Our Secondary SUCKS without Talib

[Nehalem]

I don't know if it is so much our secondary sucking without talib.

Or our secondary sucking without Talib when going up against an elite cadre of receivers without 2 starting LBs and both starting DTs.:bricks:

 

[Brady_to_Moss]

belichick is not the mastermind everyone here thinks he is.

do you even know what he did this year with all the injuries..where they ended up? This was one of if not his best year coaching

 

[PATSMATT]

I like the guy but he has went down in every big game.
I would let him walk unless he will stay for a reasonable number.

 

[DaBruinz]

That is the conclusion I am forced to reach after watching that debacle of a 'pass defense'. After Talib went down, they all fell like dominoes. Mismatches all over the field, the most glaring one being nobody could cover Demaryius Thomas if their lives depended on it.

I think this makes Talib a must sign in the offseason. We also need to seriously consider what other moves we can make to shore up the defense and the offense. I'm thinking we need another marquee safety/CB and an athletic TE because Gronk's health is questionable. And well, we all see how ugly it gets if Talib gets dinged up. We need a backup plan!!

Hopefully we can resign some key free agents and add a few pieces in the draft. We're going to need to step things up another level to go all the way in the hunt for the Lombardi.

I disagree with you. I think that our Cornerback depth has an issue with not having enough quality outside corners. Your 4th and 5th Corners have to be able to handle the outside corner position. Dennard couldn't because he was playing hurt and it was clear that the others were trying to step up for him and it just hurt the entire plan.

I thought it was a mistake that the Pats didn't dress Green for today's game when I saw the inactives. I think Green could have helped them out tremendously. Much more so than Bolden.

I honestly feel that Ryan and Dennard could be starting corners for this team. The problem becomes having back-up corners who can do more than just cover the slot receiver the way Arrington is limited.

 

[PattieswinSB]

The secondary sucked this year even with him but no one noticed because of the Run D.

 

[DaBruinz]

In a game of this magnitude you play unless your leg is falling off Talib got his ribs dinged up, he should have taken the needle, gotten taped up and back on the field. He could have covered. My impression is that hes soft.

We don't know the extent of Talib's injury. If the ribs were cracked, it's unlikely they were letting Talib back on the field because they'd want to avoid further injury, like the ribs breaking and possibly puncturing his lungs.

 

[DaBruinz]

One player???. The secondary is a hot mess. One guy goes down and it fails?? That is sad. And that is a reason this team falls short. They get it done sometimes, but deep protection is predictable and weak. Has been for years. When you have people praising the play of the likes of McCourty and Arrington, it's sad. Has been for years.

What is sad is a person like yourself not understanding that it was MORE than just one guy going down. It was the combination of Talib going Dennard, Dennard playing hurt, the team being without Wilfork, Kelly, Mayo and Spikes.

You clearly are one of those people who think that collecting talent is what wins championships and have no clue about what that really takes. How the salary cap limits teams.

BTW, Most people know that Arrington is a sieve on the outside and don't want him there. But most people also know that McCourty is an excellent safety and that you don't know what you are talking about when it comes to him.

 

[reflexblue]

Just tells you how vunerable the Patriots secondary is without ONE shutdown CB in place (ala, Ty Law).

Talib's 2nd AFC conference game, injury.

I'd rather spend the money on the front seven and get a dependable pass rush. If you have a good pass rush you can get away with lesser players on the back end.

 

[VJCPatriot]

Yeah, not sure how you come out of yet another game with Talib being hurt and say he MUST be resigned.

Look, injuries are weird. Guys who seem brittle end up finally staying on field and being fine for years. Other guys who seem like iron men drop. I get it. But Talib...man, he's hurt a LOT.

Talib played in 14.25 out of a possible 18 games this season. He wasn't the picture of Ironman health but he's far from Glass-I Dowling either.

Know who else is hurt a lot when you need him most, Gronk? Do you go out and cut Gronk? No, you keep him because he's our best piece on offense and just pray he can stay healthy for a postseason run.

The secondary's drop in level of play was evident from the moment Talib went down. When Talib was in, he was keeping Thomas mostly in check. Once he went out, 2nd and 20 might as well have been 2nd and 5 for Peyton because of how wide open Thomas would get on our defense. We could not get off the field on 3rd and long and even 2nd and long situations.

And if you noticed, I said it starts with resigning Talib.

I also said we need to shore up our team by acquiring additional help in the secondary. We resign Talib then we look for a solid #2 in free agency or a top flight physical CB prospect in the draft, plus another athletic tight end prospect just in case goodness forbid, Gronk suffers another injury.

I think this team is cursed with injuries, if Gronk doesn't go down in 2011 and 2012, do we have another Lombardi, if Talib doesn't go down in 2013 would we be talking about another Superbowl appearance to Brady's resume?

But just because your key player gets hurt doesn't mean he isn't important to your team. I'm not going to call Bill and ask him to cut Mayo, Wilfork, Gronk. Jerks, how dare they get hurt when we need them most?? All this means is that in addition to retaining key personnel, we need to develop even more depth behind them.

I'd rather spend the money on the front seven and get a dependable pass rush. If you have a good pass rush you can get away with lesser players on the back end.

