Why don't Pats make a play for big time receiver?

[Coach42]

You think our undrafted rookie has more talent than our 2nd round WR?

Dobson was a second round pick. Offensive line improvement helps everybody.

 

[Brady6]

Couple things:

1. Danny Amendola is the 26th highest paid receiver in the NFL; there are about 240 receivers currently in the NFL which means Danny is paid in the top 10% of all receivers. Is that not a big time receiver?
2. Rob Gronkowski when healthy is the most talented offensive weapon in the NFL along with Adrian Peterson and Calvin Johnson Jr. those 3 players are head and shoulders above the rest. That is a big time receiver whether he is titled as a tight end or not his primary role is to be a playmaker in the receiving game.
3. I am not sure if you’ve notice from Keyshawn Johnson, TO, Chad Johnson, Brandon Marshall, Dez Bryant and so many others but BIG TIME WRs are divas, do you really think that those egos would be ok playing second fiddle to Rob Gronkowski?

The gold standard of the NFL in terms of offense is the Denver Broncos but let’s look at what they did over the past 4-5 seasons to get to that point:

Drafted 2 playmaker – D. Thomas and Decker
Signed a good possession slot WR – Welker
Drafted and developed a receiving option – J. Thomas
Drafted and developed a running game – Moreno, Ball, Hillman

Now look at the Patriots:

Drafted 2 playmakers – Gronkowski and Hernandez
Signed a good possession slot WR – Amendola
Drafted and developed a receiving option – Edelman
Drafted and developed a running game – Ridley, Vereen, Bolden

You can even add Dobson and Boyce to the list; my point is the Patriots did everything and more that the Broncos did to build a great offense. Unfortunately 1 big piece of that is about to embark on his 6th operation in 13 months and the second big piece of that is looking at 25 to life in prison. You can say the Patriots made a bad decision (I would disagree) but to ask the question “why don’t we” as if we have not done the right things or to say things like criminal is ridiculous people you’re twisting the WR/TE position into this totally different aspect of the game or acting like if Thomas shot his buddy in the head and Decker had 6 surgeries in the next year Peyton Manning wouldn’t be in the same situation if not worse.

 

[Patriot Missile]

Like many have claimed. We already have an elite weapon. Short of Calvin Johnson IMO he is the best in the business. The stats showed that while Gronkowski was in for the 5 games, the Pats had the number 1 passing attack in the NFL during that span.

 

[primetime]

3. I am not sure if you’ve notice from Keyshawn Johnson, TO, Chad Johnson, Brandon Marshall, Dez Bryant and so many others but BIG TIME WRs are divas, do you really think that those egos would be ok playing second fiddle to Rob Gronkowski?

While I agree with most of your post, it's important to note that most "big time" WRs are not divas. While I could go back in time and point to Jerry Rice, even among today's best like Larry Fitzgerald, Calvin Johnson, Demaryius Thomas, Wes Welker, AJ Green, Reggie Wayne, Julio Jones, Victor Cruz, and Jordy Nelson (among others) are very far from divas.

You've also mischaracterized Brandon Marshall, who suffers from a mental illness and has turned into a model citizen and locker room leader in Chicago since he began treatment. Josh Gordon has trouble laying off weed, but he's not really a diva either.

Of course, you're also correct in that the Patriots have several receivers who are (Amendola) or will be (Edelman) paid like big-time receivers, and they also feature one of the two or three best pass catchers in football when healthy. When healthy is a big sore spot for Gronk, but them's the breaks.

 

[primetime]

You think our undrafted rookie has more talent than our 2nd round WR?

No, the opposite. Thompkins is a lesser talent than Dobson. Dobson's ceiling is something like Brandon Marshall, in the upper echelons of NFL receivers, while Thompkins' is somewhere near Jabar Gaffney.

 

[PatsFan2]

No, the opposite. Thompkins is a lesser talent than Dobson. Dobson's ceiling is something like Brandon Marshall, in the upper echelons of NFL receivers, while Thompkins' is somewhere near Jabar Gaffney.

Thompkins have better short area quickness and can beat press coverage he can get open quicker. Don't sell him so short he plays Bigger than he actually is.

 

[primetime]

Thompkins have better short area quickness and can beat press coverage he can get open quicker. Don't sell him so short he plays Bigger than he actually is.

He also regularly catches the ball with his body rather than his hands, which is a massive and possibly uncorrectable problem.

