* Top 64: What Are Your First 4 Picks?? *

[Off The Grid]

I think it was a case of not being any premium players on board at 5. The guys picked after Sanchez were; D H Bey, E.Monroe, BJ Raji, M. Crabtree, A. Maybin, K.Moreno, B.Orakpo, M. Jenkins, B. Cushing. Some good prospects at the time. But, nobody who jumped off of the page at you.

I think a couple of factors could help us if we want to deal down. I don't think there are any good QB prospects after Locker.

* And honestly, I don't think Locker is a great prospect. But,, he's a qb. And, a lot of these draftniks guys think he is. I think the timing is really good for a trade with Seattle.

* There are teams picking between us and them in my scenario that would take Locker. So, if they want him. They have to pay the piper.

Excellent points.

The way things are shaking out, I am actually of a mind that we'll be able to trade down at LEAST once, AND get our guy.

Indeed, I'm finally just about done with V2.0, incorporating just that scenario.

 

[Off The Grid]

Re: * Top 64: What Are Your First 4 Picks?? * 2.0

Ideally:

early 1st rounder: DE Marcell Dareus



- 3-4 DE is the biggest need on the team right now, and Dareus offers the most potential out of all the 3-4 DE prospects. Dareus and Wilfork up front has the potential to anchor an elite 3-4 defense like Aaron Smith and Casey Hampton do.

late 1st rounder: OT Joseph Barksdale



I know left tackle is Vollmer's true position, but he's been really good at right tackle so far and if they moved Vollmer back to left tackle they'd still need a replacement to avoid starting Kazcur. Barksdale is the most athletic left tackle in the draft and has great technique and can keep a low pad level, he'd get more attention if Jordan Jefferson wasn't a bumbling idiot with no pocket presence whatsoever.

early 2nd rounder: Flanker (OLB) Akeem Ayers



He's not a complete 3-4 OLB yet but he has decent size and sets the edge well against the run, and he isn't bad in coverage. His pass rushing needs work but they have TBC for obvious passing downs.

late 2nd rounder: WR Devier Posey



A great value here for a receiver who'd be a borderline 1st round pick any other year when the draft wasn't loaded with receiving prospects. He put up good numbers last year even with Terrell Pryor's inconsistent passing.

pick 3A: C Kristofer O'Dowd



Potential/eventual replacement for Koppen.

pick 3B: FS Will Hill



insurance/depth if Meriweather never snaps out of it/ultimate replacement if they let Meriweather go.

Great, detailed analysis, Brother PatsFan. Solid Arguments for each one.

 

[ctpatsfan77]

Did the Browns discount the #5, because of the bloated Rookie Salary factor?

That, and Ratgini is an idiot who still has it hard for the JEST.

 

[Off The Grid]

That, and Ratgini is an idiot who still has it hard for the JEST.

Hah! You may be right, about that!!

 

[reflexblue]

Re: * Top 64: What Are Your First 4 Picks?? * 2.0

But my own philosophical approach will be to focus on the Front 7, as I am absolutely convinced that the impact of a player on a Defense's Fortunes is directly proportional to his proximity to the QuarterBack, when the ball is snapped.

:rocker: Preach brother grid, Preach. Tell It, Tell It like it Is. I like the way you think, i'm going to have to keep an eye on you.

 

[Off The Grid]

Re: * Top 64: What Are Your First 4 Picks?? * 2.0

:rocker: Preach brother grid, Preach. Tell It, Tell It like it Is. I like the way you think, i'm going to have to keep an eye on you.

Great MINDS, Brother Blue.

Great MINDS.

 

[ZoisKing]

I'm thinking something like:

1a) As the fortunes of the Raiders improve (they shouldn't be winning any game by 40 points...), the chance of getting an excellent pick, or increasing our trading opportunities decrease. I expect somewhere around the 8th to 10th pick-Peterson would be the guy if available.

1b) As much as I want a pass rush, I also want to see Brady staying clean. Best OT prospect would be the pick. Too early to tell-Sherrod might be the answer come draft time.

2a) The offensive line could look awful after the season-Light is a FA, Neal spoke of retiring, Mankins wants nothing to do with us, Koppen has looked rough so far, etc. That's the entire line in question minus Vollmer! Therefore-Pouncey.

2b) How many hairs will be pulled if we don't go defensive line or pass rush till late 2nd for a 2nd consecutive year? I expect more of the same, but expect value picks-Herzlich/Romeus-to be available due to health concerns. Both were blue chippers before their injuries. My pick-Romeus.

