Pats get CB Aqib Talib from the Bucs !!

[Deus Irae]

Condescending filth flowing through your fingers once again...shocking.

You didn't bother to note that I was responding to someone who'd attacked me, personally, out of the blue and with an untrue claim, and was using their words back to them, and you instead chose to jump in with yet another personal shot at me...shocking.

 

[woolster22]

The point is the New England Patriots may need more than Aqib Talib to fix the porous New England Patriots defensive secondary.

And with the young imposing front seven, if they can stay healthy and get some semblance of consistent man coverage with Talib and dennard with McCourty at safety, I'll take OTG's prediction of two seasons undefeated or whatever he said.

Best offense in the nfl with what must be a top performer in scoring, with a top contender to the run. Seems reminiscent of 03/04 (with upgraded offense obviously), except Seymour is skinnier and faster, not as strong. the lbs are lumber laying nightmares, all of them making teddy Johnson look like a punk (ok, I exaggerate here a bit...but seriously, revisit this post next year after Hightower has time to acclimate...), and we are moving towards a ravens type alignment where the line ties the oline up while maintaining the ability to push the pocket. difference is our linebackers can push a guard into the hurry as well...this defense just raised its ceiling exponentially.

 

[NewFeep]

I'm going to revisit this thread/post come playoff time. All the naysayers whining about character issues will be singing Talibs praises and talking about how we are gonna cruise into the SB.... Just a prediction......

 

[SuperPatsFan1]

I like it because if nothing else, it's something to talk about during the bye.

Like most I'm sure, for a 4th I'm cool. He's not a smurf like 99% of the CB's we draft or acquire and he's got a proven history of making plays (18 picks, 3 TD's).

If he F's up, we cut him and not a big deal. We've made worse investments and survived.

 

[MrNathanDrake]

Trade for Talib a desperate move for Patriots - Extra Points - Boston.com

I would gladly part with a measly 4th rounder to get a proven, good CB.


Think of all our BUST picks at DB in recent years.


2nd round Terreance Wheatley
2nd round Ras I Dowling
2nd round Darius Butler
4th round Johnathan Wilhite


Why waste another high draft pick on a DB and have them turn out as a huge bust, when we can trade for a better one and know what we're getting beforehand.

 

[Brady_to_Moss]

dowling a bust? never

 

[SEA_Pat]

Putting everything in perspective.

Yes the concerns are real and he has had a history. But the reality is someone of his talent wouldn't have been had for a 4th if he was a model citizen. So we sort of can't take the good and not the bad on this one.

In all honesty however this trade turns out for the pats, you have to take your hat off to BB and this front office. We had a weakness for all of the world to see and they went out and aggressively took a chance to try and fix it.

That's really all we can ask as pats fans and in my opinion is just a terrific move. Talib works out ala Dillon/Moss/Welker then we have 1st dibs/franchise rights to this guy. He pulls a Haynesworth/Ocho and we are left in the same position we are now really except we gave up a mid round pick.

Couldn't be happier with this move and now he has a week and a bit to start to learn the system. Well done BB

Unless I misunderstand, your second scenario is actually "he pulls a Haynesworth/Ocho and we have improved our draft position from end of the 4th round to end of the 3rd round in exchange for a 7th round selection".

:rocker:

 

[ctpatsfan77]

The number of players the New England Patriots retained from the unrestricted free agency signing period is still greater than the number lost.

To receive a compensatory draft pick, a team has to lose more qualifying free agents than they signed. The only exception to this rule is when a team has a net loss of 0, but the value of the free agents lost is greater than the value of the free agents signed, then the team would get one 7th round comp pick.

The key word there is "qualifying." There are a number of ways players don't count against a team (including signed too late, waived by the new team too early, waived by the previous team, and signed a vet minimum deal).

 

[woolster22]

You didn't bother to note that I was responding to someone who'd attacked me, personally, out of the blue and with an untrue claim, and was using their words back to them, and instead chose to jump in with yet another personal shot at me...shocking.

I figured even you could agree to your own pessimism and contrarian stances. You love to bicker and create petty arguments about anything and everything. I am also pretty sure most of the regulars here could agree with my previous statements.