 

[PatsFan2]

He also regularly catches the ball with his body rather than his hands, which is a massive and possibly uncorrectable problem.

Most of his catches before the injury were All Hands Catches and he made the most of his opportunities. Thompkins is much improved in that area.

 

[The_Riddler]

Like many have claimed. We already have an elite weapon. Short of Calvin Johnson IMO he is the best in the business. The stats showed that while Gronkowski was in for the 5 games, the Pats had the number 1 passing attack in the NFL during that span.

There in lies the Key Issue. WHEN, WHILE. WHEN Gronk was in. Gronk fell to Round 2 for a reason and that was his health history, specifically his back.

One thing that hasn't been mentioned at all in the thread is a key word and it's DURABILITY. Big, Superstar, Stud WR's (DThomas, Megatron, Moss, Dez Bryant) etc. are typically DURABLE. They don't get hurt. They play most if not all of the season. It's week-in, week-out Consistent production that you can always count on.

BB chose to pass on DThomas and now Peyton and Denver are reaping the benefits of that poor decision. BB chose to pass on Dez Bryant. Crazy or not, if Dez was on our football team, we would all absolutely love the guy for his game-breaking ability, toughness, passion, courage and that word again, DURABILITY. But because he isn't and we watch him dominate football games every week. The local homers make excuses that he would Pollute the lockerroom and he wouldn't be able to figure out our WR Route-Tree (I love that one), on and on and on.

BB passed on two top stud WRs in that 2010 draft. We ended up with a half decent Safety in McCourty. I mean c'mon, was passing on those 2 WRs worth it? I'll never, ever believe that it was worth it. These 2 WRs impact games every week and they play Every Week.

It's all spilled milk now, we can't get them back. But we can be real proud of our Devin McCourty and his progress at safety, whose play BTW is NOT impacting any football games from my eye-ball test (Picks or Forced Fumbles??) like the way these other two previously mentioned WRs are impacting their teams.

2010 NFL Draft for us ended up being the following:

(Demaryius Thomas OR Dez Bryant) FOR (DMCourty and Taylor Price).

Mmmm, let me think for a moment, did BB make the right choice here??? This is a tough one.

 

[JackBauer]

BB passed on two top stud WRs in that 2010 draft. We ended up with a half decent Safety in McCourty.

Right about there is where I stopped reading.

 

[English Patriot]

Liking the responses, I am also one who believes Dobson can turn in to Alshon Jeffery, alot of similarities there.

But seriously look at what they have in Denver? Elite talent all over the field on offense. No wonder Peyton is putting up those numbers heck even you or i could do that with those receivers.

All i'm asking for is one big time guy to help out our QB so he can have a player that is able to win a jump ball and that is something i can't say about this current crop

 

[TruthSeeker]

No, the opposite. Thompkins is a lesser talent than Dobson. Dobson's ceiling is something like Brandon Marshall, in the upper echelons of NFL receivers, while Thompkins' is somewhere near Jabar Gaffney.

Agreed. There is no saying that Dobson can't make an Alshon Jeffrey type 2nd year jump (Or Arizona Cardinal's Michael Floyd kind of jump). In fact, Jeffrey had a less successful rookie season than Dobson had. So with a year of playbook knowledge, a year of getting on the same page with Brady under their belts, there is no way of knowing if we already don't have that kind of receiver, Dobson may just be that guy. Plus Thompkins and Boyce also showed some promise. Let's see what year 2 brings us. All three guys should be way more comfortable knowing where they are supposed to be when running routes, hopefully all 3 work with the Juggs gun in the offseason as well.

 

[chasa]

Liking the responses, I am also one who believes Dobson can turn in to Alshon Jeffery, alot of similarities there.

But seriously look at what they have in Denver? Elite talent all over the field on offense. No wonder Peyton is putting up those numbers heck even you or i could do that with those receivers.

All i'm asking for is one big time guy to help out our QB so he can have a player that is able to win a jump ball and that is something i can't say about this current crop

gotta wonder if maybe BB should let Josh draft the offensive skill players(thomas, decker, moreano)

 

[The_Riddler]

Right about there is where I stopped reading.

Homer Jack is back, classic stuff.....

You like these results huh Jack?

(Demaryius Thomas OR Dez Bryant) FOR (DMCourty and Taylor Price).

 

[jmt57]

1. Ignoring the salary cap is ignoring reality. The NFL is unique in that regard; this isn't baseball where the haves can simply swoop in and outspend the have nots for their best players.

