LaFell and Easley not present at practice

[Brady_to_Moss]

Gronk was a rare freak of nature and they got him in the second round. No indication that he was congenital y injury prone.

......and?

 

[Brady_to_Moss]

When healthy, Gronk is a superior pass/run blocker but to say that another player who has posted just-as-good if not better numbers and creates similar mismatch problems for defenses isn't even a contemporary is off base.

If you had to pick 1 TE fully healthy...who are you going to take? i think 9/10 people..maybe 10/10 would take gronk and most would say it isn't even close.

 

[goheels22002]

Again, the choice was never Gronk or Graham -- that's 20/20 hindsight, cherry-picking the best possible alternative. Jimmy Graham was a basketball player trying to convert to football. The TEs selected after Gronkowski were Ed ****son and Tony Moeoki.

The discussion is entirely about 20-20 hindsight. Belichick picked Gronk in the 2nd round after he missed his junior year due to back surgery, and did it again with a first-round pick this year with Easley. The issue is risk versus reward with precious resources that can make or break a team over a long period of time. It's very different from signing a FA, or trading a low-round pick for a veteran with an injury history. Gronk and Easley represent value only if they can get on the field.

 

[RobertWeathers]

Gotta agree with DI here. Gronk is a dominant force, but I believe that the Patriots would have won one more Super Bowl and been in another (2013), had he not been seriously limited by injury or out all together, respectively. Do the Pats win the Super Bowl against the Giants in February 2012 if Graham and Hernandez were on the field as compared to AH and a severely diminished Gronkowski?

Yes, they do.

2014 looks like another one of those seasons where we hold our collective breath every time he careens through traffic with the ball. The Patriots are a very different team with him on the field vs the one without him. It's great to see him playing healthy again. Knock on wood.

Gronk is a NFL history-altering force. He stays 100% healthy he is a 1st ballot HoF, SB Champion, potential NFL MVP.

If he suffers a career-ending injury this year we are watching a "Gronk-What Might Have Been" ESPN 30/30 sports-u-mentary in 2016.

That is a show I never- ever hope to watch.

 

[RobertWeathers]

If you had to pick 1 TE fully healthy...who are you going to take? i think 9/10 people..maybe 10/10 would take gronk and most would say it isn't even close.

Gronk- but it is closer than people in this region care to speculate.

My point to the poster who said that Graham wasn't even close to Gronk was that there isn't statistical evidence to support that assertion. Graham was an All-Pro TE last year. Hes not John Birch for goodness sake.

 

[Deus Irae]

You mean Ed ****son -- he was the only other TE drafted within a round of Gronk. And yes, ****son would have been the safe choice.

Every TE below Gronk was an option.

Again, the choice was never Gronk or Graham -- that's 20/20 hindsight, cherry-picking the best possible alternative. Jimmy Graham was a basketball player trying to convert to football. The TEs selected after Gronkowski were Ed ****son and Tony Moeoki.

Just to repeat: the TE options were Gronk or anyone else below him. As a mater of fact, Moeaki would have been another injury guy.

 

[Brady_to_Moss]

Gronk- but it is closer than people in this region care to speculate.

My point to the poster who said that Graham wasn't even close to Gronk was that there isn't statistical evidence to support that assertion. Graham was an All-Pro TE last year. Hes not John Birch for goodness sake.

But if you have a TE who can actually block..and block very well..and do the exact same things that Graham does with mismatches....i don't think it's close....MAYBE is it. If gronk couldn't block then yes..it would be a toss up.

 

[patchick]

The discussion is entirely about 20-20 hindsight. Belichick picked Gronk in the 2nd round after he missed his junior year due to back surgery, and did it again with a first-round pick this year with Easley. The issue is risk versus reward with precious resources that can make or break a team over a long period of time.

But you can't pretend that the choice facing a team is ever "injury risk" vs. "risk-free pick, guaranteed fabulous by hindsight." Jimmy Graham himself was considered a super-risky pick at the time, because he'd barely played football.

A fair comparison would be based on evaluations made at that time, e.g. the next player taken at the same position, or the next player taken overall. Which would mean trading in Gronk for either Ed ****son or Sergio Kindle.

