Pats D still Number 2 in AFC points against

[mosslost]

The AFC is better now than in 2011. If the defense continues to get smoked on 3rd downs they wont make it to the SB, especially facing high powered offenses like Oakland and Pittsburgh

Pats will dominate either at home in playoffs

 

[mosslost]

Somehow the Pats will come back and win this game and Andy will be in here talking about how the D did a great job by keeping the Jets from scoring more points than we scored

The D was strong

 

[skinnydog]

The Patriot offense is #5 in terms of starting position, does the defense get credit for that?

Sure, the defense gets some credit for that, but most is likely due to good special teams play. The point was that the Patriots defense has had very good field position to work with all year. Along with playing some really bad offenses with bad QBs, the has significantly contributed to their defensive points per game stats. I'm not saying that this is a bad defense, just that it is pretty average notwithstanding the points per game stat.

 

[Ring 6]

Sure, the defense gets some credit for that, but most is likely due to good special teams play. The point was that the Patriots defense has had very good field position to work with all year. Along with playing some really bad offenses with bad QBs, the has significantly contributed to their defensive points per game stats. I'm not saying that this is a bad defense, just that it is pretty average notwithstanding the points per game stat.

But the ppg stat is the one that matters more than all of the others.
It's how you win or lose.
ill say it one more time. It's about what you go on the football field and do. Not about woulda coulda shoulda. Everything that people are pointing to negatively about this defense hasn't happened on the field.
Tell me yourself which games has the defense played poorly.

 

[Ring 6]

Somehow the Pats will come back and win this game and Andy will be in here talking about how the D did a great job by keeping the Jets from scoring more points than we scored

And that is exactly what happened.

 

[skinnydog]

But the ppg stat is the one that matters more than all of the others.
It's how you win or lose.
ill say it one more time. It's about what you go on the football field and do. Not about woulda coulda shoulda. Everything that people are pointing to negatively about this defense hasn't happened on the field.
Tell me yourself which games has the defense played poorly.

I don't know why you don't grasp that ppg is not the only stat that matters. Yes this defense is good enough to hole average to mediocre to poor offenses to about 17 points per game. No, ppg is not terribly predictive of what will happen against playoff teams.

 

[Ring 6]

I don't know why you don't grasp that ppg is not the only stat that matters. Yes this defense is good enough to hole average to mediocre to poor offenses to about 17 points per game. No, ppg is not terribly predictive of what will happen against playoff teams.

I don't get why you don't understand it's the one that matters the most.

We are talking about how they played how they contributed to wins or losses.

All this bs about the eye test telling you it will be different against different teams has no basis in fact.

And yes ppg is a better predictor of playoff defense than any other stat you can come up with. Denying that fact doesn't change anything.


*i will again qualify that takeaways is an extremely important #2 factor in assessing a defense

 

[skinnydog]

I don't get why you don't understand it's the one that matters the most.

We are talking about how they played how they contributed to wins or losses.

All this bs about the eye test telling you it will be different against different teams has no basis in fact.

And yes ppg is a better predictor of playoff defense than any other stat you can come up with. Denying that fact doesn't change anything.


*i will again qualify that takeaways is an extremely important #2 factor in assessing a defense

I'll take defensive QB rating over ppg as a predictive stat in the playoffs (I believe this stat incorporates interceptions, but I'm not sure). I've never mentioned the "eye" test.

 

[Ring 6]

I'll take defensive QB rating over ppg as a predictive stat in the playoffs (I believe this stat incorporates interceptions, but I'm not sure). I've never mentioned the "eye" test.

You will take a random stat that you don't even know what it is comprised of over the result on the scoreboard?
Nice work by you.

You still haven't answered which games had the patriot defense played poorly?

 

[deroc5050]

You will take a random stat that you don't even know what it is comprised of over the result on the scoreboard?
Nice work by you.

You still haven't answered which games had the patriot defense played poorly?

I would say the Pats defense has played poorly.. take Seattle a team that couldn't really score, they come all the way across country against a rested Patriots team and drop 31 on us. And score 5 points against TB lol..

I honestly think one of the best performances from the defense barring the Texans game (The Texans suck huge nuts on Offense, but I still give the Pats credit for shutting them out) I think one of the best defensive performances was the last game against the Jets. The Offense didn't do much until the very end and the Defense caused 2 turn overs.

I would also say the Pats got away with 2 DPI's that could have at the very least turned field position.

The defense gives up a lot of yards, Ryan had a great day against our defense and has pretty much sucked for a while. When they play good teams they will give up points, and not just yards.

 

[Ring 6]

I would say the Pats defense has played poorly.. take Seattle a team that couldn't really score, they come all the way across country against a rested Patriots team and drop 31 on us. And score 5 points against TB lol..

I honestly think one of the best performances from the defense barring the Texans game (The Texans suck huge nuts on Offense, but I still give the Pats credit for shutting them out) I think one of the best defensive performances was the last game against the Jets. The Offense didn't do much until the very end and the Defense caused 2 turn overs.

I agree they played poorly vs Seattle.
What other games do you think they played poorly.