2. We have seen the offense regress as the performance of the offensive line has regressed. I'm not sure how blowing up the OL and presumably replacing them with five guys playing for the minimum will improve matters. Aside from resulting in less time for the new high priced receiver to get open, I doubt a 37-year old pure pocket quarterback would last more than half the season from the beating he would take in such circumstances.

 

[Kontradiction]

No, the opposite. Thompkins is a lesser talent than Dobson. Dobson's ceiling is something like Brandon Marshall, in the upper echelons of NFL receivers, while Thompkins' is somewhere near Jabar Gaffney.

I think you're putting Thompkins' ceiling too low. Not trying to sound like a raging homer, but if Thompkins puts it together, he would seem to be a carbon copy of Chad Johnson. But that's IF he can put it all together.

 

[JackBauer]

Homer Jack is back, classic stuff.....

You like this results huh Jack?

(Demaryius Thomas OR Dez Bryant) FOR (DMCourty and Taylor Price).

Yawn. Don't blame me when you're only beclowning yourself.

You're right, though. If only we had Thomas or Bryant, we could achieve your (inadvertent?) goal to see this defense resembling the defenses of 2009-2011.

 

[obgod3]

Well lets use Denver as an example, no one really knew that three guys on the WR roster would end up being outstanding when they were drafted, lets face it the draft is luck all day long. How many "great" kids have been drafted that showed nothing. I dont believe that anyone really knows what they are getting, there's no Paw Sox in football. College rarely if at all plays a NFL level offense.

IN saying that remember that the reason teams typically dont get a high value WR is because the WR wants money that bankrupts the team. When Magatron gets a new deal I bet there is nothing left for the team that gets him to pay for anyone else.

I think our offense is just fine, we need solid defense, this has been the NE downfall for 7 years. No one knew we would lose what might have been a milestone asset to a murder charge, personally I think Gronk is great but Hernandez was someone that had more upside, IMHO.

Who are you going to go get? Are they part of a system that works for them or someone that can jump ship and be great on another team?

 

[upstater1]

That may be true, but given all of our outside receivers are rookies this year, maybe the draft isn't the best place to add depth there. Seems to me if you want to add depth to that skill set you find a mid level vet.

We've tried that mid-level vet route in New England, and it hasn't worked. Donald Hayes and Doug Gabriel etc.

If Boyce turns out and you land another WR that's just as good, that means you have 6 on the team. 6 is good. Brady deserves 6 interchangeable WRs.

The fact that Vereen and Gronk are good as well is a +, not a minus.

We still don't know what we have in the 3 rookies. None of them are guaranteed to become good players next year. I'd add one more to the mix.

 

[Brady6]

While I agree with most of your post, it's important to note that most "big time" WRs are not divas. While I could go back in time and point to Jerry Rice, even among today's best like Larry Fitzgerald, Calvin Johnson, Demaryius Thomas, Wes Welker, AJ Green, Reggie Wayne, Julio Jones, Victor Cruz, and Jordy Nelson (among others) are very far from divas.

You've also mischaracterized Brandon Marshall, who suffers from a mental illness and has turned into a model citizen and locker room leader in Chicago since he began treatment. Josh Gordon has trouble laying off weed, but he's not really a diva either.

Of course, you're also correct in that the Patriots have several receivers who are (Amendola) or will be (Edelman) paid like big-time receivers, and they also feature one of the two or three best pass catchers in football when healthy. When healthy is a big sore spot for Gronk, but them's the breaks.

I will admit I did mischaracterize them as divas you’re right about that. There have been many a diva that played WR and I exaggerated that across all top receivers.

I do not know if they’d have a diva attitude however if they were placed in a reduced role, that would be interesting to see.

I think there is a misconception that these players would be the same caliber player here and why didn’t we just draft them, the way players develop is through repetition. Calvin Johnson Jr. entered the league as a freak talent but it took 3-4 years of him being a top target receiving 130+ targets per season before he became this all world player – the pieces and talent was there of course but it was doing it repetitiously letting him see how he is defended, learning how to make adjustments on the ball etc. those were the things that made him the great player that he is. If we had draft Calvin Johnson Jr. and inserted him into a lineup with Gronkowski, Welker, Hernandez and others he would not have seen the same level of opportunity he has seen in Detroit, I am sure he would still be a great player but I think it is assumptive to think these players a plug and play like it’s a game of Madden.