Draft/Get Wheels; BJGE our 3rd Down Man

[Lurks_All_Day]

Imagine we have/get/draft an elite RB with serious wheels.....
I could envision Green-Ellis as the sure-handed, power-enough 3rd down legacy to KFaulk.
IMHO, Danny Woodhead is just not what we need for down #3 long-term. He's good, (hell he's more than that!) but I don't see him in the league in 5+ years. "Too small" really takes its toll at this level, and I see Danny Woodhead as such: one injury, out for the year... then what? I've suffered injuries that nag for life... He cannot be our future, he's simply not built for the LONG TERM. Or am I wrong about size?
Contrast Green-Ellis: durable, smart enough to find the holes, and never ever ever (ever? HOLY!) fumbles.

 

[Sciz]

By definition, most 3rd down backs are undersized. That's why they are 3rd down backs and not starters. And I think a big part of being a 3rd down back is having that wiggle in the open field to catch a pass in the flat, make the first guy miss, and pick up a first down. I don't think Benny has that ability, while Woody has shown it quite a few times in his brief time in NE.

 

[Lurks_All_Day]

By definition, most 3rd down backs are undersized. That's why they are 3rd down backs and not starters. And I think a big part of being a 3rd down back is having that wiggle in the open field to catch a pass in the flat, make the first guy miss, and pick up a first down. I don't think Benny has that ability, while Woody has shown it quite a few times in his brief time in NE.

By definition, BB discards definitions. Anyway.....

Currently, we have a season loss at 3rd down back (Faulk on IR, and could he/will he/do we welcome his/ return?); a real potential of the same next season (Faulk retires; we rely on Woodhead, who gets injured {my postulation based on size vs. durability: an opinion}).
What I mean is, let's toss aside current definitions:
I'm currently re-watching (living in the past, I am) Jest at Pats of last November (45-3 game for many of us LOL). Woodhead had a good game; LawFirm did too. Long story short, I'd rather have BJGE in there on 4th and goal than Woodhead. Blocking by LawFirm was better by miles, too, if that matters.

 

[BPF]

BJGE does not have the hands or shiftiness required to be a 3rd down back. Woody is a perfect 3rd down back for many reasons. He can also line up in the slot when motioned for empty and is a legit threat due to playing WR.

I wouldn't mind another explosive back but I think BJGE and Woody current roles are perfect for their strengths as players.

 

[Lurks_All_Day]

BJGE does not have the hands or shiftiness required to be a 3rd down back. Woody is a perfect 3rd down back for many reasons. He can also line up in the slot when motioned for empty and is a legit threat due to playing WR.

I wouldn't mind another explosive back but I think BJGE and Woody current roles are perfect for their strengths as players.

I'm far from a football expert, but what is it about "never fumbled" that excludes one from the club of "the hands"?
Not sure,
Please expound.

 

[mgteich]

You would bascially cut Woodhead and have Green-Ellis as our 3rd down back.

This is the worst idea I've seen in awhile. Woodhead ins the perfect replacment for Faulk.

Your analysis discusses that Green-Ellis is a better 4th and 1 option than Woodhead. I agree. But that jsut means that you think that Green-Ellis is our best 4th down back (better than Woodhead or Morris). This could be true.

You implication is that Green-Ellis is not good enough to be our 1st down back or even good enough to share that role. It is here that I strongly disagree. Green-Ellis is good enough to be or Antowain Smith as long as he is here. He is also good enough to share the running back role with another back, whoever belichick chooses as the replacement for Taylor. Personally, I find it unlikely that this replacement will be a draftee.

 

[MaineMan]

I'm far from a football expert, but what is it about "never fumbled" that excludes one from the club of "the hands"?
Not sure,
Please expound.

"Hands" in this instance is referring to pass-catching ability only - a critical quality in a classic "3rd down back." What you appear to mostly be talking about is a power/short-yardage back, for which BGE is perfectly suited - much more than Woody.

Seems to me that most people think of a "3rd-down back" as a guy for 3rd and 5+ who is primarily a pass-catcher, but who can also occasionally get around the corner or take the hand-off straight up the middle - IOW, a guy to keep the defense guessing.

 

[Deus Irae]

I'm far from a football expert, but what is it about "never fumbled" that excludes one from the club of "the hands"?
Not sure,
Please expound.

3rd down backs are receiving backs who can pick up the blitz. Which of those skills do you think BJGE has as a strength?


BJGE is a rotational back. He's not a 3rd down back, and he doesn't belong as the team's starting RB1. He's a depth guy.

 

[jeffbiologist]

What kind of person goes into the draft worried about what their 3rd down back will be like 5 years down the line?? I think we can say we have 3rd down covered for RBs, now lets get someone that can play 1st and 2nd down for a few years.....

 

[jsull87]

By definition, BB discards definitions. Anyway.....

Currently, we have a season loss at 3rd down back (Faulk on IR, and could he/will he/do we welcome his/ return?); a real potential of the same next season (Faulk retires; we rely on Woodhead, who gets injured {my postulation based on size vs. durability: an opinion}).
What I mean is, let's toss aside current definitions:
I'm currently re-watching (living in the past, I am) Jest at Pats of last November (45-3 game for many of us LOL). Woodhead had a good game; LawFirm did too. Long story short, I'd rather have BJGE in there on 4th and goal than Woodhead. Blocking by LawFirm was better by miles, too, if that matters.

by definition he would discard your definition then. Endless loop.