 

[fightingirish595]

I agree they played poorly vs Seattle.
What other games do you think they played poorly.

The 2009 Patriots gave up 17.8 Ppg. The 2014 defense gave up 19.6. Guys... It doesnt matter.

 

[deroc5050]

I agree they played poorly vs Seattle.
What other games do you think they played poorly.

They have taken advantage of alot of bad teams like the Browns, who lost their starter on the 2nd possession. The Steelers back up QB, I would say the D played poorly against SF considering who was at QB,

admittedly they havent given up a lot of points but other than Russel Wilson the only decent QB they have played is Andy Dalton lol... They have been pretty lucky with their schedule.

Bend but dont break is the moto us fans say.. but when we play Baltimore Joe Flacco will only be like 3 good QB's we have faced all season and even Flacco isn't that consistent.

If they play Big Ben, or Derek Carr, even Alex Smith will pick this defense apart. I do think the Pats will play good against Simeon.. Simeon likes the big plays and the underneath stuff, the one good thing this Defense does is they don't really give up the big plays. I know your all about points aloud but they really have been extremely fortunate with the QB's they have faced.

Everyone and their mother sees that this defense isn't very good, I have no idea why you don't see the same thing.

Put it this way, Ryan Tannehill could drop 24+ on us. He did in Foxborough in week 2.

 

[RDS11]

But the ppg stat is the one that matters more than all of the others.

It's really not.
The one stat that really matters is the final score. Average PPG on a sample of 16 games does not mean much. One single game, good or bad, will skew the average.

The 2011 defense, which couldn't stop a nose bleed, was 15th in the league in PPG (21.4). The 2009 defense was 5th (17.8 PPG). In 2011 we got to the Super Bowl, and in 2009 the defense was run over by the Ravens in the wildcard game.

Again, I'm not saying this defense is awful. I'm not saying it's great either. It has flaws, which can be exploited by good, efficient offenses. Belichick and Patricia can overcome some deficiencies during the regular season, because most games are played against mediocre teams. But at some point in the playoffs, we will face a good, efficient passing team, and if the offense is sub par, I don't believe this defense has shown it can overcome that.

When I read all these comments about how great the defense is because of their regular season PPG average, I feel like a Colts fan. We are celebrating something that is not important and has no bearing on our playoff chances.

 

[deroc5050]

Furthermore KC and Denver have over all more playmakers and better defenses than the pats and it was I believe 24-24 at the of regulation. Points aloud is just 1 stat and can be deceiving.

 

[Ring 6]

The 2009 Patriots gave up 17.8 Ppg. The 2014 defense gave up 19.6. Guys... It doesnt matter.

The 2014 defense played worse against Baltimore in the playoffs than the 2014 defense did.

 

[RDS11]

And yes ppg is a better predictor of playoff defense than any other stat you can come up with. Denying that fact doesn't change anything.

That's not true either.

Cold Hard Football Facts did an analysis a few years ago, and the better playoff predictor is the differential passing rating (offensive passer rating minus defensive passer rating). That the stats that correlates more to winning in the playoffs.

Edit : I found the analysis :
Cold, Hard Football Facts.com: The Truth Hurts

We call it the Mother of All Stats because it has an incredible Correlation to Victory and to championship success, as we’ve reported in many outlets, including in a 2012 presentation at NFL Films: 26 of 73 NFL champs since 1940 finished No. 1 in Passer Rating Differential (36%); 44 finished in the Top 3 in PRD (6%) and 69 finished in the Top 10 (95%).

 

[Tony2046]

someone seems angry

Did I bang your wife?

Gutless comment. Same as flipping someone off while inside your car on the highway.

 

[skinnydog]

You will take a random stat that you don't even know what it is comprised of over the result on the scoreboard?
Nice work by you.

You still haven't answered which games had the patriot defense played poorly?

Yes, I'll take that stat over ppg. As a predictive stat. And yes, I'm fairly sure it takes into account interceptions, but no I don't have the formula in front of me. But really? You critique is hat I don't know the formula off the top of my head with absolute certaintity. Really? Why don't you tell me why it is not a stat that is predictive of success, especially playoff success?

And why are you fixated on me naming a poor defensive game? I've repeated stated this is not a bad defense, it's an average defense. They've played as an average defense in almost every game, except for the Houston shutout. Yes, Osweiller is a horrible QB, but still they had a good game (especially Collins). I also thought the defense had a good game against the Cardinals and the first half against Miami. Everything else was average.

 

[skinnydog]

That's not true either.

Cold Hard Football Facts did an analysis a few years ago, and the better playoff predictor is the differential passing rating (offensive passer rating minus defensive passer rating). That the stats that correlates more to winning in the playoffs.

Edit : I found the analysis :
Cold, Hard Football Facts.com: The Truth Hurts

As a key defensive stat I'll take defensive passer rating as a good predictor of success over ppg alone. And yes for an overall stat predictive of winning I'll take passer rating differential. Oh and despite being in the middle of the pack in terms of defensive passer rating, they lead the league in terms of passer rating differential.