Tebow to Pats rumor

[NinjaZX6R]

This. Tebow's maximizing TOP also allowed his defense to take a breather, to come back strong to make a stop. Tebow impacted the game in many ways, he took over a hopeless 1-4 team to the playoffs and there he beat the #1 defence. Yet according to ignorant posters here, he is not an NFL level QB. LOL

Yeah a team w. a QB playing with a crappy ankle.
A team that lost it's 2 of 3 Dline starters in Brett Keisel and Casey Hampton.
Oh, they also couldn't play their idiot starting FS and started a scrub, that lost the game in the end.

 

[Ring 6]

You never heard that? That story is legend! I kid you not!




Umm...last season was really his first under fire. What you call a skill level may be well be something that can simply be labeled "unconventional". Lord knows, he wouldn't be the first endowed with that moniker.

Skill is skill

Well known? Andy, I live in Denver! I never read or heard that story.

OK I don't live in Denver and I heard it a few times.

The line at the time was Lloyd was disenchanted with the team and it's prospects, and was becoming something of a malcontent. He was moved because at the time they thought it was better to move him and get something - anything - in return. Why do you think they settled for a 6th? At the time, everyone knew what was going on in Denver, and that he was gone, no matter what, and that that was the best deal they were going to get for him.

That doesnt really conflict with what I heard other than you are leaving out the link that it happened as soon as Tebow was named the starter.

Why would he complain about the prospects of playing with Tebow after the disaster that was Orton?

He out up big numbers with Orton. When Tebow came in they started out by thowing less than 20 passes a game.

I dunno. Why did the Pats go through a stretch midway through the season where they lost 2 of 3, including one to those selfsame Bills?

I don't know, Im not the one saying they were on a mission of leadership. It would seem if losers suddenly became winners because of mystical leadership they could beat bad teams with nothing to play for with a clinching a playoff spot on the line. Instead they were blown out of one and scored 3 points in the other, and backed in.

It's a long season, a very long season. You can't get a team up for every single game. There will be stretches where things just don't go right, no matter what. That's life.

If you can't get up for a playoff spot clinching game how can you claim great leadership?

Denver should be thankful and proud this kid took this team where it really had no business being.

And I think Tebow should thank God that he happened to be in there when the defense decided to singlehandedly win a bunch of games that he couldn't get 20 points on the board in. Works both ways.

All the QBs they tried before went for naught, until this guy, who it seems nobody likes,

Its not a matter of like. Its a matter of being honest about his ability and play.
How do you reconcile that the offense scored more points in the games he didnt play than the ones he did, yet you are giving credit to the change to the offense?

and is the neanderthal prototype for the Worst Quarterback Ever, changed the entire dynanic of that team until the coach, the team's top executive and the owner all had to agree this kid was indeed the Real Deal.

Who said he is the real deal?
I did not say he is the worst QB ever, I said he is not a starting caliber NFL Qb, and that seems blatantly obvious to me.

I understand you don't like him as a QB. I understand you don't see him as a classic, traditional passer. I even understand you may not like his methodology in playing the game.

What I don't understand, Andy, is why you can't see that, in spite of all the negatives associated with this Denver team, all this kid seemed to do was win.

His TEAM won despite his play. He scored less than 19 points in 9 of 13 games and 7 of the last 10.
Perhaps this will make my point more clear.

Last year in the NFL there were 193 instances in the regular season where one team scored 18 points or less. That is an average of 6 per team. The Broncos had 8.
In those 193 instances those teams were 31-162.
Additionally there were 125 games where teams scored 14 points or less. 5 were the Broncos.
In those 125 instances those teams were 12-113

So. NFL teams scored 14 or less in about 25% of their games, and had a winning % of about 10%. In other words, if your offense scores 14 or fewer its contribution gives you a 10% chance to win. 5 of Tebows 13 starts fit this category.
If a team scored 15-18 (which happens in less than 10% of all games, but 4 of Tebows 13) its chances of winning are 38%.

So Tebows offense gave the team a 10% chance to win in 5 of the 13 games and a 38% chance of winning 4 more.
That says with an average defense the Bronocs win 2 of those 9 games.
Those actually represented 5 of the 8 wins they had under Tebow.
So the team, first in the NFL in rushing, won games due to defense that they did not deserve to win by offense.
How can you possibly conclude they weren't winning in spite of him.

I mean, that counts for something, right?

It would if they won because of him. They didn't

 

[Ring 6]

What about from game 6 on?

Feel free to look it up, but since they scored less points from game 6 on, I don't think the answer will be the once you are grasping at.

 

[Ring 6]

What I don't understand, Andy, is why you can't see that, in spite of all the negatives associated with this Denver team, all this kid seemed to do was win.

I mean, that counts for something, right?