Should I search down the dreaded "deuce mod" posts after you reached whatever numbing post count that qualifies you for mod standing? If the statement is so uncalled for and unfounded, why respond?

Enough bickering, where do you stand on this team? I think I vaguely recall you telling me to pump the brakes on the solder hate during preseason (before I watched my dvr...in my defense). What do you think of Thomas? Spikes contact extension? Draft needs next year?

 

[ATippett56]

if they can stay healthy and get some semblance of consistent man coverage with Talib and Dennard with McCourty at safety.

Not if the New England Patriots defensive secondary keeps making the same mistakes over and over again.

Bruschi sees secondary as 'error repeaters' - New England Patriots Blog - ESPN Boston

 

[Deus Irae]

I figured even you could agree to your own pessimism and contrarian stances. You love to bicker and create petty arguments about anything and everything.

And you continue with the garbage. I was being neither pessimistic nor contrarian. You're doing nothing but jumping into something without knowing what you're talking about, and attacking me as if you're some kind of little yap dog going for my ankles. Get back to me when you've got a clue as to what was happening in the thread prior to you blindly jumping in.

As for the "deuce mod" stuff, I have no idea what the hell you're talking about.

 

[supafly]

The point is the New England Patriots may need more than Aqib Talib to fix the porous New England Patriots defensive secondary.

I don't discount your valid point, but the addition of Talib is certainly a fine place to start.

Another would be the move of McCourty to FS, which solidifies speed and coverage over the top, which is something they were drastically lacking. I am a firm believer that proper safety play makes a world of difference.

Another would be the implementation of Dennard as a starting CB.

One more possible move could be more reps for Cole at the star position, as he may have woken up the coaches to at least give him some more reps there.

Those are 4 moves that may prove to be quite helpful in potentially improving the secondary of the NEP. Only time will tell, but so far the move of DMcC to help the coverage of the safety position here has payed off, so that's a step in the right direction. Many also feel that Dennard getting starting reps is another good sign. There are 2 so far that look to be better than they already were.

Really, if either one of Talib or Cole pan out, we're in much better shape than we initially were in my opinion. These moves also stengthen the tendency to play press man coverage in a more physical sense from a coverage perspective, thus allowing for more pressure from our front seven players.

EDIT: sorry, I did not see Woolster22's comments that you replied to earlier, which suggest much of the same thing

 

[woolster22]

Not if the New England Patriots defensive secondary keeps making the same mistakes over and over again.

Bruschi sees secondary as 'error repeaters' - New England Patriots Blog - ESPN Boston

"Shorse hit." Young group at safety, young player targeted. Early on expecting the safe rhythm building throw thinking he'd make a big play to set the tone. The only error repeating I see is in opening drives, whether that be to start a game or second half. And that is coaching, pain and simple. Throw out all opening drive scores and first possession of second half scores and I'm sure this defense looks much more impressive than it does anyway. Sure, things seem to fall apart late, but that seems to be coaching/play calling again. Either that or this team is full of choke artists? I'm sure the true answer isn't as simple, with blown play playing a huge role. Then again, Wii would be surprised with said statement given the age of the secondary?

Talib is a talented, experienced presence. Whether he makes the best of his time here remains to be seen.

 

[supafly]

If he F's up, we cut him and not a big deal. We've made worse investments and survived.

Well sure, but we also lose a 4th rounder in the process. That also happens to be next year when we already lacked a 5th and a 6th, so now there are no picks in rounds 4, 5, and 6. That makes it quite a large gamble of sorts.

One thing I do like about this move is that they are at least attempting to go "all in" this year, which I at least have to give them credit for.

Another thought is that they are attempting to solve an obvious area of weakness in a different manner, rather than continue to waste draft picks on college CB's. They at least attempted to grab someone who has proven NFL experience.

There are certainly some good qualities to this trade, but there is a big gamble too.

 

[italia44]

I'm not sure either. Suspend me, I don't care, it's the bye week and what would you say Mallett's value is.

That was just a gentle poke.....I admire your enthusiasm.At this point,Mallet might be worth a 4th.However,BB has no interest in getting a draft choice.he really wants to see Mallet develop.