3a) Taking another OL would seem to be overkill, but the line's depth and future is suspect. Koppen is overmatched consistently. Time for some new blood-Kris O' Dowd.

3b) Some mocks have us going for a smallish type like Broyles, but I can't see taking a similar type to what we already have (Tate/Price). Losing Moss limits our downfield opportunities and takes away from what was an offense with threats at every level. I love size and downfield ability, therefore-Terrence Toliver.

4) I spoke earlier about getting an opportunity to get a value pick at OLB late in the second, and chose Romeus over Herzlich. Herzlich hasn't played to the level he was capable of prior to his issues with cancer. He has good measurables and plays the pass very effectively. He also has the talent and skill set to play inside and out. In the 4th round? You bet-Herzlich.

Not a bad haul for one class. We'd be relying on injured guys to strengthen our OLB spot, but they could be huge risk/reward bargains.

The only position not touched was RB, but luckily the FA pool has some good talent there.

 

[RIP#40]

#8 ~ Right Flanker Robert Quinn ~ Tar Heels ~ 6.5/270



#32 ~ Center Mike Pouncey ~ Gators ~ 6.5/312




#40 ~ Right End Christian Ballard ~ HawkEyes ~ 6.4/300



#64 ~ Right Tackle Gabe Carimi ~ Badgers ~ 6.7/320



***

Front Wall

LT Sebastian Vollmer ~ Ascending Star
LG Logan Mankins ~ Resurgent Star
C Mike Pouncey ~ Future Star
RG Steve Neal
RT Gabe Carimi ~ Future Star

ST Steve Maneri
SG Dan Connolly
C Dan Koppen
SG Nick Kaczur
ST Mark LeVoir

Front 7

LE Ron Brace ~ Ascending Stud
NT Vince Wilfork ~ Star
RE Christian Ballard ~ Future Star

DE Ty Warren ~ Stud
DE Brandon Deaderick ~ Ascending Stud
DT Myron Pryor
DT Kyle Love
DL Kade Weston

LF Jermaine Cunningham ~ Ascending Stud
MB Brandon Spikes ~ Ascending Star
TB Jerod Mayo ~ Ascending Stud
RF Robert Quinn ~ Future Star

SF Tully Cain
SF Rob Ninkovich
MB Tyrone McKenzie
TB Gary Guyton

Secondary

SS Pat Chung ~ Ascending Star
FS Brandon Meriweather ~ Ascending Star
CB Devin McCourty ~ Ascending Star
CB Leigh Bodden ~ Stud
CB Darius Butler ~ Ascending Star

CB Terrence Wheatley
CB Jon Wihlite
SS Jarrad Page
FS James Sanders

***

We have hauled in an OCEAN of Ascending Talent, the last 2 years!! All we'd need to do is spend a 3rd and a 4th on a couple of TailBacks, and this team would be absolutely LOADED!!

Right FLANKER. Never heard that term used on the defensive side of the ball, is it starting to be used?

 

[Taxed in Maine]

I'm thinking something like:

1a) As the fortunes of the Raiders improve (they shouldn't be winning any game by 40 points...), the chance of getting an excellent pick, or increasing our trading opportunities decrease. I expect somewhere around the 8th to 10th pick-Peterson would be the guy if available. Agree until you said Peterson, I can't imagine them going CB that early. I Foresee a DE or a Trade.

1b) As much as I want a pass rush, I also want to see Brady staying clean. Best OT prospect would be the pick. Too early to tell-Sherrod might be the answer come draft time. This I can agree with, Vollmer to LT & A RT of the future.

2a) The offensive line could look awful after the season-Light is a FA, Neal spoke of retiring, Mankins wants nothing to do with us, Koppen has looked rough so far, etc. That's the entire line in question minus Vollmer! Therefore-Pouncey. They need a RB, this may be an ideal spot to get a guy tumbling down the board that could really help. Kaczur to LG and Connolly to RG.

2b) How many hairs will be pulled if we don't go defensive line or pass rush till late 2nd for a 2nd consecutive year? I expect more of the same, but expect value picks-Herzlich/Romeus-to be available due to health concerns. Both were blue chippers before their injuries. My pick-Romeus. Romeus is a 4-3 DE all the way, no way he is an OLB, and 20 lbs to light to be a 34DE in our scheme. When was the last time they drafted a 6'5 270+ lb DE. Pete Carroll in a 4-3??