This year's team had the 5th most sacks in the NFL and the most ever by a Pats defense under BB. The fact of the matter is that pass rush can get stoned by great OLs who don't get called for holding.

But examine why the Broncos defense got so much pressure on Brady, it's because Terrance Knighton had a huge day. He stoned the run all day long and also collapsed the pocket. And his presence was more important than his 'passrushing' even if he got a huge sack on 4th and 2.

 

[reflexblue]

belichick is not the mastermind everyone here thinks he is.

a candidate for the azz clown asylum.


This team was held together by bailing wire and bubble gum and they made it to the AFCCCG. This is one of the greatest coaching jobs i've ever seen.

 

[VJCPatriot]

PS It's not as if Talib getting hurt was the result of being 'injury prone'. It's because Welker frigging shanked him. Watch the play again.

I've seen players get hurt making a 'phantom cut' and then tearing something. This wasn't that type of injury. It was Welker taking out Talib. It's almost as if someone set a 'bounty' on him.

 

[reflexblue]

We don't know the extent of Talib's injury. If the ribs were cracked, it's unlikely they were letting Talib back on the field because they'd want to avoid further injury, like the ribs breaking and possibly puncturing his lungs.

I saw Jack Youngblood play with a broken leg in 1979, i know ive seen players out there playing with cracked ribs after they were taped up. Now maybe his injury was really severe, like you said we don't know. But if he was why was he still standing on the sidelines during the game. It just makes me think while hes a very good CB, he can't be relied on and that maybe hes a little soft. I guess will see by what kind of offer he gets low or Really low filled with injury clauses.

 

[aluminum seats]

Know who else is hurt a lot when you need him most, Gronk? Do you go out and cut Gronk? No, you keep him because he's our best piece on offense and just pray he can stay healthy for a postseason run.

Well, it's not a matter of cutting guys, but to what extent you go to re-sign them. As for Gronk, his injury history will certainly be considered, like any player's, when contract time comes.

Every case is different. I like Talib. We'll see. But I have to imagine his health is something that will factor into the Pats' thinking here.

 

[VJCPatriot]

Every case is different. I like Talib. We'll see. But I have to imagine his health is something that will factor into the Pats' thinking here.

Of course it will. I'm not suggesting we break the bank for him. But the following things seem pretty darn obvious.

1. The Pats defensive system fits him perfectly.
2. Talib is able to match up with top/physical WR specimens, unlike our other DBs.
3. The Pats secondary looks like doo-doo without him compared to when he is in there playing healthy.

With those factors in mind, I don't think he will get the rich contract he otherwise could have garnered. If we had gone on to win the Superbowl on the back of an awesome Talib performance, he could have asked for the moon. Now, not so much.

And considering how valuable he is to this defense, and proven in the system, it would behoove us to resign him, with the proper protections in place; I'm thinking an Amedola-style incentive laden deal.

 

[tmajr3]

Any shot we take Darqueze Dennard from MSU and tag Talib?

Edit: we have too many spots after actually thinking about this post

 

[aluminum seats]

Of course it will. I'm not suggesting we break the bank for him. But the following things seem pretty darn obvious.

1. The Pats defensive system fits him perfectly.
2. Talib is able to match up with top/physical WR specimens, unlike our other DBs.
3. The Pats secondary looks like doo-doo without him compared to when he is in there playing healthy.

With those factors in mind, I don't think he will get the rich contract he otherwise could have garnered. If we had gone on to win the Superbowl on the back of an awesome Talib performance, he could have asked for the moon. Now, not so much.

And considering how valuable he is to this defense, and proven in the system, it would behoove us to resign him, with the proper protections in place; I'm thinking an Amedola-style incentive laden deal.

Well all that I pretty much agree with...

 

[tmajr3]

Just thinking about the game. How many Giants secondary can you name from the two Super Bowls? Maybe one or two, but most people can name their whole dline. Our pass rush needs to get much better before our secondary can get better

 

[BelizePats]

In a game of this magnitude you play unless your leg is falling off Talib got his ribs dinged up, he should have taken the needle, gotten taped up and back on the field. He could have covered. My impression is that hes soft.

Dude. This is insane. I understand the frustration but it's crazy to think that Talib would not have been back on the field if it was at all possible for him to go. The guys loves the game. Period.

It stinks that he got taken out and that he ended up hurt for the second AFCC in a row. But it's madness and Jetlike to start saying he was dogging it etc because he got hurt again. As a poster you are far better than this!!!!!

Respects,

Rich

 

[DocHoliday]

I find it amazing anyone would suggest Talib was milking his injury instead of going back in.

It wasn't just his ribs, it was his knee. He was limping. The Patriots changed their injury report to knee as well in the third quarter.

 

[mgteich]

Our secondary SUCKS without a pass-rush.

Every secondary in the league SUCKS if they have no pass rush against Manning. DEN may be overrated. At very least it is a very, very powerful offense with lots of targets for one of the best quarterbacks in the nfl.

The patriots especially suck without their two starting NT's, two starting LB's, and top corner.

And Talib is NOT a must sign. I agree that we need a #1 corner and rotational DE. But there are other choices than Talib. We have to decide how to best use our cap money.