BJGE is a good back and could do the job as a 3rd down back... woodhead can and has done a better job as the 3rd down back and i see no reaosn for this to change other than because the season's over he is out of site and out of mind.

The size thing has been used as an excuse but until he gets injured (maroney was way bigger had less production and is injured more btw) then i am rooting for woody all the way just like i was rooting for BJGE before him. Both have been given their role and have flourished. I see no reason to change other than if it's your preference add a RB for the future to add a different dimension and spell BJGE but not because BJGE or Woody can't get it done because they showed last year they could.

 

[patsinthesnow]

Which back are you referring to as the elite guy you would draft?

 

[patchick]

Somehow Woodhead is widely perceived as just a "gimmick" or "good story." Try digging into the numbers and comparing his size, speed, quickness and production with the elite 3rd-down backs of the past decade. You'll find that in stature and athleticism he's a dead ringer for Leon Washington, and that the numbers he put up this season compare well with the best seasons of Washington, Darren Sproles, Kevin Faulk, etc. And unlike Green-Ellis, Woodhead already signed a contract extension. I think you can write his name in as 3rd-down back for the next few years.

 

[Seneschal2]

:ugh: Woody and Faulk are not 3rd down backs -- they're change-of-pace backs to employ on any down.

 

[IcyPatriot]

Benny can catch the ball ... but I doubt he will ever catch it as well as Woodhead. I like it the way it is - also drafting a RB somewhere this draft to add to the rotation.

 

[MaineMan]

View attachment 3539

:ugh: Woody and Faulk are not 3rd down backs -- they're change-of-pace backs to employ on any down.

Yeah. That, too. I think of "3rd-down back" and "change of pace back" pretty much interchangeably. Sloppy, perhaps, but . . . .

 

[convertedpatsfan]

Or am I wrong about size?

As patchick mentioned, the perception about Woody is wrong. As far as size goes, a quick comparison below.

Danny Woodhead: 5'7, 200 lb
Kevin Faulk: 5'8, 202 lb
Darren Sproles: 5'6, 181 lb
Leon Washington: 5'8, 203 lb
Reggie Bush: 6'0, 203 lb

 

[Off The Grid]

By definition, most 3rd down backs are undersized. That's why they are 3rd down backs and not starters. And I think a big part of being a 3rd down back is having that wiggle in the open field to catch a pass in the flat, make the first guy miss, and pick up a first down. I don't think Benny has that ability, while Woody has shown it quite a few times in his brief time in NE.

By definition, BB discards definitions. Anyway.....

Currently, we have a season loss at 3rd down back (Faulk on IR, and could he/will he/do we welcome his/ return?); a real potential of the same next season (Faulk retires; we rely on Woodhead, who gets injured {my postulation based on size vs. durability: an opinion}).
What I mean is, let's toss aside current definitions:
I'm currently re-watching (living in the past, I am) Jest at Pats of last November (45-3 game for many of us LOL). Woodhead had a good game; LawFirm did too. Long story short, I'd rather have BJGE in there on 4th and goal than Woodhead. Blocking by LawFirm was better by miles, too, if that matters.

I admire your disdain for definitions, and share it.

However, unless you're going to provide an entirely new Offensive Scheme that makes BenJarvus Green a better 3rd down option than Danny WoodHead ~ a Billion to One Proposition, my friend ~ then you're dead in the water.

I like Green, but he's a SLUG. The way that Line blocked for him, he should've had 5.0 Yards Per Carry.

And Danny WoodHead has the MAGIC.

I and others saw this guy coming a mile AWAY...And I predict that, a year from now, you and anyone who are still ~ unfathomably ~ selling him Short will be scrambling to try to erase your old posts.

Suggesting that Green is better than WoodHead on 3rd Downs is like saying Jaws 4: The Revenge is better than the original.

***

By the way: The guy you keep mentioning? ~ The Better Faulk ~ is 5'8".

And he sustained an high level of play for ELEVEN YEARS.

Whoops.

 

[meggett]

What kind of person goes into the draft worried about what their 3rd down back will be like 5 years down the line?? I think we can say we have 3rd down covered for RBs, now lets get someone that can play 1st and 2nd down for a few years.....

couldnt agree more...seems odd to think about our 3rd down back right now. not to mention all are RBs can be used on any down. Woodhead though is the perfect fit for what Kevin Faulk did. Hes got the speed, hands and passion that we need and i bet the Jets wish they saw. Would love a big time playmaker at RB, but they dont grown on trees.....hopefully Ingram hanging off a branch at #17...wishful thinking.

 

[ctpatsfan77]

couldnt agree more...seems odd to think about our 3rd down back right now. not to mention all are RBs can be used on any down. Woodhead though is the perfect fit for what Kevin Faulk did. Hes got the speed, hands and passion that we need and i bet the Jets wish they saw. Would love a big time playmaker at RB, but they dont grown on trees.....hopefully Ingram hanging off a branch at #17...wishful thinking.

That's what makes it so hilarious. . . . They DID see it, and cut him anyways. :singing:

 

[Box_O_Rocks]

Green-Ellis or Woodhead or Faulk = Running Back.