3a) Taking another OL would seem to be overkill, but the line's depth and future is suspect. Koppen is overmatched consistently. Time for some new blood-Kris O' Dowd. I could see this pick but the only thing is his injury history?? and at 6'5 can he get he get leverage on a NT?? I have been watching Zane Taylor- Utah, 6'2- 310, maybe a 4th rounder.

3b) Some mocks have us going for a smallish type like Broyles, but I can't see taking a similar type to what we already have (Tate/Price). Losing Moss limits our downfield opportunities and takes away from what was an offense with threats at every level. I love size and downfield ability, therefore-Terrence Toliver. I could see that type of pick, wouldn't rule it out, but who does he move off the roster? Welker-Branch-Tate-Edelman-Price-and Slater.

4) I spoke earlier about getting an opportunity to get a value pick at OLB late in the second, and chose Romeus over Herzlich. Herzlich hasn't played to the level he was capable of prior to his issues with cancer. He has good measurables and plays the pass very effectively. He also has the talent and skill set to play inside and out. In the 4th round? You bet-Herzlich. Can't imagine Herzlich falling that far. If he did it would be a major steal. This is where am looking for an OC, another RB, or a FS

Not a bad haul for one class. We'd be relying on injured guys to strengthen our OLB spot, but they could be huge risk/reward bargains.

The only position not touched was RB, but luckily the FA pool has some good talent there.

My Thoughts..

 

[Taxed in Maine]

Right FLANKER. Never heard that term used on the defensive side of the ball, is it starting to be used?

I know our friend OTG must have played too much rugby or something. As I have only heard of a Flanker as a slot receiver type. You'll get used to it after a while.

 

[ZoisKing]

1a) Going CB this early means that we are focusing on limiting the opportunities of team's passing on us in any capacity. PP is a lockdown guy with nice size for his position. He's been getting Heisman hype because of his dominance. He might seem like a luxury pick, but passing him up when star CBs are few and far between would be a mistake. He's a much better prospect than Joe Haden was and would be a pick you couldn't find too much fault with.

2a) I placed more value on dominant linemen than on RBs. I too see the need for a RB, but would like to take my chances with next year's FA options.

2b) I wouldn't project Romeus as an end for us, my selection of him would be purely OLB. I'm surprised by your adamant reply that he isn't an OLB. He certainly has the size BB looks for (the prototype actually) and has shown the ability to get to the QB. Issues with passing? He could learn the trade or be swapped out with Herzlich for passing downs.

3a) Those are legitimate questions. I chose him based on his current status as one of the best Cs available. Hudson could be an alternate and has played a variety of line positions. He'd be a closer to the ground alternative.

3b) Welker, Branch, and Tate are firm locks at WR for us. Edelman showed promise, but Woodhead could play his role and others could as well. Slater is ST. Price is an unknown and looked a little soft in the time I saw him. The 6'5" Toliver is a big downfield threat without peer on this team.

4a) Herzlich hasn't been playing anywhere close to his recent performance before cancer. His injuries and his play could cause him to fall anywhere in the draft realistically. I think he just needs time. Another late round score for the Pats!

 

[Taxed in Maine]

1a) Going CB this early means that we are focusing on limiting the opportunities of team's passing on us in any capacity. PP is a lockdown guy with nice size for his position. He's been getting Heisman hype because of his dominance. He might seem like a luxury pick, but passing him up when star CBs are few and far between would be a mistake. He's a much better prospect than Joe Haden was and would be a pick you couldn't find too much fault with.

Not saying he would be a "throw the remote thru the TV pick". I am an INSIDE OUT guy. A stud DE helps the run D, the pass rush and coverage. Bodden will be back and McCourty on the other side with the best of the rest as the slot corner. Wilfork, our Pro-bowl NT is playing DE... because there is noone else. This is a serious indictment of the DE position. They need a 5-tech DE in the first 2-3 picks. preferably in the 1st if one is there.

2a) I placed more value on dominant linemen than on RBs. I too see the need for a RB, but would like to take my chances with next year's FA options.

I agree, but I think you are devaluing the entire OL too much. I don't even care about Mankins. Kaczur is an above average RT, but Vollmer is better. You don't think Kaczur could bee a damn good LG? Then Connolly can go to RG. Three OL in the first 3 rounds, while not getting a RB is ignoring a glaring hole at RB.

2b) I wouldn't project Romeus as an end for us, my selection of him would be purely OLB. I'm surprised by your adamant reply that he isn't an OLB. He certainly has the size BB looks for (the prototype actually) and has shown the ability to get to the QB. Issues with passing? He could learn the trade or be swapped out with Herzlich for passing downs.