Next year,there are 3 players that other teams would like to pry away from the pats:

1.)Shane Vereen....He's young and has more value to another team,than to the pats.
2.)Jeff Demps.....again,more value to another team.
3.)Aaron Hernandez......that's right....flame away.......But,think about it for a second...He's young,excellent long-term contract.We will have Gronk,Fells,Shiancoe and Ballard.Ah's value will skyrocket,next year.Forget about draft choices,if Ah and a draft choice could get you Larry Fitzgerald(be still my heart!)....or Darelle Revis(don't laugh),would you do it?....I would

 

[woolster22]

And you continue with the garbage. I was being neither pessimistic nor contrarian. You're doing nothing but jumping into something without knowing what you're talking about, and attacking me as if you're some kind of little yap dog going for my ankles. Get back to me when you've got a clue as to what was happening in the thread prior to you blindly jumping in.

As for the "deuce mod" stuff, I have no idea what the hell you're talking about.

Deuce mod...when you hit 30k...whether it was joking or legit I recall people panicking about your mod potential for much of what you are displaying here right now. So again...

Thomas? Spikes? Draft needs? McCourty at cb or safety? Enough bickering...I the you a bone in shaping my nose on solder to start the year....play nice already

 

[ATippett56]

The key word there is "qualifying." There are a number of ways players don't count against a team (including signed too late, waived by the new team too early, waived by the previous team, and signed a vet minimum deal).

The New England Patriots organization signed the following unrestricted free agents who are currently on the New England Patriots roster:

Brandon Lloyd
Daniel Fells
Spencer Larsen (IR)
Trevor Scott
Steven Gregory
Marquice Cole
Will Allen (IR)

List the New England Patriots unrestricted free agents who were signed by other NFL Franchises, who are currently on the team's respective rosters, that meet the aforementioned criteria.

 

[ATippett56]

"Shorse hit."

Since your response lacks credibility, I'm thru discussing this subject with you.

 

[CheeseMonkeys]

The whole Addreall thing is waaaaay overrated. It's just not that strong. You get the same effect from a double or triple espresso.

Not to get too far off topic but you are wrong on that and clearly have never taken Adderall. Amphetamines are potent and in certain doses cause intense euphoric effects often compared to cocaine. If you take too much adderall, you will have a hellish comedown. Nothing like an espresso. There's a reason why it's a schedule II drug.

 

[supafly]

"Shorse hit." Young group at safety, young player targeted. Early on expecting the safe rhythm building throw thinking he'd make a big play to set the tone. The only error repeating I see is in opening drives, whether that be to start a game or second half. And that is coaching, pain and simple. Throw out all opening drive scores and first possession of second half scores and I'm sure this defense looks much more impressive than it does anyway. Sure, things seem to fall apart late, but that seems to be coaching/play calling again. Either that or this team is full of choke artists? I'm sure the true answer isn't as simple, with blown play playing a huge role. Then again, Wii would be surprised with said statement given the age of the secondary?

Talib is a talented, experienced presence. Whether he makes the best of his time here remains to be seen.

I'm not necessarily sure that I would see it the same as you are, but that's not to say that I am right either.

I personally think that the lack of safety play (coverage specifically) makes the odds a lot lower of there being adequate CB play on many reps. Proper safety help and correct coverage/assignments go a long way in making everything better for both corners and safeties. I think we have seen a lack of decent safety play, so hopefully McCourty's presence back there will continue to make a positive difference.

When you have a combo of ALL of the following things are not looking too good:

--both starting safeties hurt and out for multiple games

--Chung completely sucking in coverage

--Gregory being new to the system and not playing up to speed

--T.Wilson = a rookie who is still learning and repeating mistakes

--N.Ebner shouldn't be seeing any live game reps on defense unless the game has already been decided

Those 5 factors certainly contribute to poor safety play, as the final line of defense is extremely important in many ways and negatively effects the entire coverage issues of the secondary.

Not only that, but the CB play has also been below average too, with guys like Arrington, Moore, and McCourty not playing too well on a consistent enough basis.

Those are the 2 big variables to me, not necessarily coaching.