Most Overrated - Our Wide Receivers

[mgteich]

Brady was the best player in the nfl in 2010. He could win with almost any set of receivers, as he has shown in the past. Two of his most dependable receivers were tight ends - Good thing that!

Unfortunately, the jets figured this out. They simply covered our wide receivers one on one and used the extra defenders inside. We then needed to play much better htan we did to win.

However, we were exposed.

 

[patsinthesnow]

Mike Wallace FTW.

 

[Sciz]

Which helps show what I've been saying all offseason... Welker is not an ideal starting outside receiver.

I do think this is a position that will be improved more by maturation of the young WRs than addition of new players. Tate just finished his 1st season on the field. Price has had a season to learn the mental aspects of the game. Edelman has been playing WR for literally two seasons. They will improve.

 

[MassPats38]

Has anyone given high ratings to the wide receiver corps? Other than Welker, I didn't hear many accolades heaped on that unit. You have to be given ratings above competent to be called overrated. I expect most would consider them competent, with Brady knowing how to find them in patterns, and nobody would call that group lousy if they have a clue to make them overrated.

And I would argue the Jets didn't figure anything out. Brady threw a bad pass and multiple receivers (including a TE) caught an uncharacteristic case of the drops that left at least 2 early TDs off the board. The most talented receivers in the NFL would not have changed the outcome of the game if they drop those passes.

I agree Brady runs the offense, and is well deserving of the praise he gets. I also suspect the Jets secondary is among the best in the NFL, and few others have the personnel to attempt that defense with any success. Even then, it comes down to execution in one-on-one match-ups and the Pats just didn't execute that day.

 

[cavtroop]

Unfortunately, the jets figured this out. They simply covered our wide receivers one on one and used the extra defenders inside. We then needed to play much better htan we did to win.

Any team that is successful dropping 7 into coverage, and getting pressure with 4 (say, 5 sacks), will win more games than they lose. That's our weakness right there.

The 'cure' for this, is quick screens and draw plays, but after the early int on the screen, they got away from that and let the Jets dictate the game.

Back on topic, very very few WR corps in the league will have a decent day against 7 defenders all day long.

 

[Deus Irae]

I don't think that the receivers are overrated, because I don't think they are rated very highly. Most people I know felt that it was Brady who was responsible for the excellence of the offense during the season, not the receivers. It was mostly on this site (and on Felger/Mazz) that people were really pimping the corps as being anything but what it was, which was the best slot WR in the game teamed with a bunch of guys who'd be WR3s or lower on most other teams.

 

[sevengables_2207]

I don't think that the receivers are overrated, because I don't think they are rated very highly. Most people I know felt that it was Brady who was responsible for the excellence of the offense during the season, not the receivers. It was mostly on this site (and on Felger/Mazz) that people were really pimping the corps as being anything but what it was, which was the best slot WR in the game teamed with a bunch of guys who'd be WR3s or lower on most other teams.

Agree to a certain extent. As another poster pointed out earlier, this receiving corps (outside of Wes and Deion) is still young and inexperienced. I expect some maturation to continue and a few of the young guys to rise above the "WR3" level.

 

[West Philly Patriot]

Which helps show what I've been saying all offseason... Welker is not an ideal starting outside receiver.

I do think this is a position that will be improved more by maturation of the young WRs than addition of new players. Tate just finished his 1st season on the field. Price has had a season to learn the mental aspects of the game. Edelman has been playing WR for literally two seasons. They will improve.

The only question would be how long are we willing to wait for said masturation. We have an aging brady who has a 3-4 year window of continued dominace at best imho.

I don't think that the receivers are overrated, because I don't think they are rated very highly. Most people I know felt that it was Brady who was responsible for the excellence of the offense during the season, not the receivers. It was mostly on this site (and on Felger/Mazz) that people were really pimping the corps as being anything but what it was, which was the best slot WR in the game teamed with a bunch of guys who'd be WR3s or lower on most other teams.

I agree completly. Being outside of the NE area, whenever i discussed the pats this season people told me they marveled at brady's ability to still get it done with less. Guys he makes look like all-pro's. I think branch's knowledge of the offense, and his report with brady helped him out BIG time this season.

 

[Ring 6]

Brady was the best player in the nfl in 2010. He could win with almost any set of receivers, as he has shown in the past. Two of his most dependable receivers were tight ends - Good thing that!

Unfortunately, the jets figured this out. They simply covered our wide receivers one on one and used the extra defenders inside. We then needed to play much better htan we did to win.

However, we were exposed.

The Jets played a good game. They had a game plan that did a great job stopping what we had done successfully all season long, including agains them.
One team in one game invoking a good game plan and executing it well to limit a great offense is not figuring out how to stop a group of personnel permanently.
If every time an offense was stopped, or limited to 299 yards and 20 points, that offense was 'figured out' and had to change personell there would be no such thing as a good NFL offense.