Just don't understand where 6'5 - 270 is the 'prototype'. Crable is 6'5-250, Cunningham is 6'3-260, Ninko is 6'2-255, and TBC is 6'3 250. Last year Dunlap was everyones 'must have' OLB- 'prototype', NOT. He can't even get on the field for the Bungles. I wanted Koa Misi 6'3 - 252 , yeah, the kid starting for the dolphins in the same defense we run. I would start looking at an Akeem Ayers, Jeremy Beal, Sam Acho type OLB/DE. I will bet that the Romeus and Bowers type players will playing in a 4-3 next fall.

3a) Those are legitimate questions. I chose him based on his current status as one of the best Cs available. Hudson could be an alternate and has played a variety of line positions. He'd be a closer to the ground alternative.

3b) Welker, Branch, and Tate are firm locks at WR for us. Edelman showed promise, but Woodhead could play his role and others could as well. Slater is ST. Price is an unknown and looked a little soft in the time I saw him. The 6'5" Toliver is a big downfield threat without peer on this team.

4a) Herzlich hasn't been playing anywhere close to his recent performance before cancer. His injuries and his play could cause him to fall anywhere in the draft realistically. I think he just needs time. Another late round score for the Pats!

Not trying to nit-pick, just throwing out my opinions.

 

[TriplecHamp]

Here to revise my first four picks and it probably wont be the last time.:lol2:
1a (6-10)- Marcell Dareus
1b (28-32)- Jeremy Beal
2a (33-37)- Mike Pouncey
2b (61-64)- Will Hill
Sign Vincent Jackson

 

[jsull87]

I am really encouraged by the oakland pick this year for a couple of reasons. First of all alot of talent seems to lie in positions that we may need an upgrade in e.g DE OLB and CB

secondly teams that will probably be picking ahead of oakland have needs at positions that i don't think we would be trying to fill with a pick that early. So lets say san fran, cleveland, buffalo, carolina, detroit, tampa and the rams all pick before oakland. i can see 3 qb's and a wr being picked in those picks.e.g

1 buffalo - QB luck
2 carolina - WR (green)
3 cleveland - Best available or (QB Lockyer)
4 san fran - QB (lockyer/Mallet)
5 detroit - Best available (Peterson probably but they could go OL here)
6 st louis - WR (Jones, Baldwin e.t.c)
7 tampa - Best Available
8 Oakland -

You could really see how on our draft board we exclude the QB's and WR's (that early) we really would be getting a top 4 guy on our board if we don't trade down now that could be anyone out of (for me) Patrick Peterson, Quinn, Dareus, Clayborne, Bowers and that DT from auburn.

I just think that with our needs and looking at the teams that may finish with a worse record than oakland, we are in a great position to draft a guy of both value and need early

 

[Off The Grid]

Right FLANKER. Never heard that term used on the defensive side of the ball, is it starting to be used?

I know our friend OTG must have played too much rugby or something. As I have only heard of a Flanker as a slot receiver type. You'll get used to it after a while.

A perfect summary, sir.

Yeah, I've got a few quirks, I have.

My explanation: The term "Strong Side Out Side Line Backer" takes 473 years to say. And not only do I find it horrifically inefficient ~ I'm German ~ but I find any use of the term "Line Backer" incredibly unimaginative and even vaguely demeaning. "Line Backer"?? Really?? It says nothing at all about the role, itself. And it describes these guys as assistants to the Linemen, when in fact they have their own distinct, dramatic roles.

And don't get me started on this "Weak Side" business. "Free" works for Safety, why not for Flanker?

I prefer "MidFielder" for the...Middle guys. Yep, you guessed it, Brother Maine.

Plus..."Flanker" just sounds cool.

 

[ctpatsfan77]

A perfect summary, sir.

Yeah, I've got a few quirks, I have.

My explanation: The term "Strong Side Out Side Line Backer" takes 473 years to say. And not only do I find it horrifically inefficient ~ I'm German ~

There's a certain irony here (seeing as German loves to create longa** words).

 

[ZoisKing]

Not trying to nit-pick, just throwing out my opinions.

I'm not offended in the slightest.

I value the opinions of others even if I don't agree with them.

I look at a guy like Romeus and think prototype because the two OLBs I think of the most when I think of BB LBs are McGinest and Vrabel. Vrabel was smaller 6'4" 260 than McGinest 6'5" 270, but the size of both is more along the lines of what BBs prototype would be.

Our OLBs might be smaller currently, but that's more conducive to the lack of prototype guys available.