 

[RobertWeathers]

But if you have a TE who can actually block..and block very well..and do the exact same things that Graham does with mismatches....i don't think it's close....MAYBE is it. If gronk couldn't block then yes..it would be a toss up.

Gronk is a better all-around TE. That is a closed argument, IMO.

Graham is the second best healthy TE in the NFL and a 2013 All-Pro. He is right there with Gronk.

After that,in terms of talent and production its a sizable margin to #3.

 

[ausbacker]

But you can't pretend that the choice facing a team is ever "injury risk" vs. "risk-free pick, guaranteed fabulous by hindsight." Jimmy Graham himself was considered a super-risky pick at the time, because he'd barely played football.

A fair comparison would be based on evaluations made at that time, e.g. the next player taken at the same position, or the next player taken overall. Which would mean trading in Gronk for either Ed ****son or Sergio Kindle.

People are commenting after the fact. Everything is easy in hindsight. If the draft was perfect, every player would be taken in order, on the sum total of their accomplishments.

It's ridiculous isn't it? Pretending that a pick was this or that before time has had its say.

 

[Fixit]

Jimmy Graham spent weeks building a case that he's a wide receiver. Next topic.

 

[Archeryaddict12]

Gronk is a better all-around TE. That is a closed argument, IMO.

Graham is the second best healthy TE in the NFL and a 2013 All-Pro. He is right there with Gronk.

After that,in terms of talent and production its a sizable margin to #3.

Gronk is the best TE and graham is a great wr. As the poster above said, even graham recognizes he is a wr

 

[mgteich]

Shazier was long gone by more than 10 picks.AAt

Offensive linemen were available: SuaFilo and Bitonio

Defensive linemen were available
DE Lawrence (perhaps a DE/OLB for us)
DT Hageman (a pure DT)

And then there was TE Sefarian-Jenkins
===========================

If not Easley, then who was their #1 pick? Su'a'Filo? Shazier?

 

[Deus Irae]

Shazier was long gone by more than 10 picks.AAt

Offensive linemen were available: SuaFilo and Bitonio

Defensive linemen were available
DE Lawrence (perhaps a DE/OLB for us)
DT Hageman (a pure DT)

And then there was TE Sefarian-Jenkins
===========================

Stephon Tuitt, among others, was also available

 

[Oswlek]

Easly has not lived up to his 1st round pick status thus far. That is indesputable.

It is the furthest thing from indisputable.

 

[Oswlek]

Again, the choice was never Gronk or Graham -- that's 20/20 hindsight, cherry-picking the best possible alternative. Jimmy Graham was a basketball player trying to convert to football. The TEs selected after Gronkowski were Ed ****son and Tony Moeoki.

Yup. All Gronk's injury history proves is that TEs have a higher than average injury risk.

Maybe if his injuries were consistent with the back concerns he entered the league with you could make a reasonable (though not convincing) argument. But claiming that his back somehow elevated his risk of arm and knee injuries is patently absurd.

 

[kennyb]

......and?

And that is why they drafted him
Easley was a small nifty guy nothing special really. Two bum knees means something might be congenital. And they wasted a first on him. Bad gamble.

 

[upstater1]

And that is why they drafted him
Easley was a small nifty guy nothing special really. Two bum knees means something might be congenital. And they wasted a first on him. Bad gamble.

So you're saying that his genetics attract bad hits to the knees? Guy was rolled up from behind. That's genetic?

 

[kennyb]

So you're saying that his genetics attract bad hits to the knees? Guy was rolled up from behind. That's genetic?

He blew his knees out twice. One was non contact I believe. No indication that Gronk problem was chronic. For a first round pick it was a big gamble.

 

[Deus Irae]

Joel Bitonio. Could've saved some headaches. Easly has not lived up to his 1st round pick status thus far. That is indesputable. I haven't thrown in the towel on him yet by any means and if he were a 3rd-4th rounder he would not receive as much scrutiny. Until he begins to excel he will be considered underperforming. Nature of the beast.

They drafted a guy coming off of ACL surgery. It should be expected that his rookie season might be sub-par, as a result. If you take a look at the first round picks this season, it's been a very good draft crop. Let's hold off on judging Easley until he's had the time to heal and adapt to the NFL.