 

[TheComeback]

Brady was the one who got exposed in the playoffs. More correctly, he played like ****. Our receivers were getting open, he just didn't make enough reads. You don't have the kind of success we did 9 or 10 games in a row and all of sudden get "exposed" in one contest. There's more to it than our group of WRs being "overrated," which is an interesting statement, since I don't think anyone touted the WRs all that highly during the regular season.

 

[sevengables_2207]

Brady was the one who got exposed in the playoffs. More correctly, he played like ****. Our receivers were getting open, he just didn't make enough reads. You don't have the kind of success we did 9 or 10 games in a row and all of sudden get "exposed" in one contest. There's more to it than our group of WRs being "overrated," which is an interesting statement, since I don't think anyone touted the WRs all that highly during the regular season.

Don't agree with Brady getting "exposed" as much as an inability on his behalf to shake a bad INT early on and getting hit to the tune of five sacks contributing to his struggles. From what I have read over the years, this is on of the ways to beat the best pocket quarterbacks (Brady included): capitalize on uncharacteristic mistakes and get consistent pressure with 3-5 pass rushers.

 

[RhodyPatriot]

Brady was the best player in the nfl in 2010. He could win with almost any set of receivers, as he has shown in the past. Two of his most dependable receivers were tight ends - Good thing that!

Unfortunately, the jets figured this out. They simply covered our wide receivers one on one and used the extra defenders inside. We then needed to play much better htan we did to win.

However, we were exposed.

The Patriots never attempted to exploit the mismatches they had. Jets had no one who could cover 6'6" Gronk yet they never sought to exploit him. They also never made it a point to exploit Cromartie. Who'sYourDaddy struggles against smurf receivers yet they never made it a point to target Cromartie. The QB AND OC were awful. They adjusted to NOTHING the Jets were doing. If you deduct Brady's stats on those 1st 2 drives in the 1st qtr and the TD drive in the 4th the numbers he put up for the remaining 2 + qtrs were downright pathetic. I blame the receivers for their dropped passes but I don't blame them for their overall lack of production. That's on the QB and OC.

 

[sevengables_2207]

The Patriots never attempted to exploit the mismatches they had. Jets had no one who could cover 6'6" Gronk yet they never sought to exploit him. They also never made it a point to exploit Cromartie. Who'sYourDaddy struggles against smurf receivers yet they never made it a point to target Cromartie. The QB AND OC were awful. They adjusted to NOTHING the Jets were doing. If you deduct Brady's stats on those 1st 2 drives in the 1st qtr and the TD drive in the 4th the numbers he put up for the remaining 2 + qtrs were downright pathetic. I blame the receivers for their dropped passes but I don't blame them for their overall lack of production. That's on the QB and OC.

The failure to elicit more than 3 points from those first two drives was a killer... as was the botched fake punt and the bad defensive series following the 2 pt conversion that cut the lead to 3.

 

[mgteich]

OK, I get it. Our wide receivers are not overrated because no one thought that that they were anything but adequate in the first place.

An over-the-hill player was able to come in and establish himself as our #1 go-to wide out down field. Another would have played the other side, but his body just gave out before the season started.

So, we all agree. And most of us will drink the koolaid once the season starts. But, for now, we have a pretty poor set of wideouts. As with running backs, I like to separate the position into two positions, in this case, slot receiver and wide receiver.

SLOT RECEIVER
We are in fine shape with the best starter in the nfl in WELKER and a strong backup in EDELMAN. These two positions are set for the year.

WIDE RECEIVER
Is this not a critical position when considering the potential production of a passing team?

BRANCH is the leader for the next 2 years.
TATE is our kick returner
PRICE

Do these three scare anyone?
This is the weakness of our offense (yes our #1 offense has a weakness)

 

[mgteich]

The myth is that Brady was under constant pressure and didn't have time to pass. Brady had lots and lots of time.

Don't agree with Brady getting "exposed" as much as an inability on his behalf to shake a bad INT early on and getting hit to the tune of five sacks contributing to his struggles. From what I have read over the years, this is on of the ways to beat the best pocket quarterbacks (Brady included): capitalize on uncharacteristic mistakes and get consistent pressure with 3-5 pass rushers.

 

[sevengables_2207]

OK, I get it. Our wide receivers are not overrated because no one thought that that they were anything but adequate in the first place.

An over-the-hill player was able to come in and establish himself as our #1 go-to wide out down field. Another would have played the other side, but his body just gave out before the season started.

So, we all agree. And most of us will drink the koolaid once the season starts. But, for now, we have a pretty poor set of wideouts. As with running backs, I like to separate the position into two positions, in this case, slot receiver and wide receiver.

SLOT RECEIVER
We are in fine shape with the best starter in the nfl in WELKER and a strong backup in EDELMAN. These two positions are set for the year.

WIDE RECEIVER
Is this not a critical position when considering the potential production of a passing team?