I'm an inside out guy too, but with my draft I only ignore RB and DL as needs. I stated my reasoning for RBs, but the DL is playing well right now and would look very good if a heat seeker was playing opposite Cunningham-enter Romeus.

So, even though I would love to have Dareus, or Fairley, or even Clayborn as an end, I'd like to see the draft play out as I have it listed and would expect amazing results.

Looking only at the defense, imagine the line staying the same with TW returning and Deaderick and Brace showing slight to moderate improvement. Then imagine Mayo and Spikes locking down the middle with Cunningham and Romeus supplying pressure with Herzlich capable of backing up inside and out. Finally, the secondary would be composed of Meriweather, Chung, McCourty, and Peterson! And that's leaving out a heap of contributors currently making plays for us. All three levels of the defense are super solid.

 

[ZoisKing]

I am really encouraged by the oakland pick this year for a couple of reasons. First of all alot of talent seems to lie in positions that we may need an upgrade in e.g DE OLB and CB

secondly teams that will probably be picking ahead of oakland have needs at positions that i don't think we would be trying to fill with a pick that early. So lets say san fran, cleveland, buffalo, carolina, detroit, tampa and the rams all pick before oakland. i can see 3 qb's and a wr being picked in those picks.e.g

1 buffalo - QB luck Agreed
2 carolina - WR (green) Agreed
3 cleveland - Best available or (QB Lockyer) I could see a DE here-Dareus
4 san fran - QB (lockyer/Mallet) Peterson could go here, it would be funny to have them draft Alex Smith 2 (Locker) here
5 detroit - Best available (Peterson probably but they could go OL here) Too bad there aren't any top ten guys this year, much less top five....currently that is
6 st louis - WR (Jones, Baldwin e.t.c) Tough call here
7 tampa - Best Available More DL-Clayborn
8 Oakland -

You could really see how on our draft board we exclude the QB's and WR's (that early) we really would be getting a top 4 guy on our board if we don't trade down now that could be anyone out of (for me) Patrick Peterson, Quinn, Dareus, Clayborne, Bowers and that DT from auburn.

I just think that with our needs and looking at the teams that may finish with a worse record than oakland, we are in a great position to draft a guy of both value and need early

You pretty much nailed it. I added a little perspective.

 

[Off The Grid]

A perfect summary, sir.

Yeah, I've got a few quirks, I have.

My explanation: The term "Strong Side Out Side Line Backer" takes 473 years to say. And not only do I find it horrifically inefficient ~ I'm German ~

There's a certain irony here (seeing as German loves to create longa** words).

What in the CaskAndFlagon are you talking about??

 

[Off The Grid]

I'm thinking something like:

1a) As the fortunes of the Raiders improve (they shouldn't be winning any game by 40 points...), the chance of getting an excellent pick, or increasing our trading opportunities decrease. I expect somewhere around the 8th to 10th pick-Peterson would be the guy if available.



1b) As much as I want a pass rush, I also want to see Brady staying clean. Best OT prospect would be the pick. Too early to tell-Sherrod might be the answer come draft time.



2a) The offensive line could look awful after the season-Light is a FA, Neal spoke of retiring, Mankins wants nothing to do with us, Koppen has looked rough so far, etc. That's the entire line in question minus Vollmer! Therefore-Pouncey.



2b) How many hairs will be pulled if we don't go defensive line or pass rush till late 2nd for a 2nd consecutive year? I expect more of the same, but expect value picks-Herzlich/Romeus-to be available due to health concerns. Both were blue chippers before their injuries. My pick-Romeus.



3a) Taking another OL would seem to be overkill, but the line's depth and future is suspect. Koppen is overmatched consistently. Time for some new blood-Kris O' Dowd.



3b) Some mocks have us going for a smallish type like Broyles, but I can't see taking a similar type to what we already have (Tate/Price). Losing Moss limits our downfield opportunities and takes away from what was an offense with threats at every level. I love size and downfield ability, therefore-Terrance Toliver.



4) I spoke earlier about getting an opportunity to get a value pick at OLB late in the second, and chose Romeus over Herzlich. Herzlich hasn't played to the level he was capable of prior to his issues with cancer. He has good measurables and plays the pass very effectively. He also has the talent and skill set to play inside and out. In the 4th round? You bet-Herzlich.



Not a bad haul for one class. We'd be relying on injured guys to strengthen our OLB spot, but they could be huge risk/reward bargains.

The only position not touched was RB, but luckily the FA pool has some good talent there.

Love it!! The first 5, and 6 of 7, are Defense and Front Wall!! NICE. :rocker: