Defense? What defense!!!

[Synovia]

pass rush was nonexistent again.

I just don't understand this.


Rivers was sacked twice. Rivers threw two interceptions, ONE TO A NOSE TACKLE, one where his throwing motion was messed up because the guard was pushed back into him. He was hit 7 or 8 times, and pressured a handful more. Thats a pretty decent pass rush.

He made some fantastic throws under pressure. Not everyone can do that.


The real problem is that Brandon Spikes, and Safety#2 can't cover **** in the middle of the field.

 

[patsfaninpittsburgh]

It's not chicken little-like to suggest the defense didn't play very well. If all anyone is ever going to do is quote the score, there's really not much point in participating in a message board at all.

Yup

That's another problem.

 

[Synovia]

I think there is a bit too much focus by some now on "only 21 points allowed" to the Chargers offense. Forcing only 1 punt, allowing 10/12 on 3rd down, and allowing the opposing offesne to keep driving deep into your territory over and over is usally going to lead to a lot more than 21 pts.

Its tough to force punts when you force turnovers. Turnovers are better than punts.


A punt is a team exchanging 40 yards of field position for the ball. On a turnover, you get the ball without giving up those 40 yards. You can afford to give up a few more yards if you're going to force turnovers.

 

[vyrago]

but i dont see our defense being a shutdown d. but i dont see it for anyone

Pittsburgh?

 

[coolguy]

The patriots finally have a pass rush after 3 lonnnnnnnnngg seasons....The problem is the secondary CAN'T STOP PLAYMAKERS!!!!!!!

Bill needs to understand DMc is not NOT A TRUE SHUT DOWN CORNER and needs help with certain players.

 

[aluminum seats]

Do I think our D is great? No. Do I think it's good? Right now, no.

I think we're in agreement.

 

[DaBruinz]

pass rush was nonexistent again.

It was non-existent to the point that they were forcing Rivers to dump it laterally to his RBs so they could get something.. How many times was Rivers flushed from the pocket? You do realize that is considered pressure, yes?

 

[Synovia]

The patriots finally have a pass rush after 3 lonnnnnnnnngg seasons....The problem is the secondary CAN'T STOP PLAYMAKERS!!!!!!!

Bill needs to understand DMc is not NOT A TRUE SHUT DOWN CORNER and needs help with certain players.

There's no such thing as a shutdown corner with today's rules. Asomugha only was so good in Oakland because the guy opposite him was terrible. He's getting the majority of the targets now opposite Samuel.


Revis is the closest thing out there, and he still gets targeted quite a bit across from Cromartie.

 

[DaBruinz]

I don't have the patience to look up stats, but from what I saw of the Jets and Steelers today was good. We are near the bottom of the league at this point.

I'm hopeful we turn it around, but we haven't the last couple seasons so am not overly optimistic this year.

Both the Jets and the Steelers played teams that have serious QB issues. To think that the Pats are "near the bottom of the league" because they played a good division rival and a team with one of the top offenses in the league is just foolishness.

It's amazing how people like yourself won't give credit where it's due.

 

[DaBruinz]

Jackson was held to two catches last week.

And Gates torched them for 8 catches.. Pick your poison.

 

[coolguy]

There's no such thing as a shutdown corner with today's rules. Asomugha only was so good in Oakland because the guy opposite him was terrible. He's getting the majority of the targets now opposite Samuel.


Revis is the closest thing out there, and he still gets targeted quite a bit across from Cromartie.

It's truly hilarious to see so many spectacular catches receivers make on DMc.

DMc does everything right only to have a wr make sportcenter top play catches against him

 

[patsfaninpittsburgh]

Pittsburgh?

Huh?

I hope you are not serious.

 

[DaBruinz]

We're discussing today's defense. After game 16, we'll be talking about game 16's defense.

The Patriots are currently 31st in passing yards allowed, are 21st in opponent QB rating and are 26th in passing average allowed. It seems reasonable, to me, for people to think that's not very good.

When did yards become the determining factor is whether or not a team wins or loses a game?

The "Bend, don't Break" defenses have always given up yards to good teams, but stopped them when it counted. The Chargers had 3 turnovers inside the Pats 30 and had a 4th series end on down at the Pats 1. Pretty sure that is the sign of a good defense.

 

[DaBruinz]

It seems that defensive rankings only matter to folks on here when it suits them. It's not a matter of "when it suits them". It's a matter of using the yards argument against people like yourself to show that it's really not valid.

It's ok to mention that the Pats offense beat up on the #1 and #6 ranked defense last year. But those rankings are based on yardage not points allowed. The Chargers were ranked 10th and the the Phins 14th in terms of points allowed last year

But in our Pats case, that ranking is then thrown out the window because points is all that matters. weird.

i'd like to say that every game will have us hemmoraging yards but we will have timely turnovers. But we won't.