BRANCH is the leader for the next 2 years.
TATE is our kick returner
PRICE

Do these three scare anyone?
This is the weakness of our offense (yes our #1 offense has a weakness)

In fairness to your point, I think that it is not a given that the youngsters will progress, so as of right now there is a need for more talent to the wide receiver corps. I can envision the team either addressing this in the draft and/or FA (if there is one).

 

[patsinthesnow]

OK, I get it. Our wide receivers are not overrated because no one thought that that they were anything but adequate in the first place.

An over-the-hill player was able to come in and establish himself as our #1 go-to wide out down field. Another would have played the other side, but his body just gave out before the season started.

So, we all agree. And most of us will drink the koolaid once the season starts. But, for now, we have a pretty poor set of wideouts. As with running backs, I like to separate the position into two positions, in this case, slot receiver and wide receiver.

SLOT RECEIVER
We are in fine shape with the best starter in the nfl in WELKER and a strong backup in EDELMAN. These two positions are set for the year.

WIDE RECEIVER
Is this not a critical position when considering the potential production of a passing team?

BRANCH is the leader for the next 2 years.
TATE is our kick returner
PRICE

Do these three scare anyone?
This is the weakness of our offense (yes our #1 offense has a weakness)

The key is Price. He needs to hop Tate and get on the field.

 

[mgteich]

With no additions, I agree that the key is Price. However, consider where we are if Branch were to be out for a game or two.

We tried to add a veteran last year by bringing in Patten and Holt. We need to do better.

The key is Price. He needs to hop Tate and get on the field.

 

[Deus Irae]

OK, I get it. Our wide receivers are not overrated because no one thought that that they were anything but adequate in the first place.

An over-the-hill player was able to come in and establish himself as our #1 go-to wide out down field. Another would have played the other side, but his body just gave out before the season started.

So, we all agree. And most of us will drink the koolaid once the season starts. But, for now, we have a pretty poor set of wideouts. As with running backs, I like to separate the position into two positions, in this case, slot receiver and wide receiver.

SLOT RECEIVER
We are in fine shape with the best starter in the nfl in WELKER and a strong backup in EDELMAN. These two positions are set for the year.

WIDE RECEIVER
Is this not a critical position when considering the potential production of a passing team?

BRANCH is the leader for the next 2 years.
TATE is our kick returner
PRICE

Do these three scare anyone?
This is the weakness of our offense (yes our #1 offense has a weakness)

Now you're making a different, and more accurate, assertion. The receiver corps, on the outside, is in need of upgrade.

For the most part, even the homers who were insisting that all was peaches and cream during the year have come around to the reality that the Patriots had issues that were being covered up by Brady's phenomenal play. A cross section of the "Priorities" threads shows a pretty uniform understanding of what the team's needs are going forward.

Very few people argue against

OT - replacing/re-signing Light
OG - replacing/re-signing Mankins
OG - replacing/augmenting Neal
DE - finding a way to replace at least a fair portion of what Seymour produced
OLB - Finding a player who's at least adequate at setting the edge and holding up against the run, while being more than adequate at rushing the passer

There's also widespread agreement that the RB position needs to be addressed, possibly with multiple players. The only real difference there seems to revolve around the desired role of BJGE as the #1 RB or lower.

There's a bit less consensus on WR, but it's still got a fair amount of agreement. On this site, among my general acquaintance and in the media, most people see the need for either a deep/speed receiver or a big/possession guy.


That group is, by and large, what is seen as the top needs for the team moving forward to next season.

 

[mgteich]

I agree with your consensus on priorities (you mention 7) with the following 2 additions which have more to do with the future than with the 2011 season. 9 is NOT a huge number of priorities for an offseason, given that we have a 14-3 team with only 2 major players potentially as unrestricted free agents, 3 major players returning from IR (Warren, Bodden and Kaczur), and only a couple of players near retirement (Faulk and Neal).

OC - drafting a potential 2012 starter
S - drafting a potential 2012 major contributer or starter

Now you're making a different, and more accurate, assertion. The receiver corps, on the outside, is in need of upgrade.

For the most part, even the homers who were insisting that all was peaches and cream during the year have come around to the reality that the Patriots had issues that were being covered up by Brady's phenomenal play. A cross section of the "Priorities" threads shows a pretty uniform understanding of what the team's needs are going forward.

Very few people argue against

OT - replacing/re-signing Light
OG - replacing/re-signing Mankins
OG - replacing/augmenting Neal
DE - finding a way to replace at least a fair portion of what Seymour produced
OLB - Finding a player who's at least adequate at setting the edge and holding up against the run, while being more than adequate at rushing the passer

There's also widespread agreement that the RB position needs to be addressed, possibly with multiple players. The only real difference there seems to revolve around the desired role of BJGE as the #1 RB or lower.

There's a bit less consensus on WR, but it's still got a fair amount of agreement. On this site, among my general acquaintance and in the media, most people see the need for either a deep/speed receiver or a big/possession guy.


That group is, by and large, what is seen as the top needs for the team moving forward to next season.