By the way, you do realize that he took a team that started 1-4 and took it to a 1-4 finish right?

 

[Ironman44]

Yeah a team w. a QB playing with a crappy ankle.
A team that lost it's 2 of 3 Dline starters in Brett Keisel and Casey Hampton.
Oh, they also couldn't play their idiot starting FS and started a scrub, that lost the game in the end.

Stop making excuses for the Steelers. Denver was missing Kuper, Dawkins , Moreno , Decker , Von miller was hurt EVRYONE has injuries late in the season. Also " that scrub" was Ike Taylor who is hardly a scrub.

Also Harrison and polamalu were on the field and getting smoked repeatedly . So when the steelers were 9 in the box and Tebow still ran for 50 yards and a TD where is the excuse then? 366 total yards 3 TDs no turnovers ..incredible that sucks all of a sudden. Also if the steelers were 9 in a box it's because they feared the Denver running game powered in good part by Tebow.

You can hate on Tebow all you want ( it's a free country) but don't minimize that win with all that pressure on a first year starter backing into the playoffs. C'mon...

 

[Patriotic Fervor]

By the way, you do realize that he took a team that started 1-4 and took it to a 1-4 finish right?

Yeah.

He also took them to a playoff spot.

Good night, Andy....

 

[Ironman44]

By the way, you do realize that he took a team that started 1-4 and took it to a 1-4 finish right?

That's parsing stats , don't forget the 7-1 center

 

[Ring 6]

Yeah.

He also took them to a playoff spot.

Good night, Andy....

Actually, the TEAM made the playoffs, and backed in at 8-8.
I suppose Mark Sanchez is a good QB because the Jets made the playoffs twice?

 

[Ring 6]

That's parsing stats , don't forget the 7-1 center

I addressed that as well.
Just pointing out the irony in 'he took over a 1-4 team'
He left them the way he found them, didn't he.

 

[Ring 6]

Stop making excuses for the Steelers. Denver was missing Kuper, Dawkins , Moreno , Decker , Von miller was hurt EVRYONE has injuries late in the season.

Also Harrison and polamalu were on the field and getting smoked repeatedly . So when the steelers were 9 in the box and Tebow still ran for 50 yards and a TD where is the excuse then? 366 total yards 3 TDs no turnovers ..incredible that sucks all of a sudden. Also if the steelers were 9 in a box it's because they feared the Denver running game powered in good part by Tebow.

You can hate on Tebow all you want ( it's a free country) but don't minimize that win with all that pressure on a first year starter backing into the playoffs. C'mon...

By the same token, you continually take credit away from the team saying 'he won' when in fact he was a small, oftentimes negative impact.

 

[Ironman44]

I addressed that as well.
Just pointing out the irony in 'he took over a 1-4 team'
He left them the way he found them, didn't he.

Sorry man he took a team that was 7-24 ( worst in the NFL) and he left it 8-5 ( with first playoff win since 2005)

My comparison is a bit more accurate . worst to 2 wins from a Super Bowl

 

[Ironman44]

By the same token, you continually take credit away from the team saying 'he won' when in fact he was a small, oftentimes negative impact.

I clearly explained that Tebow was 1 part of a 3 part puzzle . Tebow, defense and kicking all of which contributed greatly to a very big turn around .

You on the other hand give no credit to Tebow for anything saying they won in spite of him. I believe my description is more accurate .

 

[Ring 6]

Sorry man he took a team that was 7-24 ( worst in the NFL) and he left it 8-5 ( with first playoff win since 2005)

My comparison is a bit more accurate . worst to 2 wins from a Super Bowl

Mine was 100% accurate, they did absolutely start 1-4 and end 1-4.
Rather than the humor, why don't you read and respond to the post that details the offenses contribution to those wins?

 

[Ring 6]

I clearly explained that Tebow was 1 part of a 3 part puzzle . Tebow, defense and kicking all of which contributed greatly to a very big turn around .

You on the other hand give no credit to Tebow for anything saying they won in spite of him. I believe my description is more accurate .

His play was below average. That is the definiition of winning in spite of a player.
You keep saying HE WON. The team won, and he was part of the team, but he was the part of the team that was not contributing as much to the wins as the other parts. That is totally a fair statement.

 

[Ironman44]

His play was below average. That is the definiition of winning in spite of a player.
You keep saying HE WON. The team won, and he was part of the team, but he was the part of the team that was not contributing as much to the wins as the other parts. That is totally a fair statement.

It's a form of expression when describng the QB position no single player wins by himself in the NFL.

I think your ignoring the leadership intangible , Bailey, Dawkins, Von Miller , Mcgahee , Thomas all came forward and said he energized the team and helped the locker room gel.

He's a leader and it impacted the team.

Ok we are going in circles , I am pretty sure Manning signs with titans and Tebow stays in Denver anyway.

 

[PATRIOTSFANINPA]

2 weeks before his death, Tom Brady's mentor Tom Martinez said to the media that if he took Tebow under his wing that by the end of 1 month he would have made Tebow a complete Quarterback with all the intangibles it takes to be one.

I really believe he could have and probably might have gone to help Tim had he not had left us so early.

 

[patsderoer]

By the same token, you continually take credit away from the team saying 'he won' when in fact he was a small, oftentimes negative impact.

Actually you continually take away credit from Tebow. Because of him, Denver became the 1st running offense in the NFL. That running offense took a lot of time of the clock, and helped his defense stay fresh throughout the game. But since you are a blind hater, all you want to is to discredit Tebow, and you continue to expose yourself.
No, it wasnt only the defence that limited the opponents to small number of points, it was also the offense led by Tebow who limited the oppponents TOP. That is why the defense improved so much under Tebow, when before they were among the worst in the NFL.

But hey, keep repeating the completion %. Tebow sucks sucks SUCKS. Doesnt matter that he has the highest passing rating in college history, achieved in a very good conference no less, so he is a very good passer. Doesnt matter that all his WRs are very young, and are still learning the trade, and are still learning how to create separation. Doesnt matter that he has average at best TEs.

 

[Patriotic Fervor]

By the same token, you continually take credit away from the team saying 'he won' when in fact he was a small, oftentimes negative impact.

No, we do not take away from the team on this.

The TEAM (there's that word again) responded to his leadership. They responded to the fact he led them to wins. They responded when other QBs could not turn that trick.

They responded!

You know why that team started at 1-4? Because they were a 1-4 team! They were that bad, and, unless there was divine intervention (!), they were going to get worse.

That 7-1 center that Ironman Just mentioned? There is no way that team should have gone 7-1 at any point in the season, they were that bad. Yet, they did.

We cannot minimize what the defense did for the team; it was immense. Tim Tebow did not make any tackles for them, nor did he sack any opposing QB. But the defense played lights out precisely because they knew with Tebow at the helm, they always had a chance. They might not win, but they always had a chance with him in there.

Certainly, I agree that one of a modern QB's jobs is to pass the ball efficiently. Remember, there are as many ways to succeed as there are people. But most importantly, a QB's job is to lead the team. The whole team.

If a QB is just out there to sling the ball, and then focuses on other things when the 60 minutes is over, what does that get you? Jeff George could sling the ball. Would you want him as your QB?

Tim Tebow may or may not come to New England. At this point in time, the issue is moot. What does remain, however, is whether or not he is a bona fide NFL QB.

If that issue is not resolved in Denver, it will be elsewhere, and if that is the case, then I think it wll come back to bite the Denver franchise in the ass, big time.

Too many people somehow think his first real season running a team is going to define how his career unfolds and develops. What if we'd done that with Peyton Manning?

 

[Smokeeye123]

I think his good karma alone would be worth a 7th rounder.

 

[ausbacker]

No, we do not take away from the team on this.

The TEAM (there's that word again) responded to his leadership. They responded to the fact he led them to wins. They responded when other QBs could not turn that trick.

They responded!

You know why that team started at 1-4? Because they were a 1-4 team! They were that bad, and, unless there was divine intervention (!), they were going to get worse.

That 7-1 center that Ironman Just mentioned? There is no way that team should have gone 7-1 at any point in the season, they were that bad. Yet, they did.

We cannot minimize what the defense did for the team; it was immense. Tim Tebow did not make any tackles for them, nor did he sack any opposing QB. But the defense played lights out precisely because they knew with Tebow at the helm, they always had a chance. They might not win, but they always had a chance with him in there.

Certainly, I agree that one of a modern QB's jobs is to pass the ball efficiently. Remember, there are as many ways to succeed as there are people. But most importantly, a QB's job is to lead the team. The whole team.

If a QB is just out there to sling the ball, and then focuses on other things when the 60 minutes is over, what does that get you? Jeff George could sling the ball. Would you want him as your QB?

Tim Tebow may or may not come to New England. At this point in time, the issue is moot. What does remain, however, is whether or not he is a bona fide NFL QB.

If that issue is not resolved in Denver, it will be elsewhere, and if that is the case, then I think it wll come back to bite the Denver franchise in the ass, big time.

Too many people somehow think his first real season running a team is going to define how his career unfolds and develops. What if we'd done that with Peyton Manning?

They were also crushed by worthy opponents.

The Broncos of 2011 were a great story for the many and varied challenges they faced. Meeting opportunity with timing, namely scheduling and returning talent, they rallied around what Tebow did on O and Prater's clutch kicking ability. The were the sum of parts and did well enough by winning a playoff game.

Nothing more and nothing less.