd just pull out Axis:Bold As Love and play "If Six Was Nine"...

White-collared conservatives flashing down the street
Pointing their plastic finger at me
They're hoping soon, my kind will drop and die
But I'm going to wave my freak flag high
Wave on, wave on


The ultimate result? They tolerate my eccentricities. I stay optimistic. Win/win.

 

[Ring 6]

my wife is a clinical psychologist, and she most certainly does not prescribe anti-depressants, either directly or by asking psychiatrists to do it for her. she works with a lot of BPD patients, and her treatment focuses on teaching CBT and DBT skills to them.

often her patients have other treaters, including psychiatrists who do prescribe anti-depressents or other psychopharmaceuticals to them. in many cases, she agrees with the decision to medicate because she can see the difference in her patients when they're on or off their meds. but in no case does she ever initiate the prescription herself.

i understand you had a different experience, but it's inaccurate to make a blanket statement like "psychologists do _____" based on that.


.

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I did not say all, and I stand by what I said.

 

[Richard Camembert]

Well there is depressed and there is DEPRESSED. Clinical depression is a serious thing, however we are in an epidemic situation where people unhappy with their lives run to a mental health professional and get a quick diagnosis of depression (along with medication that alters the chemistry of the brain, pretty severe when it’s not the real issue). These people often will use depression as an excuse for the reasons that caused their own unhappiness in life to begin with. Essentially if you aren’t a very motivated person whose life is unhappy because you don’t want to put effort into it, a psychologist will tell you it’s not you it’s depression, give you permission to not change anything and then mess with your brain by giving you drugs designed to help people who actually suffer from depression.
I’ve seen it happen quite a few times.

This isn’t quite right for a variety of reasons, Andy. First, psychologists aren’t giving you medicine. Those are the psychiatrists. Second, psychologists spend a lot of time trying to figure out if the depression is mostly situational, something deeper, or mostly biological. That’s because many of treatments for actual clinical depression don’t really work too well the people who are having situational problems, while treatments for the non depressed people don’t reall work on people who are actually depressed. Psychiatrists and psychologists spend a lot of time and effort trying to differentiate. Third, psychologists aren’t interested in patients getting stuck and not progressing, which is an inevitable outcome of the scheme you’re proposing. I’m guessing you’re working with court-related psychologists who have different foci and underlying theories?

 

[BTTA]

My wife was bipolar. Many of you know that she took her life in 2012. She left a wake of destruction behind her. I don’t blame her any more than if she had cancer, but it’s something that the survivors can never fully recover from.

Two of my three kids have been suffering from suicidality these past few years as well. It is obviously genetic (or a result of being close to me). They have been institutionalized on and off but are fairly stable now. It is the scariest thing. It’s very complex to try to keep them safe and also to try to motivate them live a normal healthy.

The best piece of advice I can give for people in my boat is to be supportive, offer help, be patient, and not feel too bad when you lose your **** now and then.

I am such an idiot that I am optimistic that everything will work out well. But I really think it will.

Thanks for that, PJ.

 

[BTTA]

This is SO true. The entire category of antidepressant drugs is one huge experiment.

I asked a psychiatrist once about how they work. He gave me the usual answer. I asked, "OK, but what's actually going on that makes that happen? What's the chemical process, and why does it happen?" He tried again with a short hand answer. I persisted. Finally, he sighed and said, "Look, nobody really knows, OK?"

I don't really think the massive uptick in the number of suicides is explained by prescription of pharmaceuticals, but I want to point out that we don't really know what any of those brain chemicals like dopamine even do, and we're prescribing drugs that mess with them in the hopes of fixing something. There's a huge marketing industry for these drugs that's designed to make you think we know what they do, but the state of research on them is bleak.

 

[Richard Camembert]

My wife was bipolar. Many of you know that she took her life in 2012. She left a wake of destruction behind her. I don’t blame her any more than if she had cancer, but it’s something that the survivors can never fully recover from.

Two of my three kids have been suffering from suicidality these past few years as well. It is obviously genetic (or a result of being close to me). They have been institutionalized on and off but are fairly stable now. It is the scariest thing. It’s very complex to try to keep them safe and also to try to motivate them live a normal healthy.

The best piece of advice I can give for people in my boat is to be supportive, offer help, be patient, and not feel too bad when you lose your **** now and then.

I am such an idiot that I am optimistic that everything will work out well. But I really think it will.

so sorry for your loss, Patjew, thank god your children have you in their lives.
Bipolar is a killer that is for sure, it’s one of the most severe mental illnesses, seems most certainly genetic, and is a constant scourge to the person ensuring it, who essentially is never in their right mind unless some medicine reaches them.