Here's my beef. We've won three championships, but I'm selfish. Very few teams ever get a Tom Brady in their history. So I want the most made of his time here.

Our defense is subpar right now...and I can't whistle past the graveyard like others on here.

You're not selfish. You arrogant and ignorant. And no one is " whistling past the graveyard." We're just not acting like spoiled little brats who have no understanding of the game.

 

[NYCPatsFan]

Question for the experts: in your opinion, can our D be relied upon to step up when Brady and our O falter?

Those who played the game and those who know it - including those few here who think they know it all thanks to BB's PCs - refer to situational football to explain why the D played the way it played.

So, if the situation requires our D to say get out of the field quickly by forcing punts or keep the opponent's scoring restricted to just FGs, have we seen enough of our D for the last two/three seasons to have confidence that they will?

PS: I am not hitting against our D as it seems to be the purpose of this thread. I am elated with our W and impressed by our D's goal line stand; at the same time, I am unnerved by the multiple big completions that opponent QBs/WRs seem to be capable of making during any situation. Hence the query.

PS2: just saw this clip on situational football.
http://www.csnne.com/pages/landing_patriots?blockID=564869&tagID=136101

Thanks,

 

[Synovia]

It's truly hilarious to see so many spectacular catches receivers make on DMc.

DMc does everything right only to have a wr make sportcenter top play catches against him

The worst was the play where McCourty was trailing Jackson, Arrington had bracketed him deep, and one of the safeties came over inside. They had 3 guys there when the ball got there, and Jackson still came down with it in the endzone. Nothing you can do there.

 

[DaBruinz]

Regardless of how much film is available, the lack of pressure from this new D line is disappointing. These guys are veterans--they know what they're supposed to do, they just don't appear to be doing it very well.

And please everyone, stop with the "we held San Diego to 21 points" line. The Chargers essentially did what they wanted. 500+ yards, 10/12 on third down, etc.

The good was the goal line stand, and (less so) the turnovers (and don't count on those in the playoffs.) Not much good beyond that.

The problem with your statement in BOLD is that the Chargers didn't "essentially do what they wanted." If they had, they'd have won the game. People on here need to stop acting like the Chargers are a mediocre team with garbage talent.

"Bend, don't break" has always been about allowing yards, but not points. It was that way in 2001 and continued to be that way since.

And for all the gripes about no pass rush, seriously, I watched Rivers pocket collapse on at least 10 occasions. The results were twice he ran the ball, at least 4 times he went back ward before dumping it off, and there were other times he moved outside the pocket because of the pressure.

Pressure on the QB is not just about Sacks. It's about collapsing the pocket and forcing the QB to move. But Rivers is good at getting out of the pocket and throwing on the run. And lets not forget that Hardwick, Dielman, and McNeill are very good O-linemen as well.. They aren't jags..

 

[DaBruinz]

How did we get booted out of the playoffs again!!!

Because the entire team played like garbage.. From Brady right on down. But god forbid you let facts get in the way of your opinion...

 

[Bostonian1962]

There may very well be a positive difference in this defense, to the horrible pass rushing defenses of the past few years.

In the past few years, you got what you got, and you knew the team had nobody on the roster that was going to improve things. I mean that from a pass rush standpoint, and from a CB standpoint.

This year, we still have hope from improvement because:

1. Many of the defensive players missed alot of time, in an already shorten preseason, and have to get their acts together (timing, coordiation, communication etc.).
2. Carter, Hayensworth, Ellis, Anderson, Dowling, and others are brand new playing together, and have to get in synch with each other.
3. Team is playing in a new defensive scheme for the first time. Getting it down takes time.
4. CB unit has Bodden back (although there was no excuse for the two penalties yesterday), as well had Dowling added to the mix, and on paper are better.

What I'm trying to say is that, this could be a factor of playing together, and not a lack of playmakers. Last year I believe it was the latter.

 

[Synovia]

Pressure on the QB is not just about Sacks. It's about collapsing the pocket and forcing the QB to move. But Rivers is good at getting out of the pocket and throwing on the run. And lets not forget that Hardwick, Dielman, and McNeill are very good O-linemen as well.. They aren't jags..

Lets also not forget that 3 of the turnovers (INT, INT, Rivers fumble) were directly a result of the pass rush.

Its clear why Wifork and Anderson's plays were, but people really need to go back and rewatch that play where Sergio Brown made the pick. The primary part of that play was the Guard getting pushed back into Rivers, and Rivers not being able to complete his throwing motion.